deadstick Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Fatal Gyro crash this morning. http://www.southcoastregister.com.au/story/2153065/man-killed-in-gyrocopter-crash/?cs=203 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Unfortunately it is true, as I post here, 2 asra inspectors are travelling to the crash site, where as always, they conduct an extensive investigation into the cause. The outcome can be delayed at times, if they need engineering reports on any components that they deemed suspect. Fatal incidences involving gyros, are painstakingly investigated by asra, no matter where it has happened, and their findings are released, contrary to some gossip out there. Often.......the releasing of a report is delayed due to legal requirements, sometimes the courts/ coroners, can delay the release for 12mths or more, while the matter goes through their systems. Yes....sad day, thoughts go towards his family members. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabiru7252 Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Perhaps the pilot had a medical event? At 66 he is no spring chicken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 A club member called me and said a Gyro just flew low over his house, looked like it was getting smashed in the severe leeside turbulence (forcast and Sigmett'd). 20 minutes later he called back. Told me the gyro had gone in. Pilot deceased. Thoughts are with the families involved. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 The media report said the weather was pleasant? 45 kts westerly with severe turb's at 2000, real nice weather. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metalman Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Had plans for a lunch at Toorradin ,decided to bang away on the RV instead Sad to see another loss, condolences to the family Matty 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
104chocks Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 From the image published here, it would appear to be G-511 an Advanced Kinetics Gyroz. http://www.southcoastregister.com.au/story/2153065/video-man-killed-in-gyrocopter-crash/?cs=203#slide=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I always thought that a gyro could handle very rough weather better than any other form of flying machine. Of course there must be a limit to controllability with anything. Nev 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Russ, in addition to ASRA does ATSB normally get involved also? If this crash related to Performance and Operations, MET it could provide future safety information about the procedures before a flight - what needs to be done, where met information needs to be obtained etc. It would be particularly valuable to recreational aviation operators other that gyros, where this subject seems to be very thin on the ground with may people thinking you can "see" weather, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I always thought that a gyro could handle very rough weather better than any other form of flying machine. Of course there must be a limit to controllability with anything. Nev They do handle rough weather, better than most.......but..... There are times when it should stay in the hanger, too many gyro lads believe that gyros are near on bullit proof, which then lures pilots to engage in conditions that far exceed the pilots capabilities. Training,training,training.....geez, could I harp on about it. Same scinareo with general flying, gyros yank and bank, reeeel good, again too many pilots exceed their own capabilities, pushing the envelope, and they get bitten. I,ve trained many a gyro pilot, at times, many mths down the track, I observe him pushing the envelope.....that,s when we have a quiet talk.......a serious quiet talk. Complacency .....that,s another demon that lurks about........with some folks. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Russ, in addition to ASRA does ATSB normally get involved also?If this crash related to Performance and Operations, MET it could provide future safety information about the procedures before a flight - what needs to be done, where met information needs to be obtained etc. It would be particularly valuable to recreational aviation operators other that gyros, where this subject seems to be very thin on the ground with may people thinking you can "see" weather, No turbo, they don,t get involved. With any fatality, the coroner etc are involved. As to weather reports.....sorry to say most guys just look up, that,s about it. They know where/how to get the reports etc, but don,t bother. Weather report on the Telly night before, would be fairly norm. However.........slowly, more and more lads are pre planning their intended flight, and this is good to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I'll try to find the regulations, but P&O is an important and separate operation to physical preflight, and ensures the aircraft has the correct endurance, correct navigation plan (as against just looking at a GPS as you go), correct alternates, correct weight, correct balance, and correctly obtained MET. I've been one of the people who has soundly criticised the last century telex stype weather reports from Airservices, and this site has assistance with clear English, but it IS necessary to obtain your Met report from Airservices because it is the aviation related source, and als0 for your compliance and safety. Nothing to stop you looking at Elders weather, or out the door to get additional information, but the prime information should be that telex sheet, because it will contain data like adiabatic winds etc. I spent probably a month in class on P&O for the PPL, and the exercises we did were one of the most enjoyable parts of the whole course. They did involve mathematics, which surprisingly I hate, but it was easier than BAK. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yenn Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 A lot of people tell us that Gyros handle rough weather well. If that is so why do they only fly early and late at all the fly ins I have been to. They seem averse to flying in turbulence. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Who knows why they flew as they did with you?. I'm not sure that proves anything. I have many times been at places where the gyro's were the only aircraft flying, because of the adverse winds. Very experienced pilots of them have informed me of their capability and I thought it was a generally accepted fact. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 My mate described this gyro as "waving its tail all over the shop, and dropping its nose then raising it rapidly". Only moments before it crashed. The area we are in is very prone to leeside Turbulence . Very strong vertical and horizontal rotors are common. Its not predictable 'thermal" turbulence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmick Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Sounds like porpoising which I understand can occur in fast cruise as maybe trying to increase ground speed against strong wind - just speculation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Is the design considered good? A very good friend of mine died in one that wasn't. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
104chocks Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 The gyro was designed by Advanced Kinetics. Their website has gone, out of business. The gyro appears to incorporate a trike hull. By using The Way Back Machine we can see website as it was http://web.archive.org/web/20130506123956/http://gyroz.com.au/ Facts can be hard to come by - how many were ever built, completed and registered ? I know of two ( G-511 and G-611 ) but have heard suggestions of maybe half a dozen or so. The Coroners report may cover some of this background. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 My mate described this gyro as "waving its tail all over the shop, and dropping its nose then raising it rapidly". Only moments before it crashed.The area we are in is very prone to leeside Turbulence . Very strong vertical and horizontal rotors are common. Its not predictable 'thermal" turbulence. That might be PIOs which I think gyro pilots should be careful about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bones Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 The builder of these machines died of cancer not long after starting to build them, how ever he was a LONG time gyro guy, he made rotors blades for many many years, i have never personally flown in one, but i would near bet my left nut they flew good, so i would think it may have been pilot error or pilot incapasition. Gyros can handle near anything mum nature can throw, its the nut behind the stick that determines everything (as usual), i have flown into places that i knew it was going to be hellishly rough and turbent but i had to bacuse the cattle were there, 1 particular spot had claimed about 2 R22 helos, the worse thing you can do in that situation is try and go fast to get out of it, slow and steady will be the order of the day. as long as the down drafts are not stronger than your max climb rate your fine, if not then well you got a rebuild coming up. Here is another tip, turbulence and rotor ect stops at the tree tops (Normally) so if your 1' above the trees your usually safe from going down any further. Yes PIO and PPO usually start with excess speed. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza 38 Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I don't know much at all about gyro's but the modern ones appear to be safer and well engineered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinsm Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Perhaps the pilot had a medical event? At 66 he is no spring chicken. garbage, us spring chickens resemble that remark...!!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 My mate described this gyro as "waving its tail all over the shop, and dropping its nose then raising it rapidly". Only moments before it crashed.The area we are in is very prone to leeside Turbulence . Very strong vertical and horizontal rotors are common. Its not predictable 'thermal" turbulence. Andy, Sad part about this accident if it was the weather that was a major cause and the pilot was not liking what he was flying in he had the perfect machine to make a precautionary search & landing as he could have put it down on a dime & trailered it out. If it was component failure that was out of his hands. By the sounds of it the weather was real nasty and the old saying better to be down here wishing you were up there instead of being up here wishing you were down there has a serious meaning to it. Condolences to the pilots family & friends. Alf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I don't know much at all about gyro's but the modern ones appear to be safer and well engineered. Been in one Dazza, Twice, first time which was the last time that counts for 2, not my cup of tea. Alf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Yes alf. I wouldn't like to speculate, I the wx wasn't the cause , it would at least be a casual factor which is why I mentioned it. Also , interestingly, the acft was perfectly in the middle of a very large paddock. I know the paddock well, as we often practice forced landings on it. It's the best paddock in the area.. And the wreck as I said was right in the middle . A co incidence quite possibly, but combined with the wx a picture that would need investigating starts to emerge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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