fly_tornado Posted November 5, 2011 Share Posted November 5, 2011 If it ain't broke don't fix it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted November 5, 2011 Share Posted November 5, 2011 This is part of the problem with aviation, the old guys are a bit blind to the limitations of a lot of the technology. I can't explain why I have never had an electrical failure in a car or bike. I just don't understand the reluctance to embrace better ideas? FT with respect, the 'old guys' probably understand the limitations of the old technology better than the young guys and this one old guy understands very clearly the microprocessor concept. Aircraft require redundancy of systems, cars do NOT. Is it acceptable to you that losing DC power will shut down all systems and the fan stops, because that is what happens to all the wiz bang technology in a car? Consider the hundreds of Lycomings and Continentals that fall out of the sky due to carb ice every year. If that were true, it has nothing to do with the technology and everything to do with operator mismanagement. I have sat in aircraft as a passenger and watched the engine RPM begin to drop and slight rough running and the dumb arse pilot did nothing about it until I suggested he apply carburetor heat which was followed by a cough and splutter and a return to normal RPM. He did not appreciate my lecture on the subject and how he could have potentially killed us all if he had not recognised and rectified the icing conditions. That is all about lack of training and awareness and nothing to do with technology. Sure a microprocessor with sensors attached could detect ice in the induction system and apply a De-icing control, but the problem with that is when and if it failed, the pilot would not recognise the symptoms until too late and could not override the microprocessor of course unless there was a secondary manual control; and since he would not know the symptoms anymore because hypothetically by now all aircraft are fitted with auto engine de-icing, no one would be taught anymore about the management process. Or the dozens of Jabirus exhaust valves that implode due to detonation. Like comparing chalk with cheese comparing a Jab engine with either Continental or Lycoming. As I have said elsewhere, all reciprocating engines are dinosaurs, some just have more fancy technology added. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted November 5, 2011 Share Posted November 5, 2011 I love that you old guys make carburettor gaskets out of kangaroo leather and that you can fix a magneto with a pocket knife, some fencing wire and a flat surface. But I can't see it ever inspire any confidence in me to fly in the bush with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Some older carburetters do have leather parts and cork floats, and I have some where those original parts are still working 80 years later.. Whatever technology you use , it has to work. Seriously FT, we know we will never convince you, "because all you young guys worship technology for the sake of it" IF I made that statement I would be as guilty as you, of putting ALL of one particular group, in a category. The point is that when you assume ALL a perticular group behave in a particular manner or have certain fixed attitudes the YOU deem unacceptable , you have relegated all their opinions to the "not worth considering because...... ( insert your reason here)" basket. The advertising industry have for years been giving us all lots of reasons why the perfect car they sold you last year is SO inferior to the new model that you just have to get one, and virtually throw the other one away. Well somebody gets it but you lose a large amount of money. Not all progress is good. High tech stuff is obsolete inside 3 years and the rubbish tips of the world are filling up rapidly with this stuff that "can't be fixed". Most people accept this state of affairs without thinking, because it is the modern way. Profit before responsibility. How to dispose of the residue is the responsibility of the manufacturer in essence (though we are far from that ). Attitudes in any generation are formed by the experiences and propaganda of that era, and have an identifiable and often distinct, nature/ style.. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 What have you built, flown, clicked together, etc F_T, give us an inkling into your knowledge base? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 That applies to all of us here Tubs, but it takes a while and you may never get the complete picture and it may be erroneous. I have met many people on this forum in person, and having done that, I find in that almost universally they are true to the person I have met , when they post. If I have not met them, the picture is always one where there has to be some assumptions made, if you are going to make a judgement . I am always happy to reserve my judgement, particularly if it is tending adverse. I am quite happy if people disagree with me but all I ask is that ALL views can be aired dispassionately and in an atmosphere of fairness, and lack of bias. Like...... question the facts ( or lack of ) don't shoot the messenger. There HAS to be room for a whole range of views, but be prepared to have to defend what you post. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 FH: I have ridden Japanese motorcycles all my life. That is where I got into the thinking that "Hit the button and go" makes a lot more sense than tearing down the Ducati, just to check that the rings are still ok. Once upon a time aviation was the cutting edge of technology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 lol @ you "young guys worshipping technology!" go down to your local club, there are thousand of pensioners sitting zombie like in front of computers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 FH: I have ridden Japanese motorcycles all my life. That is where I got into the thinking that "Hit the button and go" makes a lot more sense than tearing down the Ducati, just to check that the rings are still ok.Once upon a time aviation was the cutting edge of technology. Fair enough answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 I just got a used MGL Ultra EFIS when I was in the US. I love how simple it is, 4 pairs of wires and 2 pressure tubes, it logs my flights, I can display alarms as a flashing LED (yes an LED) or as audio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 "Once upon a time aviation was the cutting edge of technology". quote All the major advances are in periods of wartime or related to defence. Progress is much slower at other times, where refinement design rectification/ consolidation, maintainance and cost elements have priority. Subsonic jet transport is no faster than it was 40 years ago. Just built lighter and weaker. Aviation in the early days was a place where 'Craftsmanship" featured strongly. Most people wouldn't know what that word meant. It requires individual skills. Nobody can handle that from a management perspective It was personal endeavour, adventure, pushing the boundaries of both man and machine. Metallurgy advanced a lot in the aviation world. Today the production of an aircraft or an engine can bankrupt a country if it fails. High stakes. Not a place for small players. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guernsey Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 lol @ you "young guys worshipping technology!" go down to your local club, there are thousand of pensioners sitting zombie like in front of computers. Not sure about the ' zombie like ' but I'm doing that right now. . Alaine le pensionaire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 I think our friend FT is having fun with us actually and getting the appropriate rise as well. Bit of a ratbag (term of endearment) me thinks ... LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guernsey Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Does FT then mean "Flying Teaser ' Alan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 I lament that your generation is the last one that know how to fix a leaking fuel bowl in a Stromberg updraft carby with a spent rifle cartridge, some gum nuts, 3" of leather shoe lace and teaspoon of tree sap. But there is a lot to be said for aircraft that just work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Sorry, just a piece of chewing gum. If you can find one that "just works" or invent one, let me know............but in the meantime we know that you don't know the chewing gum trick.........so you'll be grounded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza 38 Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza 38 Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 My feeling is that 1 tap per tank clearly marked on and off makes it pretty much idiot proof. How many times have of this sort of mistake getting made? That is a good point FT. With tecnams, I have about a 100 hours in 3 different models.With the low wingers, the fuel tap lever aligns with the centreline of the fuselage.Which is great.A quick glance down and you can see straight away which tap is turned on or off, or both on etc they are between the seats.With the High wingers.I have flown the P92 Super echo and the eaglett. The tap handle aligns with the front Pillar when in the On position.Where the front frame of the door recess's into. The reason I have quoted your post is because.I have never seen a On/Off placard on the different Teccys i have flown.3different Model of Tecnams.About 6 or seven different particular aircraft.Which to me means, They dont have On/off placards.Probably abit hard to attach.The low wingers, the taps are surrounded by Carpet.On the A pillar.Not much room for a sticker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Any Tecnam forced landings due to this omission? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza 38 Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Any Tecnam forced landings due to this omission? Probably not Turbz.It all comes down to knowing the Aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza 38 Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Anyway this thread has moved on from the original post.Since it has, I will talk about Mags,and pistons engines etc.If this is straying too much.(Mods)I will start another thread. Magnetos have been used for along time, as we all know. The thing is, Lycoming and Continental, are restricted to modifications on certified engines, because it costs alot of money to make changes and get the changes through certification.But Continental has a company called TMX.Which does experimental engines. Superior IMO make the best Lyc based engine. They have modified the heads, better flow.You can order E Mags, P mags(Electronic ignition)Fuel injection etc. The thing Im getting at is that there are companies who are willing to bolt on all the latest and greatest.But it has to be on a aircraft in the experimental category Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 I wonder how many pilots will admit to these sorts of events now that their stories can end up on the internet and go viral like this one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 They probably learn as much as we do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 Happens with lots of forums but this one seems particularly active that way. I found out by trying to find some info ( on SV Ford V8s ) and ended up reading stuff I had submitted myself..Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted November 6, 2011 Share Posted November 6, 2011 They probably learn as much as we do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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