cazza

Bubble boy and all, Natfly has always had a big team of people to organise it, including Ops, office staff, board members, temora council, temora aviation museum, on field residents, towns people, and member volunteers. It is a huge job and everyone works their b$& off for months. So if it doesn't work, the team relies on constructive feedback. Cazza

Great, now we are legal.

Hope we members can make a change for the better. Caz-

DWF, Your analysis of the problem and your suggestion for a solution is spot on. But the process was there and the relevant people just didn't do their job. The Secretary or approved RA-Aus delegate shall cause to be kept a register of initial aircraft registrations in addition to renewals and transfers of aircraft registrations and subsequent inspections (RA-Aus Ops Manual) the Technical Manager is responsible to the RA-Aus Executive for the overall control, supervision and discipline of the … technical requirements of the relevant CAR’s CASR’s CAO’s, legislation ( RA-Aus Ops Manual) to manage and oversee staff to control the RA-Aus pilot certificate and aircraft registration systems, (CEO Duty Statement, 2010) maintain official records and documents, as well as ensuring compliance with federal, state and local regulations; ( CEO Duty Statement 2010) Carol Richards (Cazza)

Those are two very different sets of circumstances, and so far I don't see anyone proposing that commercial interests should be given priority in the future. That's how I see it. Cazza

Brian, I really don't think that would happen in our organisation, if it was allowed to be a member oriented organisation like it started. The çommercial interests, are really what I would term as backyard industries. I haven't seen anyone get rich in recreational aviation. And Turboplanner, I don't think that was what Brian is about. That's the problem with this type of communication. YOu can't hear the voice, see the facial expressions and so you can misinterpret. Cazza

Brian, I understand your position and I don't disagree in the best of all worlds. A/c should be registered when they come due. But what happened is we were stopped from registering EVERYTHING and the registrations began to pile up and this went on for about a month. When the CASA man finally got there, can you imagine the mess? Where does one start? Staff didn't know what info was needed so each rego was examined, and info sent to people and there would have been piles of 1, ready to go when the CASA man looks at them, 2 needing more information, 3. Lost all their documentation, 4. Don't know what to do with these. In the midst of this (and I'm only surmising, but I bet its pretty close to the mark), we had, for example, Jabiru with 2 new a/c sitting on the lot for over a month, with employees being laid off just before Christmas, (possibly) what about their families? And I was told one of the Board members, said, "'tough". Let them wait in line. It just made me feel incredibly sad for their families. Under those circumstances, I would put them in front of me. Cazza

Brian, the questions that are posted as part of a group discussion are not the 'groups position'. These questions come from all kinds of members and we just put them down- document them, to indicate what is going through people's minds. The one about priorities for manufacturers comes from a person who has seen how many thousands of dollars our importers , manufacturers pay to support Natfly, and other flyins, they spend their dollars advertising in our magazines, they spend dollars supporting member workshops (maintenance workshops for example). It is just a question, and one that has differences of opinion -obviously. Also, the flying schools provide us with members so we have an organisation. Cazza

Hi Guys, (and Gals)Some comments on your post, John Reduced Board size - Perhaps a good idea, perhaps not. You guys out there are the Association. You elect a person to represent you. The elected person should represent your interests, if not, vote them out. How do the members know whether their interests are being represented? The Board works with such secrecy, that most of the Board don’t even appear to know what the Executive is doing or the rest of the Board if they are not in favor? Currently the representation is State Based. Perhaps it should be post code based, and that is entirely your (the membership) decision. Now, if you reduced the Board size to, say seven members, then in all likelihood, Tasmania, WA and NT would not have a Representative. Would this be satisfactory for members in those states? Once again your decision. There is more at stake here than just picking someone who says they will represent you. Many of the current Board members were the only candidate, so there is no option for members to say, we’d rather have no one than Mr X. In the early days of the Association, (In the old AUF days), voting was totally democratic. That is "One vote, one value". However this gave Queensland absolute power at the time, as they had more votes than the rest of the other states combined. Great for us Queenslanders, but bad news for every other area. This caused a lot of bad blood, so the system was changed and weighted as we have today. If you want change, then you, the Membership, have the power to do this. However please think out the long term ramifications. That is what we are doing. If you always do what you have always done, you will always get what you always got. If it isn’t working, then something has to change and the members cannot rely on the present structure and way of doing things. Representative. - Now I see posts of this qualification, or that qualification to be a Board member. Not in my humble opinion Guys. To me, it does not matter what education or qualification your Board Rep has, providing he/she is there with the primary purpose of representing the local membership. You should not be on the Board for self interest, you should not be on the Board for kudos, and you should not be on the Board for money. You guys want someone on the Board who is independent, a communicator, honest, transparent, their own person/makes up there own mind and who will not toe the "party line" as there should be no "parties" in our Association. What you don't want is everyone the same. You need balance and different opinions. Yep and that is exactly what we have now according to the election statements that appeared in the magazine. Many of us had great hopes of the promises made by candidates for election and once they got in, what happened, John? How do you, as a member, know how your Board member is performing. Are they? We have had this similar setup for over 25 years. Perhaps it served us well in the past, but not now. If Board members cannot see that the structure is not working, they aren’t working, they are just going along with what they are told, what is the point of having the same process? What we need is to be presented with a range of options from a group who researches how other organisations manage and get members to vote on one that they believe will best suit our organisation. We all, including you, need to be open to other possibilities that you haven’t thought of or considered. The Board is there to set policy that the Membership wants. It is the paid management that is paid to implement that policy. It is the management that is paid to have the knowledge and expertise to put systems in place to pass CASA audits. It is the management that does the financial reports, budgets, cost control etc. It is the quality of management that can make or break a business. The Executive is there to oversee the management, not do the work themselves. The Board is there to oversee the Executive, and you guys are there to oversee the Board. Yep, that is the way it has always been on paper. It is set in stone in the Constitution. The Exec hire the top man. They have always picked the one they think is best. Again, the process that is being used is the culprit and the Board members who allow it are complicit. Management. - Guys, the quality of the CEO/GM is so vitally important. No argument there. Again, there are structural problems with the Board and management that have to be fixed first. For years I tried to get the Board engaged in a sucession planning or at least a process for hiring Senior management and to document policies for performance reviews, etc. So what happened, John? Who is hired and what happens when the management does not carry out Board directions? Nothing. So, again, documentation and a Board that isn’t afraid to take the hard decisions if necessary. Future. - Everyone, I am very positive, with the right new GM who has ability with systems, finances, budgets, etc. and who can implement policy, will have us back on track in no time. Been there, done that. If the structure is not there, if the GM is not accountable, if Board and Exec are not willing to mete out consequences, we will continue down the same path. What you people must do is demand openness and transparency from the elected ones so you become aware of issues early, and steps can then be taken for early corrective action. We did, and we thought we were going to get it at the last election. So what happened? Now we are involved in trying to find positive ways forward, and are labled ‘distractors, trouble makers, etc etc. by our own representatives. John McK Carol Richards

CFIcare, you can do it any of those ways, however, I would suggest, that if you send it straight to the Secretary, contact your proxy holder and let them know you have done that. Given the uncertainty around, I would suggest you send your completed proxy to your proxy holder. They should know to get it into the office 24 hours prior to the meeting and keep a record of those they are looking after. Cazza

Ian, proxies have to be at the office on Friday before the meeting. carol

I believe the meeting was scheduled for the office which will hold about 60 people. They only have about 20 chairs. The rest can stand???????????? (That's what a previous employee told me once when I said a larger than usual number of members would be at the agm).

Jim, Also when you joined the Board, you would have been given the Code of Conduct. On Page 4, Item 9, Introduction, it states: ""RA-Aus as a body representing the interests of members and pilots in the public domain, values its reputation for reliability, honesty and integrity. Board members are expected to uphold these principles when conducting RA-Aus business. Board members are also expected to rigorously comply with all aspects of the law pertaining to personal and corporate behaviour..."" On Page 4, #10 Principles of Personal Conduct, I draw your attention to paragraph f. ""Board members must inform fellow board members of all material matters in their possession that relate to the conduct and management of RA-Aus, including meetings with politicians and public and industry officials. Board members must not make any deals or undertakings with third parties that materially affect RA-Aus without making full disclosure at Board level. Board members must not discriminate in dispensing information. All board members are entitled to access to the same and complete material. Page 5, Item 11. Board Meetings paragraph a. Board members are entitled to be heard with respect and without personal abuse. cazza

Jim, When you became a Board member, you would have been given a book that outlines the responsibilities of a Board member according to the law. Another member of this form posted this information, which is the same as is expected of Associations. So you must know what is going on and you must have access to the information that the exec has. in the eyes of the law, the exec have no special privileges, in fact they don't exist except to carry out Board policy. Technically, they are just ordinary Board members with a specific role, but that does NOT entitle them to information that is denied the rest of the Board or any Board members. What does the law expect of you personally? As a director, you must: be honest and careful in your dealings at all times know what your company is doing take extra care if your company is operating a business because you may be handling other people’s money make sure that your company can pay its debts on time see that your company keeps proper financial records act in the company’s best interests, even if this may not be in your own interests, and even though you may have set up the company just for personal or taxation reasons, and use any information you get through your position properly and in the best interests of the company. Using that information to gain, directly or indirectly, an advantage for yourself or for any other person, or to harm the company may be a crime or may expose you to other claims. This information need not be confidential; if you use it the wrong way and dishonestly, it may still be a crime. If you have personal interests that might conflict with your duty as a director, you must generally disclose these at a directors’ meeting. This rule does not apply if you are the only director of a proprietary company. What work must a director do? You and any other directors will control the company’s business. Your company’s constitution (if any) or rules may set out the directors’ powers and functions. You must be fully up-to-date on what your company is doing: Find out and assess for yourself how any proposed action will affect your company’s business performance, especially if it involves a lot of the company’s money. Get outside professional advice when you need more details to make an informed decision. Question managers and staff about how the business is going. Take an active part in directors’ meetings. Only be a company director or a company secretary if you are willing, able and have enough time to put in the effort. Avoid any company where someone offers to make you a director or secretary on the promise that ‘you won’t have to do anything’ and ‘just sign here’. You could be exposing yourself to many legal liabilities. ............................ What company records must you keep? As a director, the law makes you personally responsible for keeping proper company records. You must see that the company keeps up-to-date financial records that: correctly record and explain its transactions (including any transactions as a trustee), and explain the company’s financial position and performance. All companies must have financial records so that: true and fair financial statements of the company can be prepared if needed financial statements can be conveniently and properly audited if necessary, and the company can obey the tax laws. If your company is a ‘small proprietary company’ or a small company limited by guarantee (as defined in the Corporations Act), it will generally not have to prepare formal financial reports under that Act each year and lodge them with ASIC. However, you must still keep financial records, and may need financial reports for managing and monitoring your company’s financial position and performance for tax purposes or for raising finance. In most cases, large proprietary and public companies—even not-for-profit public companies—will have to prepare financial reports, have them audited and lodge them with ASIC. Some public companies limited by guarantee are exempt from these financial reporting obligations and others have reduced auditing and reporting obligations. For more details on the obligations of limited by guarantee companies, see Information Sheet 131 Companies limited by guarantee—simplified obligations (INFO 131). What are financial records? Some of the basic financial records that the law may require a company to keep are: general ledger, recording all the company’s transactions and balances (e.g. revenue, expenses, assets, liabilities) or summarising transactions and balances detailed in other records cash records (e.g. bank statements, deposit books, cheque butts, petty cash records) debtor and sales records (e.g. a list of debtors and their balances, delivery dockets, invoices and statements issued, a list of all sales transactions) creditor and purchases records (e.g. purchase orders, invoices and statements received and paid, unpaid invoices, a list of all purchases, a list of all creditors and their balances) wage and superannuation records a register of property, plant and equipment showing transactions and balances in relation to individual items inventory records investment records (e.g. contract notes, dividend or interest notices, certificates) tax returns and calculations (e.g. income tax, group tax, fringe benefits tax and GST returns and statements), and deeds, contracts and agreements. Cazza (Carol Richards, former Board member) A company would also normally prepare the following statements regularly (e.g. monthly) to manage its business performance and provide to lenders: Statement of Comprehensive Income: a statement showing the company’s revenue and expenses and the profit or loss that results from these items Statement of Financial Position: a statement showing the things of value the company owns and the debts the company owes, and Statement of Cash Flows: a statement summarising cash inflows and outflows. Get professional advice if you have any doubt about the content or type of financial records to keep. The lists above give examples only, because the financial records you need will vary from company to company. You may keep some financial records electronically, but you must be able to convert them into hard copy so that you can give them to anyone entitled to inspect them. Make backup copies of electronic records regularly (for example, weekly or daily). See also Information Sheet 76 What books and records should my company keep? (INFO 76). Your company must also keep some other basic records: see ‘Company housekeeping: other records and registers’ for more details. Company housekeeping: Other records and registers All company officers must make sure that the company attends to some basic ‘housekeeping’ matters. The directors remain ultimately responsible for the company’s compliance with the Corporations Act. When a company is register your company name with ASIC and obtain an Australian Company Number (ACN) have a registered office. (If your company doesn’t occupy the same address as the registered office, then you must have written consent from the person who occupies the registered office.) Make sure that you: display the company name at every place at which your company carries on business and that is open to the public. Also, a public company must display its name and the words ‘registered office’ prominently at its registered office. display the company name, the words ‘Australian Company Number’ (or ‘ACN’) or ‘Australian Business Number’ (or ‘ABN’) and the relevant number on: the common seal (if the company has one) every public document of the company every negotiable instrument (e.g. cheque, promissory note ) of the company, and all documents lodged with ASIC. Your company must keep: registers of members (shareholders) registers of option holders (if you have them) minutes of general meetings minutes of meetings of directors registers of charges created by the company over company property (s271 of the Corporations Act was removed from registration under the Personal Property Securities Act 2009. You are required to have this register and make entries up until this point in time), and financial records that enable an assessment of the company’s financial position and performance and are sufficient for financial statements to be prepared (and audited if necessary) for at least seven years after the transactions are completed. set up, you must: For more about the ASIC forms your company must lodge, see Information Sheet 20 Checklist for registered companies and their officers (INFO 20).

Air escape, I don't understand your comment? What is your point?

Just to be clear, I'm in favour of a moderate, reason based approach. Having the membership storm the RA-Aus offices in Canberra wielding pitch forks and burning torches would be entertaining, but just a tad counterproductive. Sain, no one wants to storm the offices doing stupid and counterproductive things. We ALL want this organisation to survive and provide the services they have in the past. We are working within the organisation and its processes to have a say, but those of us who have been on the board in years past were concerned then about the lack of proper professional proceses employed to look after the fastest growing aviation organisation in the country. This lack of steward ship which many of us have tried in the past to improve and were blocked by the same people who are now crying "we are only volunteers"" is not sustainable. To get them to do something differently and be more transparent and accountable is difficult if not impossible. It is becoming clearer, surely to the membership, that the Board that is responsible for the organisation is unable or unwilling to reform itself. What a shame. But we will do our best to have a positive result. Cazza

Richard, If I had any suggestions, I would have well and truly tried to implement them!!!. Life for us looking nothing but GRIM. Cazza

Will we have any aircraft registered to be worked on by anyone soon? In case you haven't seen my posting on another thread. Cost of the Registration Embargo to the Organisation and the Members Fellow Ra-Aus members, We need to sort this crises with aircraft and the attitude that members are not important, out. Let's just do a bit of maths to see why it is so crucialto have a meeting and why we belive the Board has lost their way and continue to focus on themselves instead of the organisation. We have a fleet of around 3600 aircraft. Divide that by 50 weeks in the year (allowing for Christmas and other holidays) That means 72 a/c a week need to be registered or 14 approx a day. The embargo began on Nov 6 and 14 working days went by and NO a/c were registered. 14 x 14 = 196 a/c in the Backlog In the next 7 days, another 98 arrived, but only 10 went out. The total to be registered as of Dec 5 is now 196 +88. We now have a backlog of 288 to be registered. At the current rate of 2 per day getting registered with 14 per day coming in, that will mean when staff go on their Christmas break in 13 days, we will have 14 -2 X 13 days, an additional 144. So a Grand total of a backlog of 432 aircraft. Financially, if each a/c rego costs $130, by the Christmas break we will have registered 36 aircraft and achieved an income of $4,680.00 We will have lost 432X$130 = $56,160 in income. That is only for the period from Nov 6 to Dec 24 (assuming staff work on the 24th). If a/c are not registered, then flying schools cannot take new students (missing out on members), do BFRs, (missing out on renewing members). Industry who cannot sell their aircraft cannot afford to be sponsors for Natfly and other flyins. Questions that need to be asked. 1. How many a/c are registrationed are each day? 2. Is Neville Probert the ONLY person who can approve EACH Registration? 3. Is he working EVERY DAY or just 2 or 3 days per week? 4. What is the EXEC and the CEO doing to improve the situation? We have a right to know. Cazza

Fellow Ra-Aus members, We need to sort this crises with aircraft and the attitude that members are not important, out. Let's just do a bit of maths to see why it is so crucialto have a meeting and why we belive the Board has lost their way and continue to focus on themselves instead of the organisation. We have a fleet of around 3600 aircraft. Divide that by 50 weeks in the year (allowing for Christmas and other holidays) That means 72 a/c a week need to be registered or 14 approx a day. The embargo began on Nov 6. 14 working days went by and no a/c were registered. 14 x 14 = 196 a/c In the next 7 days, another 98 arrived, but only 10 went out. The total to be registered as of Dec 5 is now 196 +88. We now have 288 to be registered. At the current rate of 2 per day getting registered with 14 per day coming in, that will mean when staff go on their Christmas break in 13 days, we will have 14 -2 X 13 days, an additional 144. So a Grand total of a backlog of 432 aircraft.F Financially, if each a/c rego costs $130, by the Christmas break we will have registered 36 aircraft and achieved an income of $4,680.00 We will have lost 432X$130 = $56,160 in income. That is only for the period from Nov 6 to Dec 24 (assuming staff work on the 24th). If a/c are not registered, then flying schools cannot take new students (missing out on members), do BFRs, (missing out on renewing members). Industry who cannot sell their aircraft cannot afford to be sponsors for Natfly and other flyins. Questions that need to be asked. 1. How many registrations are going out each day? 2. Is Neville Probert the ONLY person who can approve EACH Registration? 3. Is he working EVERY DAY or just 2 or 3 days per week? We have a right to know. Cazza

Yes, but Mr Runciman has agreed that he did indeed resign.

Bill Cain, Board Member from Victoria pulled the pin before Don. cazza

Runciman did resign and there is a board resolution passed some years ago to prevent members from withdrawing their resignation. He is now an ordinary member. If the board does not uphold their own rules they are corrupt and have to go IMHO. Cazza

"there are major problems looming at the moment...personalities are clouding the issue...and..(unfortunately)..a bit of 'bloody mindedness'is creeping in.... i'm buggered if i am going to forgo the priveleges i have now...for the sake of a cheap win at a meeting....there are troubles...at the moment..CASA is giving RAA time to sort it out...if we don't....we become part of history.." CFIcare, I really am troubled by what you are thinking? The Board has been training on their governance roles and responsibilities for a couple of years at great expense to the members. I was on the Board when this was initiated and Don Ramsay was on the Board when it continued. There are many members of the Board who have served for many years and would know the Constitution by heart, but often they have ignored it. This is a fact. I am happy to send you many examples. I was on the Board, I saw, it, I tried to prevent it and I tried to understand the idea that Board members have the right to ignore it. And I continue to see that mis-use of power and control and the consequent intimidation and bullying of anyone who raises objections. So what is a "cheap win at a meeting?" Do you really think that people like me have sacrificed years of our life in service to the organisation, for a cheap win???????? Firstly the Board has to acknowledge they are there for the organisation, not their own agenda or we are doomed. If the organisation (which is the membership) is not valued or respected, and our voices are not heard, then we are doomed to a downward spiral. We have a large membership andhave a huge pool of expertise for them to draw on, but they resist using people with expertise who are not part of a particular philosophical framework. As dissenting members, we are labeled as troublemakers. I reject that scenario and I reject that I have worked my *&^^%%%$ OFF for several years for a 'cheap win at a meeting". I am only interested in securing the long term viability of this organisation and the values and mission statements it embodies. cazza

Runciman told David I that the answers to his questions will be tabled. Hope we get a copy of them before the meeting. Andy, what time will you be arriving and can you make yourself known to us? Cazza

All executive posit,ions are vacated at the boArd meeting AFTER the AGM. Cazza