alf jessup Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 Hey Dinga I understand why we need this type of informationbut at the end of the day the only one to keep you safe is yourself our instructors do the best they can to inform us of our chosen sport and at the end of the day the only way one get the skills is to use them we all have our limits and as we use these skill we learn those limits but they do come with risk even our instructor are learning as they grow older some times they get caught . I have myself have lost in the last few years some very long time pilots and friends that both built aircraft and flown many types of crafts which I looked up to for guidance and use to think wow if these fellow could come unstuck then I be in trouble . But I have learn from my friends mishaps that thing can and do go wrong no matter how long u have been at it . The only way for us as as pilots is to understand that it is a risky sport that we all love the Loire of flight so we have a responablty to ourselfs to try and fly as safe as we can and enjoy the skills we have learnt and try to better yourself bye honing these skill so not to become one of the fallen aviators Cheers Doug Evans Respect too all the fallen friends of flight RIP Well said Doug You are right, at the end of the day you are the only one in control of your own destiny, be that with your skills, decision making, maintenance or checking after maintenance done by someone else, the list goes on. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan3111 Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 I do wounder about trikes after this? I can hear john now saying "bolikes danny wash your mouth out danny" (in his excited pommy voice) . I have spent many hours over the years grinding away beside his trike in my fixed wing two stroke ultralight aircraft on cross country trips . I have only ever been in one trike at Evans head (wasn't with john but wish it was ) looking back I,m lucky to be a live . Back then was in a brand new just released 582 quazser ? with a cowboy pilot flying decided to see if he could get 100mph vne and a full power dive I didn,t know any better or the risks of a trike in a dive close to negative G being just a pax at 20 years of age (one of my nine lives used up ) . But John was just so careful 100 percent more then most for this to happen to him and lived and breathed trikes and never had any bad to say about trikes I didn't fly them but had nothing against them as well and always happy to fly beside him . As quite a few times he had pulled up beside my wing flying on the way back from the training area when he happen to see me heading out . John had also lost friends that flew trikes around the world over the years and had told me the storys and learnt from it . I really hope they leave no stone unturned in there hunt for the cause of this horrible horrible thing (worst that life can ever throw at you ) for everybody involved around him . Then maybe after all the finding of this some systems can make trikes a lot safer then have ever been . To be honest after this I don,t think will ever go in a trike again . As no one is safe in trikes if one of the best all round trike CFI pilots have this happen to him . RIP JOHN (sorry John for saying some thing bad about trikes ) 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 Dann3111 Trikes are very safe mate, the human element is the weakest link, humans make them, fly them and maintain them Take the human element out of operating anything mechanical and it is all safe We are the weakest link 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinga Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 I understand why we need this type of informationbut at the end of the day the only one to keep you safe is yourself our instructors do the best they can to inform us of our chosen sport and at the end of the day the only way one get the skills is to use them we all have our limits and as we use these skill we learn those limits but they do come with risk even our instructor are learning as they grow older some times they get caught . I have myself have lost in the last few years some very long time pilots and friends that both built aircraft and flown many types of crafts which I looked up to for guidance and use to think wow if these fellow could come unstuck then I be in trouble . But I have learn from my friends mishaps that thing can and do go wrong no matter how long u have been at it . The only way for us as as pilots is to understand that it is a risky sport that we all love the Loire of flight so we have a responablty to ourselfs to try and fly as safe as we can and enjoy the skills we have learnt and try to better yourself bye honing these skill so not to become one of the fallen aviators Cheers Doug Evans Respect too all the fallen friends of flight RIP Hey DingaWell said Doug You are right, at the end of the day you are the only one in control of your own destiny, be that with your skills, decision making, maintenance or checking after maintenance done by someone else, the list goes on. I would agree, but to a point only. If it was as simple as this we probably wouldn't be having this discussion. The point is (more so with lower hour pilots than the more experienced among us) that when it comes to "but at the end of the day the only one to keep you safe is yourself", "at the end of the day you are the only one in control of your own destiny" it is just not that simple. We as newer pilots may actually believe that we are doing the correct thing whether it is operationally or with Maintenance. With so many Microlight Pilots flying solo (so to speak) ie: from local farms or airfields or even their own property they may not have the level of contact with higher hour more experienced pilots that perhaps they would benefit from. This could then lead to perhaps them making decisions that they truly believe to be correct not realizing that they are putting themselves in danger. Sure there is the BFR, but this only serves to bring Pilot and CFI together once every two years, it may be too late by then. I feel strongly about this subject as I truly believe that this sport/pastime is fantastic and has so much potential but I also believe we are missing something that needs addressing. IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keenaviator Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 I do wounder about trikes after this? I can hear john now saying "bolikes danny wash your mouth out danny" (in his excited pommy voice) . I have spent many hours over the years grinding away beside his trike in my fixed wing two stroke ultralight aircraft on cross country trips . I have only ever been in one trike at Evans head (wasn't with john but wish it was ) looking back I,m lucky to be a live . Back then was in a brand new just released 582 quazser ? with a cowboy pilot flying decided to see if he could get 100mph vne and a full power dive I didn,t know any better or the risks of a trike in a dive close to negative G being just a pax at 20 years of age (one of my nine lives used up ) . But John was just so careful 100 percent more then most for this to happen to him and lived and breathed trikes and never had any bad to say about trikes I didn't fly them but had nothing against them as well and always happy to fly beside him . As quite a few times he had pulled up beside my wing flying on the way back from the training area when he happen to see me heading out . John had also lost friends that flew trikes around the world over the years and had told me the storys and learnt from it . I really hope they leave no stone unturned in there hunt for the cause of this horrible horrible thing (worst that life can ever throw at you ) for everybody involved around him . Then maybe after all the finding of this some systems can make trikes a lot safer then have ever been . To be honest after this I don,t think will ever go in a trike again . As no one is safe in trikes if one of the best all round trike CFI pilots have this happen to him .RIP JOHN (sorry John for saying some thing bad about trikes ) If you were flying in a Quasar (Pegasus) and straight and level you were very safe. What concerns me with some of these 'topless' winged trikes is that even an experienced instructor has come to grief. That said it there have been plenty of 3 axis instructors come to grief too - Brumby spinning into the ground on a training flight, Thruster wing strut attach failing causing the wings to clap..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slb Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 Went for a Trike flight this morning. It was beautiful, calm and peaceful. Said a quiet farewell to those who have recently passed. RIP 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzharFly Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 I only came to know John a few weeks ago when arranging a BFR in Weightshift. We had a lovely conversation when we found we had a common denominator in that I used to fly a Mainair Flash II Alpha and John flew this same aircraft years ago across the English Channel on several occasions. I was so looking forward to meeting John in January to hear more of his adventures. Rest in Peace and my sincere condolences to his family. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggles Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 Recreational Aviation Australia is saddened to advise members of a dual fatality involving John Cresswell, CFI of Caboolture Microlights, and Jason Caswell in QLD on 25 November in a Rotax-powered Airborne XT-912 weight shift aircraft. The aircraft was registered with Recreational Aviation Australia. Recreational Aviation Australia dispatched an accident consultant to the scene who has been assisting police with the preliminary investigation and we will continue to assist Queensland Police during the investigation. Our thoughts go out to the friends and families of those involved at this very difficult time. At this early stage, we cannot speculate as to the cause of the accident, however, if any areas of immediate safety concern are determined, we will advise pilots and operators as soon as practicable. We will continue to work with police and provide a formal report to the Coroner in due course. Whilst this incident is a devastating reminder of how unforgiving our sport can be, RAAus remains committed to keeping our sport safe and fun. We ask that members maintain strong levels of diligence and continue to adhere to our core safety messages. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeptic36 Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 Rotax-powered Airborne XT-912 Imho, of more importance than the carriage details, do we know which wing it was? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 Imho, of more importance than the carriage details, do we know which wing it was? From the reports and the photos of the accident it was a strutted wing and as it was not Johns aircraft it looks like it was one of the other instructors Airborne XT912 Tundra Arrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmik Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 If it can happen to John its probably time for me to find a new Hobby..... Sad day. Hoping they find out the cause of this. :-( RAA, HGFA, ATSB and CASA please work collegiality to investigate the strutted Arrow wing. Almost all the recent trike accidents, including most all of the fatalities, have been under an Arrow wing. Too much of a coincidence to ignore.... Dundee/Glen Inness - two fatalities - April, 2015 Noosa - very lucky pilot - March 2015 Yarrawonga - two fatalities - March 2016 Mobray/Cairns - near miss - two person - Sept 2016 Rockhampton - two fatalities Just a few that come immediately to mind, however, there's sure to be a few more (including a few near misses I know about). This wing is dangerous and I'm regularly saddened, frustrated and angered hearing about high hour pilots, including CFI's having fatal incidents and that nothing is being done to ground this wing, rather blame the pilot. There's a design fault that will pull the wing into an unrecoverable spin that even Arnie Schwarzenegger wouldn't be able to get out of or that the wing becomes erratically uncontrollable in pitch & roll as was the case in one of the above.... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinga Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 RAA, HGFA, ATSB and CASA please work collegiality to investigate the strutted Arrow wing. Almost all the recent trike accidents, including most all of the fatalities, have been under an Arrow wing. Too much of a coincidence to ignore....Dundee/Glen Inness - two fatalities - April, 2015 Noosa - very lucky pilot - March 2015 Yarrawonga - two fatalities - March 2016 Mobray/Cairns - near miss - two person - Sept 2016 Rockhampton - two fatalities Just a few that come immediately to mind, however, there's sure to be a few more (including a few near misses I know about). This wing is dangerous and I'm regularly saddened, frustrated and angered hearing about high hour pilots, including CFI's having fatal incidents and that nothing is being done to ground this wing, rather blame the pilot. There's a design fault that will pull the wing into an unrecoverable spin that even Arnie Schwarzenegger wouldn't be able to get out of or that the wing becomes erratically uncontrollable in pitch & roll as was the case in one of the above.... Madmik, that's some broad sweeping condemnation statement there. I hear what you are saying but apart from the incidents that you bought to mind it might be an idea to see exactly how many vs how many other type wings have been involved. Additionally I am guessing that we don't know if this was a performance related incident or a failure related incident. I would be asking RAA, HGFA, ATSB and CASA to start making the cause of these open to the industry so we can better decide on what we should be flying. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueadventures Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 RAA, HGFA, ATSB and CASA please work collegiality to investigate the strutted Arrow wing. Almost all the recent trike accidents, including most all of the fatalities, have been under an Arrow wing. Too much of a coincidence to ignore....Dundee/Glen Inness - two fatalities - April, 2015 Noosa - very lucky pilot - March 2015 Yarrawonga - two fatalities - March 2016 Mobray/Cairns - near miss - two person - Sept 2016 Rockhampton - two fatalities Just a few that come immediately to mind, however, there's sure to be a few more (including a few near misses I know about). This wing is dangerous and I'm regularly saddened, frustrated and angered hearing about high hour pilots, including CFI's having fatal incidents and that nothing is being done to ground this wing, rather blame the pilot. There's a design fault that will pull the wing into an unrecoverable spin that even Arnie Schwarzenegger wouldn't be able to get out of or that the wing becomes erratically uncontrollable in pitch & roll as was the case in one of the above.... You could try sending details of your information in a formal letter to the Magistrates court at Rockhampton for the informtion and consideration of the Coroner and the investigating Police Officer. At least you get a reply and hopefully they will no miss including similar matters in the investigation process. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan3111 Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 RAA, HGFA, ATSB and CASA please work collegiality to investigate the strutted Arrow wing. Almost all the recent trike accidents, including most all of the fatalities, have been under an Arrow wing. Too much of a coincidence to ignore....Dundee/Glen Inness - two fatalities - April, 2015 Noosa - very lucky pilot - March 2015 Yarrawonga - two fatalities - March 2016 Mobray/Cairns - near miss - two person - Sept 2016 Rockhampton - two fatalities Just a few that come immediately to mind, however, there's sure to be a few more (including a few near misses I know about). This wing is dangerous and I'm regularly saddened, frustrated and angered hearing about high hour pilots, including CFI's having fatal incidents and that nothing is being done to ground this wing, rather blame the pilot. I don,t know a lot about trikes but have heard of this dreaded wing and don,t even fly them . To be honest I think the powers to be that do the appraisal and certification think of trikes way down in the food chain .im not sure weather casa would even have any emeloyee that could even test fly one .Its I bit like the jabiru engines casa finialy did a bit of research for them self and named and shamed them to start fixing things . It's early days with finding out what happened to John . But when they do swift action needs to be taken if it a problem with any design . 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLA82 Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 He was the inly one I trusted in these F...g death trap machines... I think I'll leave it here with him and return to PPC Frog that was my first thought but after sitting on it for a while I now want to finish my weight shift license more than ever. Firstly as a sense of accomplishment and secondly because I believe if John heard the thoughts I was having towards trikes after his accident he would have given me a quick slap behind the ears. Unfortunately every thing we do is dangerous ( I ride motorbikes aswell) but when it comes down to it when your numbers up its up. Look at Michael Schumacher, he dodges death for a living for years and then knocks his head on a rock. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drobson Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 It came as a shock today via Chris Brandon as I have been sending John messages asking him to finish my trike course before Christmas and it is not usual for John not answered in the next 2 hoursThere goes truly most serious and thorough guy I have met in aviation since in Australia, a forefather for the trike industry, flying France and England before and even crossing the channel He was the inly one I trusted in these F...g death trap machines... I think I'll leave it here with him and return to PPC I can totally empathize with you Frog. I work overseas for most of the year and was doing my training with John over an extended period whenever I returned to Aus. I had booked more training for before Xmas and was really looking forward to a few more flights with John. I am currently in China and found out by chance that there had been a dual fatality in Rocky, I was in total shock and disbelief when I found out that John was one of those poor guys. John was the most wonderful person, he was as you said - serious, thorough, safe - he never took me up on a day that was not perfect. There were days that he did not make any money because the weather was not quite right (although it seemed ok to me) and therefore we would only do theory lessons and chat.....he refused to accept money on those occasions. It wasn't just his knowledge that made him a great instructor - it was his easy manner, patience and modesty - I felt totally safe and at ease with him. I am not sure if I will continue my training elsewhere sometime in the future, because as many have said - if it can happen to John it can happen to anyone, but also - finding another instructor with John's qualities might be a big ask. I know what John would say though - "get back up there....." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan3111 Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 Frog that was my first thought but after sitting on it for a while I now want to finish my weight shift license more than ever. Firstly as a sense of accomplishment and secondly because I believe if John heard the thoughts I was having towards trikes after his accident he would have given me a quick slap behind the ears. Unfortunately every thing we do is dangerous ( I ride motorbikes aswell) but when it comes down to it when your numbers up its up. Look at Michael Schumacher, he dodges death for a living for years and then knocks his head on a rock. It came as a shock today via Chris Brandon as I have been sending John messages asking him to finish my trike course before Christmas and it is not usual for John not answered in the next 2 hoursThere goes truly most serious and thorough guy I have met in aviation since in Australia, a forefather for the trike industry, flying France and England before and even crossing the channel He was the inly one I trusted in these F...g death trap machines... I think I'll leave it here with him and return to PPC I seconded your last statement , I drove north throw rocky today and was thinking of John as it was a week today when he passed .i couldn't be leave how hot and dry the hole place is up here and not the best as grass brown and death looking . Would be a lot of sink today due to the conditions the guy I'm staying with today at Mackay come to Grief a year and two day before John . He lived after a month in hospital he crash his Savannah due to the hot condions massive sink at the end of his run way . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 And John you probably saw it, from where ever you are, inly one day after you left us, I went into my Air Creation trike's propeller and it was a near miss,... the 200 virgins I missed, they mended me for a weekAnother reason for staying away from these death traps Dont do that John,... it hurts with the stiches I have behind my head, uk sorry I will shut up about trikes now... Better stay in bed Frog for the rest of your life Because everything thing in life is a trap for death And guess what, you can still die in bed Trikes are not death traps Just because John passed away in one doesn't mean they are death traps Who knows what manoeuvres they were doing, who knows what happened ? The only 2 that knew what reallly happened are not here to tell us. Although I had never met John in person I had discussions with him on this forum and I bet for a man that lived and breathed trikes with many safe thousands of hours under his belt he wouldn't like hearing you call them death traps You want to give them up? fine just please refrain from spreading gossip that isn't true 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 To all Microlight pilots, family and friends, attached is the funeral notice for John and the related proceedings, Julie (John's wife), her family and myself would greatly appreciate it if you could disseminate this information to the many pilots and friends and those who knew and respected John. At this incredibly difficult time your support and condolences have been deeply appreciated and on behalf of John's family, friends and greater flying community including Caboolture Microlights that John, Mark Gentry and Neil Schaefer fostered over the last 10 + years I wish to thank you NOTICE Dearly loved Husband of Julie. Loved Brother and Brother-in-law of Julie and Pete, David and Gary. Loved Son of Jeffrey (dec’d) and Margaret, and Uncle to Matt, Nat and Ed.Family and Friends of John are invited to attend his Funeral Service, to be held at 1 p.m., Saturday, 10th December, 2016, in the George Hartnett Chapel, 42 Gaza Road, Holland Park. Upon conclusion of the service, family and friends and fellow club members are invited to attend a Celebration of John’s life at the Caboolture Aero Club new clubhouse facility. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 hey hey half Jessupperhaps you'd like to explain why your backflip return to antique flying then? feel safer with a tail ? or mommy does? Its just because I am cheesed of trikes took john away that I call them so, John perhaps has changed his mind now since placed before the fait accompli this guy was not a CFI he was a guru as he could get in your mind and talk directly to your inconscient fears to tame them...I have not known many pretended CFI able to do so, ah and also he was altruistic to the core, not interested in money and that sets him apart as this oddity does not exist in Australia, the country of the fast quid Hey Frog I had 760 hours of great flying in trikes thank you very much And it was my choice to go BACK to 3 axis as I am getting older and didn't want to dress up in a freezer suit all the time Still love the trikes to this day even though I haven't flown one in 4 years And just for your info my last trike which was the first ever XT912 ever produced by Airborne plated 001 took the life of the new owner 14 months after I sold it to him because he stalled the inner wing turning final So yeah Frog I know what it's like to lose someone also And BTW was I reading correct earlier that those killer trikes tried to kill you by you walking in to the propellor??? If so did it start up by itself and chase after you or were just off with the fairys and tried killing yourself?? Or you just like to blame the trike for your own lack of attention PS I'm glad your ok BTW and thanks for sharing that as it could save someone else later on 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan3111 Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 After knowing John only 10 years it is still hard to come to terms he is got from us . I don,t fly tikes but may never have met him if he didn't,t fly trikes beside us . The southeast ale trike group will find it so hard next Saturday to get passed this and will take the shine off a while to came . I will do my best to be there to see him off like hundreds I,m sure will too, as was a friend to so many people . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 After knowing John only 10 years it is still hard to come to terms he is got from us . I don,t fly tikes but may never have met him if he didn't,t fly trikes beside us . The southeast ale trike group will find it so hard next Saturday to get passed this and will take the shine off a while to came . I will do my best to be there to see him off like hundreds I,m sure will too, as was a friend to so many people . Nice words dan3111 You were fortunate to have known him personally and for 10 years Yes friend it will be very hard for all of you next Saturday and my thoughts will be with you on that day Losing someone who is a friend and is so highly respected by many is like losing a relative The aviation community is a tight knit bunch and none of us like to lose anyone, it makes you realise how fragile life is and how quick it can be taken away and for reasons we sometimes cannot understand the how or why of it 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLA82 Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 Frog please keep all your trike bashing to yourself. Regardless of the cause or the fact you could only trust John there is a lot of people who are missing John and also amongst them a lot of current trike flyers. They need support and reassurance at a time like this not negative unfounded comments. 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinga Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 And just for your info my last trike which was the first ever XT912 ever produced by Airborne plated 001 took the life of the new owner 14 months after I sold it to him because he stalled the inner wing turning final These are trying times yet again when someone close to some of us has gone. Flying similar to Motorcycles (I have done both) is unforgiving in so many ways. In some of the posts in this thread I can hear the pain and disbelief as is the case in the early days of such an event. The quote above strikes a chord for me because I truly believe if there is one thing that is failing to improve our safety record it is this type of information, I have already said this but it is imperative that the cause of these incidents be documented and made available to others so that changes can be made perhaps even to a training syllabus to improve the chance of avoiding any future incident. Where would commercial air travel be right now if it wasn't for the efforts of the likes of ATSB etc working together with the industry in identifying and rectifying flaws in the system and making our skies a safer place, just look back at commercial air travel statistics going back over the years. Its not luck that it is now one of the safest forms of travel per person traveled. I believe if we want to change things then we need to start understanding the 'whys' and making some changes. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storchy neil Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 As an organisation what I feel is the need for a 5 man or women team made up of three experts on the aircraft and two that are not Do an inspection independently and do a written report The five CANNOT be held accountable for what he or she should find This is after the coroner has had there say Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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