Rolf

I think it was stated in this forum that out of 2000 Jab engines in service only 50 reached TBO. Enough statistic for me. But I also understand that for a private owner doing 50 to 100h a year it might not be such a big issue. For TFT's it should.

Thanks Pete

Thanks Pete Any contact details? Are You actually flying a Nieuport. That's on my bucket list after the tailwheel endorsement and some more practice Cheers Rolf

I am planning to get my tail wheel endorsement. CAn Anyone recommend a good TF for this in the Brisbane area? Happy new Year Rolf

Thanks May Did not get the Email. Will check with the office that my Email is on file.

Sorry May to disagree I think RA AUS has a responsibility to keep members informed on this issue. Nothing to do with being the police for CASA. Members need to be informed to do the right thing and be informed about legislation. But I agree that the CASA timeline was irresponsible and did not give RA AUS a chance to inform members appropriately.

My apologies to RA AUST assuming common sense from CASA on such an important topic

Agree and appreciate everybody needs a family break. But if RA AUST and CASA were in closed consultation on this matter I would think that RA AUST was informed before their XMASW break or was there no consultation which would add to the CASA conspiracy theory. Happy new Year

So why is this not published on the RA AUS webpage yet. Is our safety manager sleeping at the helm again. Surely RA AUST was informed before the XMAS closure that this would come into effect.

Thanks to everyone for asn interesting rad on this forum. On a private note I would like to say that I don't mind the different views people share and the occasional battle of the engines is sometimes very entertaining. I don't think in a private forum we do not always have to be politically correct by the book. I 6hink we are doing quite alright comparing it to the childish discussions of our politicians during parliamentary question time. Merry XMAS and save and happy flying in 2015

Really nice we'll done can' wait to see more

Hi Ian I think the site is excellent as it is. Working with computers every day I personally like it simple and easy as it is and thank you for your effort to provide us with this excellent source of information. I personally like to be able to freely browse all topics that find my interest. I personally would not like information to be filtered. Kind Regards Rolf

Hi Gandalph No offence taken. As I said before there are many different aircraft types that suit different purposes. I think we all know that there is no worlds best aircraft that fits all. I am sure there are many Jabiru owners that had many enjoyable flights in their aircraft and so did I. I personally enjoyed my flights in a Tecnam P92 and the slow flying characteristic's and short landing capabilities of the Savage Cub. Of course not the right aircraft to go fast from A to B. So let's be tolerant of each other and enjoy and learn from our different experiences and not feel personally attacked when someone else enjoys a different type of experience or has a different assessment what risks are safe for the skills You have. Coming back to the topic of this thread. When it comes to training aircraft it is a totally different ballgame. I believe that a training organisation should asses very carefully what aircraft is safe for a student pilot. Most of the training is conducted doing circuit training. I hope we all agree that an engine failure after take-off or on short final carries a very high risk not just for low hour pilots. As a business owner myself despite the safety risk for the students I would be very worried about the legal liabilities for the business, operating an aircraft with the known issues. After my own experience I personally support CASA's recommendations in respect to the training operation of Jabiru powered aircraft. Time will tell. I would probably try to cut my losses and asses other options. FK9 with ECofly engine 8l/h at 75% cruise 2500h tbo., good safety record in Europe, $20,000/y less fuel for a training organisation. Worth a thought ? I personally would like to try one, even the red handle above the head would give me personally a lot of comfort in the NT. As I said just my personal perception.

I am not an aircraft engineer and do not have the experience to compare or make claims what is thye best aircraft in the world, someone else did. I just asked a valid question. ' Thanks Oscar that is valid information. Just to explain were I am coming from. After 2 engine failures during my training that almost put me off flying. I feel it is important that student pilots are well informed what the risk of particular aircraft are so they can make an informed decision which flying school to choose. I understand there are multiple reasons why people choose to fly a particular aircraft. But if an unexperienced pilot asks a valid question I would expect that he is not put back in his box an experienced members would give their unbiased advise leaving their ego aside and trying to be helpful rather than judgemental. Thank you and safe flying

On this page for a couple of years and well aware not to take everything to serious(In particular toenails:). I am not questioning that the Jabiru has a good airframe but world's best? I think everyone in particular the senior people in this forum have a responsibility to stay with the facts so the unexperienced people can benefit from unbiased information.

Just trying to put things into perspective I believe a far fetched claim " safest fuselage in the world" should be backed up by real facts. I believe other manufacturers are not sleeping in the safety department either like flight design that has a purpose built "safety box". Or the FK9 with its tubular steal safety cage. The rather deck chair seating of the Jabiru did never give me much confidence for protection against spinal injury in case of a crash. But anyway not much feedback providing facts why the Jabiru fuselage is the safest in the world. So just another urban myth?

There have been multiple claims in this threat about Jabiru having the toughest most survivable airframe of all aircraft on the market. I would be interested if anyone could back this up with some factual technical data (please not an Australian fatality statistic). I am interested in technical facts like What's the structure of the safety cell are there crash test studies or safety ratings (local/internationally) available for aircraft to backup this claim and shed some light. Or should we make this a new threat. No bashing please really interested in facts :)

In fact it is very much the same on a push bike, to initiate a left hand turn you haveto put handle bar rig to gt your CG left of centre to counteract the centrifugal force wen turning and at he end of the left hand turn push left to align Your CG back with the axis of te bike :). We just don't realise because we do it intuitively.

I was certainly not dreaming when I had my 2engine failures during circuit training. But feel free dreaming that the problems will go away putting blindfolds on. Please ensure you are awake when you check your engine through bolts. No more comment.

Sorry Nev I admire all your knowledge you bring to this forum. But facthunting is pretty useless if You go into denial accepting them. I experienced 2 J230 engine failures during my training 1 shortly before the takeoff roll. If it had happen 20 sec later I am not so sure what the outcome would have been even with my instructor by my side. By the way just for the record 1 engine failure happened only a few hours after the engine came back after a rebuilt from the factory.

Good point Old Koreelah didn't even think about Opal

I am sorry Bruce and Nev I believe you are really missing the point in this discussion. There are flight situations were en engine failure will result in serious consequences as takeoffs and landings. Situations frequently exercised during circuit training. So I believe CASA's restrictions in regard to training operations are quite reasonable to protect student pilots. I personally cannot comprehend the "she will be right attitude" in this forum. I cannot imagine anyone in this forum to accept that there car engine have to have the heads pulled off every couple of hundred hours to ensure the engine does not stop. So why are you accepting this in an engine aircraft? The facts are RAAUS and Jabiru have been negligent in these matters and something needed to be done for the benefit of everyone including all Jabiru owners.

Hi Bruce I totally agree that there are other safety issues but this threat is about 1 particular problem. Just because there are other risks that might have a higher severity does not mean you brush all the others aside this is not how safety works. If You as an experienced pilot I take it think there are other and more severe risks that can be mitigated I kindly ask You to put them forward to our safety manager to keep us low hour pilots safe, but don't mix them up in this threat!!

Here is a quick extract of RA AUST's safety policy Not sure if our president (and some in this forum) read this before they wrote there response to CASA Safety Policy Our commitment is to: develop and embed a safety culture in all our recreational flying activities that recognises the importance and value of effective aviation safety management and acknowledges at all times that safety is paramount(Comment:Above financial interest ?); clearly define for all members their accountabilities and responsibilities for the development and delivery of flying safety strategy and performance; minimise the risks associated with aircraft operations to a point that is as low as reasonably practicable/achievable; ensure that externally supplied systems and services that impact upon the safety of our operations meet appropriate safety standards; I cannot see many response in this threat that seem to take this policy serious. By the way where is our safety manager hiding in all off this. The facts are that RAAUS and I am sorry to say this, Jabiru owners themselves have accepted the problems for far too long. I believe that RAAUS has not fulfilled its duty to its members and has been sleeping on this issue for far too long. If RAAUS WOULD HAVE ACTED EARLIER maybe the mess we are in right now could have been avoided. I had 2 engine failures in training thanks god with the CFI on my side. I made my decision 4 years ago. What took so long. I feel for every Jabiru owner but lets face it the only way out and to minimise the damage is for Jabiru to fix the problem as soon as possible and stop the denial. Lets point our fingers in the right direction and stop blaming the people that raise there concerns for very good reasons.