Guest adamneat Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Hi all, I'm a relative newbie (pre-solo) with about 7 flight time hours under my belt. I'm keen to hear people's perspective on changing instructors (or flight school if need be) at this stage of your training. I'm happy with my school and their facilities but I'm not yet convinced that I've 'clicked' with my instructor yet - given I only fly once a month our relationship might still be in the growing phase, but, a few things over the past few lessons have made me wonder if I should investigate a change. Some background - I dont have any reservation on my instructors flying ability, but like all people, some folk are just better at teaching than others. Having read other posts on here along similar topics, I understand there is a need to have a good working relationship (if I can call it that??) with your instructor. So my question is this - what are other peoples experience in this area, and for the more experienced people on here (and hopefully instructors reading this thread), should I perserve and stick it out or? (another option is to move schools - not my #1 preference but my current school does have sister clubs). Thanks A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deskpilot Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 Hi Adam, Before taking notice of anyone on this site, you need to sit down with your instructor and fully explain where you're coming from and what you perceive as failings on his part. If he can't or won't change his stance, then by all means, move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest disperse Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 I've got about the same hours. But have simple gone with which ever instructor is available. So I don't really have a instructor, I have a school. This is good and bad. But the good things about this is as long as there is a plane and a instructor standing around.... I go flying (rarely ring and book). Somethings that I've struggled with have became instantly clear when put another way. And I understand The need to know WHY things work not just HOW. because if I know WHY, then HOW is just logical. Ultimately getting your ticket is just the start of the learning. Then the great instructor EXPERIENCE takes over. So the first instructors job is to teach you how survive long enough for experience to take over. But it's personal for each of us and this is just my take on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest brentc Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 I'm a believer in changing instructors if you are not 100% happy. Provided that the school has a set syllabus and you follow it at each lesson and meet the criteria to more forward, then you should not suffer. I found that by changing instructors I picked up more information that I don't think I would have got from the first. It also gives you a chance to learn from different teaching styles. Often instructor have the same 'spiel' that they continually use all the time and often repeat themselves. Another instructor will have a different spiel which is beneficial. It may be the unfortunate reality that your instructor only wants to become an airline pilot, is possibly working on a commission or hourly rate and possibly doesn't give a rats about you, your money and or your flying career. Sad but true. Also sad that they are probably teaching you things because that's the way that they were taught, but yet they may really not know why they are doing it in the first place. I think the only way might be to either talk to them about it, or try someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest airsick Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 I also think that even if your instructor is good it can be healthy to get different perspectives. I recall when I first started learning I had an instructor that I thought was great (not that way - :ah_oh:) but then she fell ill for a while. During this time I used another instructor and found that I learned a few things I hadn't previously known. This is not saying my first instructor wasn't as good as I thought, just that a different instructor can highlight different things which can be helpful. I would encourage using a different instructor if you think it will benefit you. As Brent said, if you are flying to a syllabus and the school has decent training records it shouldn't be a hassle to try someone new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Redair Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Make sure you know what your instuctor expects of you! Find out at the end of one lesson, what the next lesson is going to be about, then take the time you have before it comes around, to read up on as much as you can about that subject. Then if there is something you are not sure of you can ask for advice before your next flight. This will do 3 things, first it will mean that you have a good idea about the upcoming lesson, second it will give you a chance to clarify any details that you are unsure of, and have then explained on the ground, in a less stessful environment, and third, and this could be the most important one... it will show your instuctor that you are keen and that you are serious about flying. My reason for saying this is simple, I have listened to instructors talking, and a lot, (but certainly not all) seem to wait for the student to make the first move. This isn't because they are shy, far from it, it is because they want to know how serious you are about the job. Learning to fly is a two way thing, and a pupil who turns up with no preparation can be as off-putting for the instructor, as it can for a student who thinks his/her instructor isn't making an effort. I'm not saying this is how you are, but it is worth asking yourself, "Do I do all I can do to get the most from my lessons?" The trouble is, that this little snippet of information isn't often passed on to newbies, and so they may totally misunderstand their instructors behaviour. Having said that, some people just don't click, gel, or hit it off, so then is a good time to change instructors. By the way, my instructor... brilliant, can't fault the chap. Calm and collected, with the ability to seem totally laid-back, yet right on the ball the whole time. Most helpful to have a non-panicing instructor when you are losing it!! Redair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest adamneat Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Thanks everyone... as always, valuable information and thoughts. Redair's response is an interesting one - I'm trying to be open minded about it all, but your point about both sides taking it serious probably sums up my issue. I'll suck and see for this weekend coming and try to use the advice from the replies of talking to them about my concerns and then go from there. Cheers! ps: would it be non-kosher for me to ask people to list any recommended instructors in Melbourne (flying out of Moorabbin, Coldstream/Lilydale, etc)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazda Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 It's your money, so you have every right to choose your instructor. If you have concerns talk to the CFI of the school. Maybe your instructor is a young inexperienced one heading for the airlines and with little concern about students. Maybe he does care but can't get the point through to you. Either way, that is a problem he has and you shouldn't suffer from it. Perhaps the school will give you a different instructor or you could try elsewhere. If you have concerns about an instructor the CFI may even want to fly with you to see what you've been taught so far. Preparation is important and you could ask your instructor for some homework. The old Trevor Thom Flying Training Manual is good. Ask what you'll be doing in your next lesson and which chapters from the book you should read before your lesson. Ask lots of questions and make sure you get satisfactory answers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest adamneat Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Thanks Mazda. As for preparation - I tend to follow the syllabus provided by the flight school and read relevant chapters of their recommended book (the blue book from Aviation Theory Centre) for the preceding weeks before I fly. I guess to summarise all this - the problem comes down to the level of comfort I have that I'm able to get the most out of each lesson, rather than a criticism of the instructors ability or capability. Thanks! a. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Juliette Lima Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Hi Adam, Most people learn or take in information differently....some can be told, some need to be shown, some need to know the why before they comprehend the how, some develop blockages because of the personality of the trainer, or their own fears.....and so on. In the early days, I had great difficulty (much to the frustration of my instructor) learning to co-ordinate the three axis on landing, until I asked for three flights where the instructor did all but control the rudder, then elevator, then ailerons.....once integrated through feeling (could'nt take his constant verbals in), it all came together for me. Perhaps you can seek an alternative instructor based your perferred method of learning or receiving information.....its your money, your time and hopefully your enjoyment. I know of a couple of instructors locally, one a grumpy poo, and the other a kindly soul.....I know which one I will only take occasional flights with. Strangely, both have healthy numbers of students who swear by their individual methods!! Good Luck JL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest adamneat Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Given lots people took the time to read and respond I thought I'd reply with an update - I had another session this morning (Saturday) and I took "DeskPilot's" suggestion --> have an conversation with my instructor about it! I explained to my instructor my concerns and suggested we did things a little different and she thought it was a good idea. Thanks to all. cheers a. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deskpilot Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Good onya Adam, glad my advice worked. I'm so glad you didn't mention in your first post that your instructor was a female. You might have received a lot of prejudiced advice had you done so. Now, I'm sure, you'll end up the best of friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest adamneat Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Yep, unfortunately agree with you on the prejudice. I purposely avoided that point! Cheers a. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 both way traffic I did not realize the wind was so strong so I was both too low and too short in spite of having the right air speed about to turn in the final today. My response was to add up more power, but the Instructor PREVENTED me to do so THREE TIMES (!) just to make me see the tree tops in real and "teach me" a lesson. Thanks. Then he called for more power, shouting 'Put the power back, put the power back, more power please !' In 4000RPM glide and about to run out off options I knew, I had the Thruster T500 still stabilized in nice 50 Kt/4000RPM I said 'You have it !', and removed my feet....he surely did put the power right on and turned in the final that magician. So dear Instructors...if you are the nuts I am the son of a bitch !!....go for your life. Believe me, I am a nice guy and I try to please him always, it was a good lesson today anyway. He WAS right I WAS wrong, and he prevented me to add up power in order to demonstrate my approach was initiated from an incorrect way point, because had the engine failed I was too far away to glide in. This is very alarming recreational activity, I guess it keeps me young. Regardless of the difficulties I hope I grow old - that's the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest airsick Posted February 3, 2008 Share Posted February 3, 2008 I am not sure I like this method of teaching. If you try to apply power then surely this suggests that you realise you aren't going to make it. Proving a point by not allowing the increase in power early is just tempting fate in my books. The sooner you rectify a situation the less likely it is to become detrimental to your health (and that of others). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Juliette Lima Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Hi Tony, Bit of a scare for you !!....Just out of interest, where are you up to in your training ie. your hours so far, and if you are OK to say.....are you a young'n or a late starter? Take care JL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazda Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Adam, see the bl**dy women thread if you want to see prejudice against women pilots! Tony, I'm with Airsick. I don't think I would like the instructor to do that either. Too much can go wrong when you are close to the ground. Personally I would have thought it would have been better to show you how to solve the situation as soon as you recognised a problem. You obviously showed good judgment by wanting to put in power at that point in the first place. Just my thoughts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 I am a late starter (58), I have 40 hours on T500 taildragger, the strip is west of Brisbane. Athough I can do the take offs, fly in the winds, do stalls and do sharp turns I am still working on to hold it 'dead straight', not an inch left or right and on holding my height - within 10 feet. I cannot land it yet any way, nor the way he wants it. But, I have 2x 0.5hours of solo fast taxi runs (20kts), the second in light wind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Juliette Lima Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Thanks Tony, Reason I ask is that I started flying late (41 years)....that was twenty four years ago. I remember an instructor doing something similar to me....IE. "showing me the trees" problem was it was in a glider after a simulated cable break.....Apparently my reaction time was a bit 'daydreamy' or put another way I was'nt learning quick enough. My instructor, a volatile German gentleman decided to show me in no uncertian terms what ' fluffing' about could do...so he grabbed the controls, yelled a bunch of obsenities and something along the lines of me wanting to kill us both....and proceed to demonstrate just how close he could get to the treetops before plopping the aircraft on the ground. A few things came out of this....firstly I learned very quickly to nose down,speed up and turn steeply and quickly.....I also learned (compliments of my instructor) that for some reason or other, kids of sixteen years and a little older were learning to fly much more than quickly than I seemed to be.....sad but true for a late starter....I also learned a little German that day, however only stuff that would get my ears biffed if repeated. That was about four hundred hours ago in beautiful gliders and a couple of hundred or so in ultralights...Simple easy to fly ones like the forgiving Drifter.....Incidently if I had to hold height within ten feet in any moderate air I woul'nt be flying today.....dead clam maybe. Have you thought about a few flights in say a Drifter with another instructor....there are a couple of top guys in your area.....whilst mastering the Thruster is a worthwhile cause, and top marks to those who have done so, you might progress a little further with landings in an easier machine.....your instructor wont let you loose until he is sure....I took advantage of a number of instructors when learning on powered aircraft. Hang in Tony, you will get there. Best wishes JL PS. My German instructor is a top guy and I still have a coffee with him from time to time.....although his comments in his log book about me are less than flattering!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Juliette, I ditto on all that in your great input. Thanks for your support. There is a guy nearby who has 'Australian Lightwing' on nosewheel, I thought once I have the Thruster reasonably well, I should try that one. May be I should try the Australian Lightwing now for better....and yes Drifter is also flying around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Mc. Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Hi Adam, Sorry I am a little slow off the mark but I am just responding to your original thread.I have recently changed flight schools, I was flying out of Shep which is a fantastic school, perfect weather, unbeatable clubhouse and facilitys, new aircraft and above all A grade quality instructors! The only problem for me is that I live about 1.5hrs away (by car), which I was quite willing to drive for my fortnightly lessons, until a new flight school opened up just 10 minutes down the road from me (Wallan). I now am lucky enough to be able to fly out of a little airfield that has a nice new clubhouse, a gleaming new Tecnam (5hrs old, I was the first student to take her up) and the best part, 2 of my old instructors (A grade) from Shepparton are running the show. I did feel quite bad when I left the guys from Shep, but they all were great and understood perfectly, you Know what they said? "You have to do whatever suits you" Seems to be an echo I know (sorry) but just thought you might like to hear from someone who has changed schools mid way through trainning. Who knows I might be able to fly a little more often now after saving all that fuel money:) Doug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storchy neil Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 more money for flying hey doug watch for that storch there doug neil:hug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Mc. Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Think I may have seen you down there on the weekend Neil, was that you? Doug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storchy neil Posted February 6, 2008 Share Posted February 6, 2008 no doug neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Mc. Posted February 6, 2008 Share Posted February 6, 2008 Sorry, I saw a guy walking round his little storch Saturday morning. Nice neat aircraft,are they nice to fly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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