Spill Resistant Refueling ??

[Blueadventures]

Looking good.

Fuel tank looks like 10 L - correct?

 

What length is the delivery hose?

 

I appreciate pressure will have a bearing but have you worked out an approximate delivery rate?

20 litre jug.   Wings 1.9m height; hose slightly longer.  Delivery is fast enough and controlled; not much longer than pouring it in but no effort.  When its done next time; when I soldered up the fittings, I'll time it.  Cheers

 

 

[Head in the clouds]

I think I've now solved the issue satisfactorily for my purposes, but it wouldn't suit everybody.

 

First I bought one of these -

 

 

from China for $8. It works very well and pumps a 20lt jerrycan in about 5mins to a head of 800mm. It uses 2 D cells and they supposedly last long enough to pump about 2000lt of fuel. the Chinese reckon they're safe for petrol as well as less combustible liquids and they're certainly very convenient because they only weigh about 400g with batteries so can be taken along for the ride if required.

 

BUT - I was standing next to the plane which was parked next to the boat and pumping petrol and thinking about the little cheap 3V electric motor running madly with its cheap little commutator and sparking brushes when I imagined the whole lot catching fire and that would be the end of plane and boat and a painful way to go for me, so I decided it just wasn't a good idea. I now use the pump to pump diesel into the 4WD, and to drain the spa filter and similar things, so it was a good purchase anyway ...

 

The next plan seems to be a lot better. I bought a couple of these -

 

 

and some fuel tubing, 1/4BSP barbs and re-arranged the onboard fuel pump/filter plumbing like this -

 

 

it ended up looking like the following pics if you can work them out -

 

 

and so now I can open the shut-off valve, place both 2 way valve handles in the down position, dangle the suction pipe in a jerrycan on the ground (therefore grounded) next to the plane, switch on the onboard fuel pump and the contents of the jerrycan end up in the fuel tank.

 

Once the refuelling is done I place both 2 way valve handles in the 'up' position and hook on the spring as a safety device to prevent accidentally closing one or the other of the valves, and I am ready to go 'up' flying. Closing the shut off valve at any time or configuration isolates the fuel tank as normal.

 

The onboard Facet fuel pump draws just 0.6A under full load and the onboard battery is 18AH, so the battery can run the pump for 30hrs continuously. It takes 10 mins to pump 20lt into the tank and the tank holds 55lt so to fill the tank from empty would take 30mins but uses only 1/60 of the battery capacity, so there's no worry about flattening the battery.

 

In reality I usually only pump 20lt or so at a time, it would only be more than that going on a longer trip when there is usually plenty of time getting prepared. Naturally when pumping fuel I need to stay around the plane so I have made a point of using the time to good benefit by conducting more thorough airframe and engine inspections than usual and it's paid off already, I checked the prop bolt torques between routine inspections and found they needed a little adjustment, and I took some slack out of the elevator controls which was immediately noticeable inflight.

 

The pumping might be a bit slow for some people but it works for me and now avoids quite difficult refuelling because the tank access inside the fuselage is not easy.

 

 

 

 

 

[skippydiesel]

Hi HITC - Seems like you have been on a journey of exploration and arrived at a solution that fits your needs - well done.

 

 

[Blueadventures]

Hiya Skippy Diesel and others,

 

I've read with great interest, the numerous posts after I wrote on 16 July about my refueling practices. I like your set up as pictured above and it appears very portable and stowable. Will the poly pipe deteriorate/dissolve, contaminate the fuel and be a significant impurity??. I guess the fuel filter will address this issue. Your thoughts please.

 

I finally trialed my home base refueling set up as per photos below. Its very similar to your arrangement and uses a AeroFlow AF49-1008 12v aftermarket fuel pump. The other components are car shop sourced and scrounged from other pumps. Time for transferring about 18 liters from jerrys to the Savannah's wing tank was about 2 mins. I could refine the set up including hoses into all 3 jerrys for a 60 liter filling station etc.

 

My initial response was that " Its all a'bit fiddly and not much quicker" than manual filling from start to finish. I use the 10 litre tuff jugs (I prefer the O'Neil brand as the 2 side handle allow easy hoisting and steadying whilst the jug empties). These jugs empty in about 30 seconds. Sure you have to refill say 5 to 6 times but its quick and enables filtering using Mr Funnel. This is fine for home base refueling. I use the 10 liter jugs as I can lift them and insert into the wing tank single handed. There is a 20 litre size of tuff jug but reckon lifting and holding this larger jug would less convenient/enjoyable

 

When away from base, you could take a tuff jug and Collapsible Bladders (CB) when the airfield hasn't a fuel supply. I don't use CB's as I fly solo and plenty space for rigid 20L containers or travel via airfields where Avgas is available).

 

Your system is compact though and easy to rig. You could hang the CB from the tie down point on the wing underside (or some other nearby point) and secure the filling tube end into the wing tank so nothing needs holding.

 

Anyways its been a very interesting topic to discuss and I appreciate the wisdom and experiences of others,

 

Regards Matt Walsh, Savannah 4295,

 

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Does your pump self prime and are the hose pickup and delivery 5/8" or 3/4" i.d.

[skippydiesel]

Hi Blueadventure,

 

Mattwalsh & I had arrived at very similar solutions to fuelling. I am still using my system to transfer fuel from 20 L rigid & collapsible (bladder) containers. So far no problems. Yes the pump is a self priming vane pump (similar to Matts). So far (about 4 years) my bit of off the shelf irrigation polly pipe riser (inlet pipe) has shown no signs of deterioration. I have used my system to pump diesel & petrol with equal success. Cant remember the actual sizes of the pipes in/out but 20 mm inlet & 10 mm delivery sound about right.

[Blueadventures]

I’m trying an Aeroflow like Matt’s. Being a rotary vane type I wondering if he is using a syphon hose foot valve (like a jiggle syphon hose) on the tank to pump hose to lift fuel to prime the pump. His pump looks to be within about 100mm of fuel level. That pump is not a suction type but may self prime quickly.

[skippydiesel]

The vane pump (Holly copy) you are talking about is self priming - no foot/non return valve or other systems (jigglers) required.

[waraton]

Old thread, any new products or techniques being used?

[skippydiesel]

14 hours ago, waraton said:

Old thread, any new products or techniques being used?

Sorry Waraton, no further "break throughs" from me - my home made system is still working very effectively.