justinjsinclair

Hi all, I have someone looking for some factory Jab 160 ( I suspect all J series are the same) adjustable ruder pedals. Has anyone got any hidden in a wreck or parts cupboard somewhere, Thanks Justin 0421061811

I completely agree and that’s the whole point. If you are looking at building or buying an aeroplane or thinking about learning to fly by all means use the web as it it’s a great tool. But please seek out qualified advice by a LAME, CFI or someone who has real world experience in or on the thing you are looking at. if someone tells you that something is a bad choice then that’s fine but you really should be asking for facts. Dont trust me either 👍 but I do own a Gen 4 powered Jab. Happy for anybody to fly it as well.

Hey Turbo, I guess the answer is that the new world of opinions not based on fact or backed up by fact on forums is nearly over. If any member wants to give their opinion, that is perfectly acceptable but it needs to be patently pointed out that it is a “ opinion” and not necessarily based on proven data. If members of this forum want to bag Jabiru based on poor data then they should be made accountable. If members of this forum want to hide behind a pseudonym and not stand up when questioned and be brought to account and provide data based on reliability they need to be accountable. There are many pilots and flying school owners out there that are doing it tough because some goose who has less than 3000 hours of instruction and has never owned or maintained a 24 reg or better aeroplane sprouts utter rubbish based on what they have read on the internet. I have just had a beer with a very good mate of mine, GA CFI, RAA instructor and A330/B737 management pilot. He has just paid $2000 aud for a hose kit for his 912. That’s probably ok in Rotax circles but a Jabiru hose kit including fire sleeve is $200.00. I love rotax’s. ( well maybe not given their history 39-45) but am thoroughly sick of internet warriors who can’t run LoP, can’t do a 1:60, can’t fly in CTA, can’t land in max crosswind , leave the cockpit a shit fight after use, can’t make a radio call and can’t use a whizz wheel. i guess it’s like this new age if STOL, what is the point if we fly into powerlines, 😫💁 because we are soy latte drinking city kids who can’t ride a horse, can’t strain a strainer post, can’t set a fox trap and certainly can’t do a good 3’ slope at full flap approach with half power at MLW with rear CoG into the western sun at dusk short of fuel. Without prejudice Justin

Yep, a new engine in a C152 just went 100k, and factory new one is 120k 😰 god knows what a GTSIO 421 or 404 is worth now ?.? makes a Gen4 at 20k or 30k and overhaul costs less than 10 k cheap. maybe ir time to revisit the twin Jabiru for IFR training too

Hi Deano, your quote is about correct, perhaps even a little dear. The 5-7k is for a Rotax turbo working hard at about 100hours a month. If the wings have to come off, EFIS ADSB cert, tyres, repairs and paint work the bill will be higher at the annual time. I wasn’t really having a go at LAME’s but just pointing out that RAA is starting to get close to GA rates at some of the schools. That’s not a reflection on anyone just a fact of life. That why I think the regional RAA school with a hardy composition airframe jabiru or rotax powered will do well. Having said that C150 annual is getting up there as well. Even a glider annual inspection starts at $1400.00 and it doesn’t have a donk. Justin

Hey KG, what an awesome post. In fact the Jab is nearly 50% cheaper 2200 vs low hp 912 if you add up all the costs in a mature way. SD doesn’t want to put the effort into obtaining the facts but that’s his or her choice. Don’t get me wrong, the Rotax is a wonderful bit of kit but now that we are up to $350 hr for a RAA aeroplane dual because the 100’/annual can be $5-7000.00 at LAME rates, I kind of feel a fleet of J160’s is still a great choice for a flying school, particularly if you have a L2 that can maintain the Jabs exactly as per the Jabiru Work pack. Given that Jabiru is so much cheaper inguess in that case we can probably accept a bit of bracket creep as Jabiru costs increase 😢. SD banging on about the top is also a odd thing given that nearly all air cooled engines need work at some stage once they go under that 75 hours per year, having said that the Gen 4 has nikasil bores and the head issues are gone I am betting that the Top overhaul requirement will move as well. as I said I don’t have a vested interest in Jab other than owning one and maintaining a couple, if anyone wants to pm or call me for further info fee free. Justin “who identifies as him” 😅

That’s ok, Skippy or what ever your real name is. Just like the spelling there is a valid reason for my questions/s If you can’t get a name spelt correctly and want to sprout anti Jabiru and pro Rotax sentiment that’s fine and it’s your right, just as it’s my right to point out that your (just like mine) opinions need to be treated with caution. i asked you on what basis and education you have to post on the subject. Have you built, maintained, flown either of these types. Simple question really ? So many look to these forums to guide them on potential purchases of all RAA style aircraft and that we should all be careful sprouting rubbish that is ill informed and frankly lazy. We need to be more positive, if someone wants to buy a Drifter, Metroliner or Primary glider we should encourage them and if we are going to poo poo their idea then we need to make sure we are not hiding behind some pseudonym, drinking almond soy lattes from our tesla on our way to another Microsoft flight sim session where we think a FW190 is easy to fly. (BTW not accusing you of fitting that mould] I know the costs of both Rotax and Jabiru (actually you can add Lycoming, Continental, P&W, Garrett, CFM and RR to that as well) and think both of them are fine engine’s and both have a place in our world. You are asking me to put in effort to answer questions that you don’t appear to want to put in the effort yourself to answer. If you want me to answer them I am happy to but you will need to pay, happy to invoice you incl GST. I have no vested interest in Jabiru other than they are a fine company that brings dollars into our country that we all need to pay for our Eectric vehicles, city slickers coffee and pensions. Jabiru Australia tare wonderfully passionate people, they are awesome to deal with and absolutely 100% reliable from a professional point of view. They own their product and employ many Australians. Why we as Aussie’s feel the need to tear them down is quite beyond me. I am so sick of the “Jabiru in the paddock joke” perhaps you might like to see where much of the European technology comes from, might be a nice history lesson for you. have a great week -Justin

Hey Skippy, the name is Justin. just out of interest have you ever owned an aeroplane ? Justin

It runs mid 3-320 in the green most of the time, on a long run at 5-7000 it’s probably a bit cool at 2850, circuits in 34’c still way below yellow. it interesting what you say about filters. Years ago when I ran a GC8 rally car we had issues with non Subaru oil filters. So we only ever used OEM, yes it was a pita to find them. That’s why I buy Jab ones. If it splits and it’s black with a jab sign on it then I have a valid argument. If it’s Ryco from my motor parts supplier I am I trouble. As an aside the oil runs too cool. I think this winter I will be blocking up 50% of the cooler. And yes I know we don’t get winter here in QLD 🤣

Hi Glen, I guess we need to compare like with like, I know you are well versed in Jabs 😅 and are Lucid, intelligent and a great thinker. I feel the Avgas point is a bit mute, Rotax’s hate Avgas due the gearbox bearings and other stuff so as a general rule where you find a Rotax you will find a ULP pump, commercial operators get a road tax rebate so that and the price of Avgas vs PULP pretty quickly pays for a fuel truck/ tank. I have seen Jabirus run on Avgas with no issues although I did hear of an odd batch of Avgas in SA that caused a few issues with lots of operators including big 520 and 550 engines. One J160 I look after has now 800 hours, always run on Avgas, always run hard and no issues so far. But I think you will find everyone agrees PULP is the go. Speaking to the Jabiru Engine shop, the oil pressure issues seem to be solved, every time I have a technical question the Jab team are awesome. They are patient, listen and always have a solution. As far as mechanical costs go I feel the Jabiru is way in front per hour. At the moment a Rotax goes for 2000hrs (assuming 80-100ho) and price is roughly 40k, a jabiru is 20k and needs a top at 1000. Current jabiru pricing is 2200 Engine Gen 4 ** Top End Overhaul from $5,200 ** Full Overhaul from $6,300 ** Bulk Strip from $6,300 **Does not include replacement of substantial items ie. crank, cam , conrods, cylinders and heads. Engines must still be running.. so in actual fact the Gen4 is cheaper to overhaul every 1000 hours by about $15,000. The new Jab warranty is a really good deal too. We all know the Rotax is awesome but man the parts prices are eye watering, to be honest I think they are not far off a 0235 cost now. Don’t forget hoses, radiators, dual carbs, oil, yadda yadda yadda. The jab only takes 2.2/lt of oil and the filters are 7-$16.00, the 2 yearly hose replacement is $10-100 depending if you want to us new fire sleeve. The plugs are cheap as well. Well all know the Jab airframe is awesome, sure it’s not as light to fly as some of the European stuff but its maintenance is essentially nil. Tyres, bolts, and that’s about it. What don’t understand I why we have people running old engines, older than your Mitsubishi Magna and we whinge about support. These people don’t ring the factory and rely on what written here on the internet. All jab engines maintained to spec and run to spec are a good thing, New heads are available now. I don’t know if anyone has tried to rebuild a new engine lately but just finding a 0235 cylinder is a miracle. I used to own a Cessna 402 which is for sale again. The aircraft with running engines is $90,000.00, it had $300,000 spent in it 600 hours ago and it needs another $400,000.00 spent in it now to make it legal to carry pax. Thats stuff is pricing 402’s above C441 conquests now 😫 I think there was even a reference to TBO’s being some made up factor to gain profit. 😬. I challenge any pilot here to fly NVFR SYD-CBR, MEL-LST, CNS- TSV or Adelaide - Ceduna on an engine with more than 20% over TBO. it’s amazing how your appetite for risk changes when it’s your arse in the seat at night when that engine gives a little cough 😰 It sounds like I am a Jabiru agent but I am not, I just worry that a new glider is now $600,000.00 a new RAAus rocket ship is $500,000 and a reasonable trainer is $2-400,000.00. How any flying school makes money is beyond me but if we don't support local then we will all end up the poorer. i would really like to sell my J160 Gen 4 to get a 230 with Gen 4 but the prices now reflect the appeal of the airframe. Justin

Having owned both LCH and Gen 4 so I feel there are a few things to point out. Treat everything written on line with absolute suspicion, believe no one and trust no one, including me 🤔, unless it’s written down in a RAA, CASA, ATSB report or on a Jabiru or Rotec letterhead don’t believe it. I find it absolutely criminal that both Jabiru and Rotec are small Aussie companies making awesome products and yet we as Aussies praise the stuff made in Europe (which by the way have just as many issues as everything else) and poo poo the local product. Then we all whinge about no Aussie made cars or products whilst not supporting Aussie products in the supermarket and complain about the price of Rotax stuff 💁. i have never had a bad experience with Jabiru or Rotec, if you write them an email with all the information that they require including part numbers, dimensions, Serial numbers just as you would any engineering parts supply company they will get back to you asap. If you ring on Friday arvo with no information in a bad mood you can hardly expect great service. The Gen 4 is really hard to beat, it’s an awesome engine. It’s currently in production and all the parts are available. I just ordered an annual inspection kit including four oil filters, plugs, oil hose plus clamps and fire sleeve. All up delivered the next day to Brisbane was under $400.00. Yes I could have hunted around supercheep and saved a few dollars but all of my parts come from the manufacturer with paperwork and are traceable if there is a problem. The parts team at Jabiru are fricken awesome. To get angry at them because you have a 15 year old engine that has not been maintained, installed and run as per the book seems a bit silly, btw I note that heads will soon be available again. Having said that nearly all parts for all the Gen engines are still available or an upgrade is still available. Yes a Gen 4 is now 20k but a Rotax is now nearly double that, a O235 can hit 100k installed and a Chieftain engine can now be 250k. I think it’s exciting that Jabiru are now working on fuel injection, I wouldn’t be surprised that the Gen4 2200 will now be a 2000 hour (no top) 100hp engine stock just with EFI. if you can afford it buy a Gen4, install it properly and maintain it properly and it should give you 2000hours of love. The Rotec kit is fricken cool, Paul and Tony are awesome to deal with but you need to remember you are moving into the experimental area. So just like Lotus 7 kit cars, racing skiffs and home built verandas you need to understand how to do stuff. Paul is still developing the kit and there is no doubt that it solves the head heat issues. You can fit the kit for less than the cost of top overhaul but whilst you are there you might as well put new pistons, rings and valves in. It will probably cit you 3-7k all up including paint but you will have a weapon of an aircraft. Having said that you will now need to be even more fastidious at annual time, hoses, clamps, mounting brackets, fibreglass, pumps, wiring and the rest make it more like a Rotax. I am not sure if Rotec have established a hose replacement time yet but that’s the sort of stuff you need to think about. 5 years might be a good start. A 3300 , EFI, a gearbox with Rotec should be a 200hp engine 😁 yeah baby ❤️ i guess it’s just like all these rotax’s running around at 3-4000 hours with no issues, sure there is luck involved but the truth is that some engineer in some dark corner of the office designed a brilliant engine and put a TBO on it, we as owners can ignore that in our private flying worlds but at what cost. The rumour grapevine says that there have been many Rotax issues lately both with new builds and old engines, are they true or is it online rubbish because my aunt Mildred’s book reading mate heard from the barmaid that a Cessna powered by a Rotax had an engine failure. anyway just my thoughts, Justin SP500, J160 gen4, heaps of other flying machines

Ian Linke in SA, has most moulds for gliders, lots of aircraft too Aviation Acrylic Mouldings 08 8251 3780 Contact company 16 Red Wattle Place, 5127 Wynn Vale, South Australia I have his mobile details if you pm me, he is the guru

Hi have 5 spare heads(well 11 if the LCH conversion goes well) here in Brisbane, 5 of them have about 500 hours with some recession and the other 6 have 125hrs also with a little recession pm me if you want - Justin.