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12 minutes ago, turboplanner said:

Well as you would know the value of the opinion of a shareholder is limited to the number of shares he holds. What counts is what is allowed by the Limited Company's documents, so if anyone has concerns there, they should find a copy and then they'll know, whereas the value of an Incorporated Association is that if there was enough concern to carry a motion the constitution could be changed to reflect that concern.

I don’t care about laws so much, ETHICS are more important……human beings not using their position in RAA or any organisation for that matter, to obtain some financial advantage for themselves.

RAA being a unique organisation that has an ABN and is an incorporated  non profit, IF i have gotten that right?

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I did comment on a previous election, on the independent report on the Board, which showed 3 Directors were uncooperative or under performing.  I had hoped that they may have changed their attitudes. 

What you are talking about is how it used to be.  The Wal Mart or Supermarket method of selling is to make 2 or 3 cents on a $5.99 sale instead of selling it at $29.99 through a service retail sy

The first thing you do if you are going to import and sell a product is market research. Too many in the past have bought something they absolutely love and make an assumption everyone else will too.

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5 minutes ago, jackc said:

I don’t care about laws so much, ETHICS are more important……human beings not using their position in RAA or any organisation for that matter, to obtain some financial advantage for themselves.

RAA being a unique organisation that has an ABN and is an incorporated  non profit, IF i have gotten that right?

As much as you might care about Ethics, you have to check the RAA Ltd documentation to see if it excludes a candidate who holds an aviation position or owns an aviation business. If it does, they're disqualified as a candidate, if it doesn't (the more likely), they're not.

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In the past I would say YES. There's good and bad in that but at least they know what a U/L is and how to fly it. . Interests should be declared  by anyone who might be SEEN to have one..Nev

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The members elect the board.  I cant say that I was impressed that we threw ourselves under the ASIC bus because our biggest problem were the clowns that WE elected and that hasn't changed except the penalties for board members doing the job for themselves are much higher than under the toothless tiger of the ACT registrar of Cooperative associations.  Instructors, CFIs and business owners?  What would you prefer? A bunch of shiny arzzed lawyers and accountants busy building a CV or someone committed to the sort of flying we do?  What is an aircraft importer on the board going to do? bribe the other 6 board members to follow him down the road of malfeasance - that's not going to happen.

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By what I have seen those that import planes or other aviation equipment are enthusiasts. The sad thing is that they seldom make any real money out of the business, but their enthusiasm keeps them going. I know one person who imported one plane and was the Aussie agent for the brand. he didn't make one other sale, and that was not because it was a poor quality plane. Just too much competition and the big companies can make advertising work better for them.

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How many importers become agents for an aircraft and stock NOTHING, or can't get in reasonable time.  When I want to buy  something, I want it in reasonable time.

I phoned a supplier here in Australia for a plane to BUY and all I got was a long winded waffle about how there is no money in it blah blah.

Look, I was in business for 30 years and at times had in excess of $100,000 stock of miniature radio gear, I ended up with customers in 11 countries as a distributor and engineering support......ALL on my own, with Mrs in the office.

Today,  IF I started an Aviation Agency,  I would be in a 747 flying around meeting people to set up my agencies with, thats how I did it years ago in radio.

I would work out my plan, order $300,00 of kits 'n bits into stock and when I had it all.....open for trading and just do it.......be a good start 🙂

Would like to order in 4 Aerolite 103 kits and just bloody do it 🙂.  12 months wait on orders from them right now.

Importers here need to get off their arse an do some sales and marketing,  and sell stuff people can afford to buy......not super plastic fantastics full of ' Home And Away' screens 🙂 AND have stock that IF a prospective customer shows interest, THEN break his leg......get an order and a bank cheque of him and just DO it.

2 days ago, I went to Officeworks with my Mrs to get her a new iPad and was greeted at the door by a Drone (first impressions). I said  would like to buy an iPad please,  opening line was we don't have any Pro models in stock and don't know when they are coming. OK, what other choices are there? he i opened his phone and looked on to their WEB site and thrust the phone at me to look any it.......well my Mrs knew whats next......she bolted 2 aisles away!

I said FFS, you are a salesman SHOW me the actual units, Im not squinting at your stupid phone. I bought what I wanted and the nice counter jumper at the till asked if I had all I needed, I said yes but no credit to your knuckle dragger in aisle 3 who needs heaps of training 🙂

I could rave on some more......but the thought will give me depression......

 

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you should have just gone the JB hi-fi rather than wasting  your time in office works. 90% of what they have available for sale is now only available through their website and it is drop shipped by importers.

 

also, to be fair there are several aircraft importers at our airfield and I know they all have stock available for immediate sale so there are people who have the investment in the industry, the future and in sales

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7 minutes ago, FlyBoy1960 said:

you should have just gone the JB hi-fi rather than wasting  your time in office works. 90% of what they have available for sale is now only available through their website and it is drop shipped by importers.

 

also, to be fair there are several aircraft importers at our airfield and I know they all have stock available for immediate sale so there are people who have the investment in the industry, the future and in sales

Its a shame we don't have a list of importers WEB sites somewhere, none seem to advertise......guess its word of mouth.  JBs? NONE of our family will ever shop there, again after how I was treated.....their CEO is a SOS, NO skills of negotiation.

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1 minute ago, Kenlsa said:

6F926FF5-C6DD-45BA-A5EC-84F2066988E0.jpeg.1b59e07aedbb52ab1ceaab8634afa0bc.jpeg

 

I think this may be in order 

Ken

Been doing that all day since I got my Moderna Vaccination yesterday……

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The first thing you do if you are going to import and sell a product is market research. Too many in the past have bought something they absolutely love and make an assumption everyone else will too. They forget to ascertain the size of the market and the demand and what other competitive products are available. Then they either over capitalise or under capitalise. I reckon many get their clues from the government as they fail to have a business plan. As the saying goes "Failure to plan is planning to fail"

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1 minute ago, kgwilson said:

The first thing you do if you are going to import and sell a product is market research. Too many in the past have bought something they absolutely love and make an assumption everyone else will too. They forget to ascertain the size of the market and the demand and what other competitive products are available. Then they either over capitalise or under capitalise. I reckon many get their clues from the government as they fail to have a business plan. As the saying goes "Failure to plan is planning to fail"

I started my business, selling Directronix Viatel Teminals, NO research, $2000 capital, a secondhand car I bought and repaired  with magnetic signs on it. Running the business from a busted arse $40,000 house.  Cold canvas selling and marketing.

As I went, I saw more opportunities and followed them for 30 years.

NO qualifications in ANYTHING and had 30 years of FUN making money, now retired 🙂 

 

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3 hours ago, jackc said:

 

2 days ago, I went to Officeworks with my Mrs to get her a new iPad and was greeted at the door by a Drone (first impressions)

 

I avoid going to your local  Orrifce works... Your experience was a little better than mine... you actually got something you were after.. The next one up the coast is such a completely different experience...you wouldn't think they were the same company..

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Agree with Jackc. Very few kids have the faintest idea about salesmanship. Having said that, those that do understand won’t be working for office works.

 

 

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Anyone can slag off at any retail outlet and many do.

The people who work in retail outlets lead quite a traumatic life because of unwarranted abuse, often because the customer is asking impossible questions.

Talk to someone in retail and you'll soon realise that it's not for the fainthearted.

Since Officeworks has temporarily replaced CASA as the dartboard, this story.

A few years ago, I had to make an urgent trip without any notice to Mackay from Melbourne. Within a few days I realised I would have to live there for a while and needed a complete electronic office.

I went to Officeworks, and two hours later I had a computer, printed, equipment set up and transmitting around the world.

On another occasion I had to do a presentation in Benalla, which doesn't have an Officeworks. I'd forgotten to bring my mouse. After a two hour search around town, I bought a mouse in a gift shop.....the mouse didn't work.

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4 minutes ago, turboplanner said:

Anyone can slag off at any retail outlet and many do.

The people who work in retail outlets lead quite a traumatic life because of unwarranted abuse, often because the customer is asking impossible questions.

Talk to someone in retail and you'll soon realise that it's not for the fainthearted.

Since Officeworks has temporarily replaced CASA as the dartboard, this story.

A few years ago, I had to make an urgent trip without any notice to Mackay from Melbourne. Within a few days I realised I would have to live there for a while and needed a complete electronic office.

I went to Officeworks, and two hours later I had a computer, printed, equipment set up and transmitting around the world.

On another occasion I had to do a presentation in Benalla, which doesn't have an Officeworks. I'd forgotten to bring my mouse. After a two hour search around town, I bought a mouse in a gift shop.....the mouse didn't work.

Some people in retail are their own worst enemy, plus some are not suited to the role…..IF that is the case find a back of shop job for them, everyone has certain qualities and to make them happy and dedicated, employ them in that role most suited to them.  Turbs, don’t ‘ dartboard’ me……I have done more to help people on this Earth than you will ever know BUT I am quick to identify where solutions to problems are needed AND offer them…..

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5 minutes ago, jackc said:

Some people in retail are their own worst enemy, plus some are not suited to the role…..IF that is the case find a back of shop job for them, everyone has certain qualities and to make them happy and dedicated, employ them in that role most suited to them.  Turbs, don’t ‘ dartboard’ me……I have done more to help people on this Earth than you will ever know BUT I am quick to identify where solutions to problems are needed AND offer them…..

If it's any help, Officeworks is a Supermarket marketing model where you help yourself.

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Just now, turboplanner said:

If it's any help, Officeworks is a Supermarket marketing model where you help yourself.

 

Just now, turboplanner said:

If it's any help, Officeworks is a Supermarket marketing model where you help yourself.

Then WHY do they greet you at the door and ask IF there is anything they can you help with?

Dont want to help people? Then don’t expect good sales…..

I phoned  an Aviation supplier 2 days ago enquiring about one of their products, a significant cost item.  I asked a some questions that the salesman could not answer, I told him I need that information to enable me to make a purchasing decision.

He said he will find out and phone me today……they have been good in the past so I keep going back……I don’t care about the price…..I just want to buy stuff and be happy and make sure some of my ‘happiness’ rubs off  on those who care.

I try not to be bitter and twisted but admit it’s becoming a marathon in these modern times…….

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21 minutes ago, jackc said:

 

Then WHY do they greet you at the door and ask IF there is anything they can you help with?

Just helping you get to the correct aisle. The banks did that for a while too then just digitised.

21 minutes ago, jackc said:

I phoned  an Aviation supplier 2 days ago enquiring about one of their products, a significant cost item.  I asked a some questions that the salesman could not answer, I told him I need that information to enable me to make a purchasing decision.

He said he will find out and phone me today

Different marketing model at a lot lower unit volume level, were doing the impossible for a customer builds life-long clients.

I had a large national customer with a bad habit of going into Monday morning board meetings and making instant decision to buy millions of dollars worth of trucks, but not doing their research. Research time, costing time, calculation time, quote time prior to the computer age was about a week's work, but these people would phone up at 9:15 am looking for a 10 page proposal before the Board Meeting started at 10 am. I pre-researched, pre-costed everything they were likely to buy, got the weight and balance calcs down to 4.5 seconds, and automated costing came down to a few seconds. I could usually get the proposal in by 9:30 am. None of my competitors could get theirs in by under a couple of days, so I just got all the orders. Their need was an answer which allowed them to purchase what did the job, deliver on the day the new contract started, run for ten years on scheduled maintenance only and do the applicaton. They couldn't afford conversation time.

Capital equipment marketing is almost the reverse of the Wal Mart type retail marketing.

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18 minutes ago, turboplanner said:

Just helping you get to the correct aisle. The banks did that for a while too then just digitised.

Different marketing model at a lot lower unit volume level, were doing the impossible for a customer builds life-long clients.

I had a large national customer with a bad habit of going into Monday morning board meetings and making instant decision to buy millions of dollars worth of trucks, but not doing their research. Research time, costing time, calculation time, quote time prior to the computer age was about a week's work, but these people would phone up at 9:15 am looking for a 10 page proposal before the Board Meeting started at 10 am. I pre-researched, pre-costed everything they were likely to buy, got the weight and balance calcs down to 4.5 seconds, and automated costing came down to a few seconds. I could usually get the proposal in by 9:30 am. None of my competitors could get theirs in by under a couple of days, so I just got all the orders. Their need was an answer which allowed them to purchase what did the job, deliver on the day the new contract started, run for ten years on scheduled maintenance only and do the applicaton. They couldn't afford conversation time.

Capital equipment marketing is almost the reverse of the Wal Mart type retail marketing.

Proof that IF you put in the effort, you have a better chance of reaping the reward.  That principle applies to all sales, regardless.

Sadly, its hard to find a sales person committed to their craft these days, furthermore there is a need for specialisation of  sales people to sell specific products within a broad range of choices. Today we have products that have never been more complex in features and a consumer who wants  to know more even though they don’t understand much of it.

 

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12 minutes ago, jackc said:

Proof that IF you put in the effort, you have a better chance of reaping the reward.  That principle applies to all sales, regardless.

Sadly, its hard to find a sales person committed to their craft these days, furthermore there is a need for specialisation of  sales people to sell specific products within a broad range of choices. Today we have products that have never been more complex in features and a consumer who wants  to know more even though they don’t understand much of it.

 

What you are talking about is how it used to be. 

The Wal Mart or Supermarket method of selling is to make 2 or 3 cents on a $5.99 sale instead of selling it at $29.99 through a service retail system.

You are complaining about the lack of service, but there no longer is a sales service component.

The customers jumped off the $29.99 full service model and onto the $5.99 no service model in drives to the point where Coles can afford to build Officeworks stores in medium country towns all over Australia.

The profit comes from the turnover volume; the turnover volume comes from people buying something they can afford today.

This has also wiped out the service and repair industry which once existed to back up washing machines, refrigerators and vaccuum cleaners.

When you do a total cost of life analysis it's cheaper to buy a washing machine, then buy another one when a two dollar washer fails because the new one costs less than the repair with callout fee and labour.

 

 

 

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