Guernsey Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 The meeting has been called by the Members, so the Members have the right to raise motions from the floor. It is their meeting surely. Alan. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 It would be unwise to ignore resolutions from the floor. per se, but There has to be some protection of a "meeting" being called and resolutions being passed without ALL members being notified of (a) The details of the meeting Date Place and Time and Purpose (b) Resolutions to be put to the meeting. While we all know (roughly) what is going on there must be no suggestion of any stacking or secrecy of purpose. This is the same as the agenda being published prior to any GM. No -one would want meetings being called and a very small number turning up and springing a lot of fanciful motions upon the group and having them passed, and requiring them to be acted upon. It would not be good process. ( Probably not legal anyhow) I'm not just relating to this occasion but to ANY other occasion where a Special GM is called. People directing proxies would need this information as well. Nev 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 For those of you who haven't read the many threads, there is a process for calling of a General Meeting, which is being followed, and there are conditions laid down for the conduct - all listed in the Constitution in detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlfaRomeo Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 The primary purpose of this meeting is to get the Board to communicate with the members something it seems that they have resisted up to now with enormous resolve. The first item on the Agenda gives the floor to the Board to give an account of their stewardship of RA-Aus. An honest account, I believe, would show that there have been many poor decisions made and the result has been RA-Aus pushed to the brink of existence. You just can't do that and expect everyone to sit back and say that is good enough. There will be many questions asked of the Board and I get the feeling it will be like pulling teeth trying to get straight answers if the last AGM is anything to go by. Motions from the floor will arise. No doubt about it. What they might be nobody can really say until the Board has been given a fair hearing. Based on the information most of us will have heard for the very first time, decisions will be made on the way forwards. I would expect that the Board will receive instructions from the floor phrased as motions directing them, for example, to form a Finance sub-committee with no more than one Board member (the Treasurer) plus say three members who have recognised finance qualifications. This will fix the appalling lack of compliance with the Constitution and the Act and raise the standard of reporting to the Board and the ordinary members. Will the Board Executive receive some kind of censure from the floor? Depends on the accounting they give of their time on the Exec. If they have done the wrong thing they can hardly expect a pat on the back. Every member of RA-Aus has the right to be at the Meeting on 9th Feb or send a proxy. Anyone giving a proxy gives it to somebody whose judgement they trust. The person they give it to will hear things at the Meeting that the Board has declined to communicate until then. Based on what they hear they will want some action from the Meeting. Why else have they come to Canberra? Members who attend the meeting will have spent, in total, in excess of $100,000. The Board will have spent, I'm guessing, more than $10,000 for the Board Members to fly in and be accommodated and to attend. If the Meeting is made ineffective by the Board getting cute with rulings on points of order, etc., they will have severely frustrated the democratic aims of the members and wasted a vast sum of members funds in the process. If that happens, I think there will be a very heavy price for the Board to pay for any such cavalier approach. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Good post AR, And the Board will not have spent any of their own money to attend, like the members will. Ditto with legal advice, and I find it perverse that the Board might be spending member's money receiving legal advice on how they might handle or counter the members who attend this meeting. It will also be interesting to see what the Board does (and whether they choose to boot the members out for what items) at the Board Meeting on the 8th, which a number of members will also be attending as a lead-up to the meeting on the 9th. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 No if, buts or maybes the exec has already shown that they hold members in contempt and have done so for years. I am not interested in excuses. Move them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spriteah Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Ladies and Gents I can also disappointingly report I am now left of emails that are circulating and the majority of board members have 'ceased' communicating on the RAA board members forum. If this was a small club with 10K in the bank I would have a chuckle to myself. But with the funds and liabilites we have I am very concerned. If things do not alter in the immediate future for the better then I am not sure I am willing to be associated with the board and the liabilities that I as a director might inherit. Yours in safe flying Regards, Jim Tatlock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 We can't let this keep on happening. Perhaps legal now?. Have you spoken with Kaz? Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Ladies and Gents I can also disappointingly report I am now left of emails that are circulating and the majority of board members have 'ceased' communicating on the RAA board members forum. If this was a small club with 10K in the bank I would have a chuckle to myself. But with the funds and liabilites we have I am very concerned. If things do not alter in the immediate future for the better then I am not sure I am willing to be associated with the board and the liabilities that I as a director might inherit.Yours in safe flying Regards, Jim Tatlock. Jim, I urge you to hang in there, at least until the Feb 9th meeting when the poor dumb old "uninformed members" (as one of the Board Members described us) can discuss this face-to-face with the Executive and the Board. This method of the Executive & some Board Members treating other Board Members who dilligently try to do their jobs is similar to what others have reported and is used to try to drive you out so that they can get a more subservient member in your place. If you resign, they win. This treatment of you in a disgrace, is unconscionable and is illegal and in my view it is time to take this and related matters to whatever Authority has the controlling power over Incorporated Associations in the ACT. To do that effectively it will be best for the complaint to come from an existing Board Members. If you are willing to continue and go down that path, I would be happy to make all of the initial contacts and to fund your costs in progressing the complaint. I will also speak to the provider of the RAA's Directors and Officers Insurance about the way that a Director is being treated & snowballed. One of the areas where the 30% overstatement of member numbers COULD have had effect is IF repeat IF that figure was used to establish the premium and secret commissions/kickbacks paid as a result. While I certainly have no evidence of that, one has to be more suspicious when you have received this reaction for asking for the figures and paperwork around that issue. I'll call you as soon as I can to discuss further. Regards Geoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Jim, the exec where always going to go into "bunker" mode as the meeting drew closer, the whispering you here is the sound of the OBC rearming ready for the fight of their lives. The President is probably busy working on his opening speech. Which should be doozie as he missed the last meeting. Personally, I think the first order of business should clarify who the current president and treasurer isn't by a quick show of hands. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest john Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 To All Interested RAAus Members. In response the Jims post today about being eliminated from the Board Members forum, an email has been sent to SR today requesting he advise me if some elected Board members are eliminated from receiving all items concerning the issues that are posted on the Board forum or are only selected Board Members privy to the crisis issues that face RAAus Board. If a response is received I will post it on this site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Jim please hang in there, this is starting to get particularly annoying, if the executive have to be disposed of we need as many board members with the appropriate attitude as we can get. The "circle of trust" guys may think they have the numbers and nobody can do anything, but for RAAus to survive that cannot be the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webbm Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 It doesn't matter one single bit if any board member is liked by other board members or not. The fact is, a Board Member has been elected to represent members. If he or she is not liked by other board members, too bad. No one has the right to deny a board member information. No one has the right to dictate how a board member should fulfill his or her duties within the boundries of the constitution and Australian laws. RA-Aus is not a "boys club". It's a serious force in the OZ aviation scene and hence must be treated and run seriously and professionally before it becomes a serious force down the toilet. It's sad to say that I'm getting a clearer picture of what's going on, and I don't like it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drifterdriver Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Run Forest Run. Well actually you'd better not. I can entirely empathise with you Mr Tatlock but RAAus needs a core of at least three good board members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Not surprising thoughts Jim. I'm of the opinion that this needs a legal resolution. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest airsick Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 To All Interested RAAus Members. In response the Jims post today about being eliminated from the Board Members forum, an email has been sent to SR today requesting he advise me if some elected Board members are eliminated from receiving all items concerning the issues that are posted on the Board forum or are only selected Board Members privy to the crisis issues that face RAAus Board. If a response is received I will post it on this site. I urge everyone to get in contact with the Office of Regulatory Services in the ACT. To my way of thinking it has gone well beyond complaining to SR and his cohort. Think about it, he has cut Jim out of the loop - do you really think he is going to let random members in on the secret? I think it's time the government department responsible for ensuring things are run in an appropriate way is informed... http://www.ors.act.gov.au/ Shopfront Location: 255 Canberra Avenue Fyshwick A.C.T. 2609 Opening Hours: 9am - 4.30pm Monday to Friday Postal Address: GPO Box 158 Canberra City A.C.T. 2601 Email Address: [email protected] Telephone Number:(02) 6207 3000 Telephone Number Outside Australia:+61 (2) 6207 3000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest john Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 To All Interested RAAus Members, SR has responded to my email of yesterday as outlined in post 144 on this thread & as far as I am concerned a "POLITICIANS ANSWER" was received. He was also requested to have either the ex staff member or Middo produce a Statutory Declaration at the forthcoming EGM stating that the defective membership details which were provided at the AGM was either a genuine error or was a deliberate lie, & furthermore for the official recorded minutes of the AGM be rectified with respect to this defect as opposed to a simple apology on the RAAus website that was posted a few days ago, & he said he would discuss this defect with Middo & take whatever corrective action was required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cherk Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 I urge everyone to get in contact with the Office of Regulatory Services in the ACT. To my way of thinking it has gone well beyond complaining to SR and his cohort. Think about it, he has cut Jim out of the loop - do you really think he is going to let random members in on the secret?I think it's time the government department responsible for ensuring things are run in an appropriate way is informed... http://www.ors.act.gov.au/ Shopfront Location: 255 Canberra Avenue Fyshwick A.C.T. 2609 Opening Hours: 9am - 4.30pm Monday to Friday Postal Address: GPO Box 158 Canberra City A.C.T. 2601 Email Address: [email protected] Telephone Number:(02) 6207 3000 Telephone Number Outside Australia:+61 (2) 6207 3000 maybe a more informed viewer can comment on the relevance of these sections as viewed on the above sites link:-, Most common offences that are investigated include: the association not making its register of members available to members (section 67 of the Act); members taking office when disqualified (section 63 of the Act); failure of a committee member to disclose any interest in regard to a contract the association may be considering or has signed (section 65 of the Act); failure to conduct an annual general meeting within five months of the end of the association's financial year (section 69 of the Act); failure to ensure proper accounting records are kept (section 71 of the Act); failure to submit financial statements to its members at an annual general meeting (section 73 of the Act); 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest airsick Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 I think you've nailed it cherk except for two oversights. I'm not sure that any of the board members are disqualified under s67 of the Act (although I'm not sure they're not either!). And they did hold an AGM within 5 months as per s69, they just didn't do it in accordance with other provisions of the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlfaRomeo Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 By appointing an ordinary member to the Board and not allowing the NQ members stand or to vote in a by-election for the NQ Board position they have breached s50 Natural Justice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingVizsla Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I think you've nailed it cherk except for two oversights. I'm not sure that any of the board members are disqualified under s67 of the Act (although I'm not sure they're not either!). And they did hold an AGM within 5 months as per s69, they just didn't do it in accordance with other provisions of the law. Cherk isn't suggesting the Board is guilty of all of these points. It is a list on the Office of Regulatory Services' website as a list of common offences they have investigated. The list is here http://www.ors.act.gov.au/community/associations#i%20have%20a%20complaint Proves two things: 1. they do investigate, 2. RAA is not alone in breaching and/or being ignorant of The Act. Sue Still Grounded 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guernsey Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Over six and a half thousand views of this post so far and still several weeks to go before the meeting' Very Interesting indeed. Alan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest john Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 To All Interested RAAus Members. An email has been sent to the Secretary of RAAus tonight requesting that for the long term survival & betterment of RAAus that the Executive Board Members give serious consideration to immediately voluntarily standing aside ( not resigning) from their respective positions & appoint an interim Administrator forthwith until all of the administrative defects & uncertainties can be discussed & resolved at the forthcoming EGM on 9.2.2013. Should a response be received it will be posted on this thread site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spriteah Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Fellow flyers. At this point of time I believe we continue on, hopefully get all planes in the air and see what comes from the feb 9 meeting. It's clear there is a lot of passion for our organization and nobody wants to lose it or have control taken from the membership. Regards, Jim Tatlock. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest airsick Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Cherk isn't suggesting the Board is guilty of all of these points. It is a list on the Office of Regulatory Services' website as a list of common offences they have investigated. The list is here http://www.ors.act.gov.au/community/associations#i have a complaint Proves two things: 1. they do investigate, 2. RAA is not alone in breaching and/or being ignorant of The Act. Sue Still Grounded Ah! Turns out the oversight was on my part! "Still grounded" proves one more thing - this isn't solved yet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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