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IBob

Another NEW Savannah S on it's way in NZ

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I had to come away from it for a bit, Steve, for various personal reasons.

Then I put the spray tent in last autumn, which totally bungs up the workshop, only got so far before it got too cold for painting, so shut the door again to wait for spring.

I see I began the build and this thread 2 and a half years ago. Seems longer. I'm hopeful I may see wheels off by end of summer.

 

What would it take to get you the other half motivated???

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Thanks, Perry. Doors done, some small parts to be done, then next week I should have the fuselage in the paint bay.

 

In the meantime, I like to see you guys flying over...it's very encouraging! That's assuming I hear you: these aircraft are surprisingly quiet...

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On ‎11‎/‎8‎/‎2018 at 8:08 PM, IBob said:

Thanks, Perry. Doors done, some small parts to be done, then next week I should have the fuselage in the paint bay.

 

In the meantime, I like to see you guys flying over...it's very encouraging! That's assuming I hear you: these aircraft are surprisingly quiet...

 

Perry flew over my house a couple of weeks ago (before all the bad weather came along) and I did not hear him either.

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Question:

How much oil do Rotax leave in your 912 for shipping?

 

Answer:

Approximately twice the volume of the pitiful container you have to hand, and into which you just clumsily dropped the entire sump union...sigh

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7 hours ago, IBob said:

Question:

How much oil do Rotax leave in your 912 for shipping?

 

Answer:

Approximately twice the volume of the pitiful container you have to hand, and into which you just clumsily dropped the entire sump union...sigh

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She has an engine!!

 

Looks brilliant Bob.  Well done.

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13 hours ago, IBob said:

Question:

How much oil do Rotax leave in your 912 for shipping?

 

Answer:

Approximately twice the volume of the pitiful container you have to hand, and into which you just clumsily dropped the entire sump union...sigh

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You've been working hard. It is great to see the Rotax in position!

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Question:

Did anyone else get ICP exhaust pipes like this, and if so what did they do???

 

Note how the pipe from cylinder No 1 on the right collides with the swept bend for the head coolant.

I have been able to fit the pipe by swinging the swept bend out sideways, instead of towards the rear where it should be, but will have to swing it further, as the current position gives just 0.5mm clearance between exhaust pipe and swept bend. I have ordered extra length hose.

 

No other builders/owners I have spoken to have struck this problem.

 

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It's been suggested that I might have the wrong pipes in the wrong side.

I've tried them the other way round and they won't go anywhere near the muffler. Also the left ones (front and back) are marked SX, which is Sinister, or Left in Latin/Italian. And the right ones are marked DX, which is Dexter, or Right.

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Could the muffler be moved to the left a bit (headers rotated anti clockwise viewed from the front ?

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If you've watched the series (or read the books)... you'd know that Dexter IS pretty sinister.

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Funny you should say that, Thruster: now the day cooled a bit, I've just been out doing a careful measure and mark up, loosened the pipes  and tapped them round a bit as you describe. I've picked up a little more clearance, but only a very little, since the closest point is at about 11 oclock on the exhaust pipe. So the exhaust pipe is actually more under than next to the coolant pipe.

But thank you for helping me think about that: it may be worth removing the coolant pipe, counting the turns, cleaning off the Loctite, and seeing if it will go in an extra turn when re-inserted.

 

I think if I can get sufficient gap that i'm confident the parts won't touch and chafe, that will be good enough.

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Marty, in this case I'm fairly confident that Right is wrong............(

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Hello Bob, it is nice to see you back at the build; I have thoroughly enjoyed the precise and astute commentary as your build progressed from day one. It was a treat to meet you and see your project in our visit to NZ in early 2017.  If you ever decide to sell, I want to buy it and fly it back home to Nova Scotia as the penultimate Savannah. 😊   It is going to be a winner.

 

     Your silencer and a few other things with your setupThis may not be much help with the exhaust clearance, but I've attached a few pictures of the pipes I installed on my 2010 XLVG (called a VGW here in Canada).  The curve in the your forward pipes appears to be a modified version of what came with my kit - both my forward pipes were (initially) straight from the welded joint to the silencer "ball end".  I added a soft "s-curve" to the left-side pipe to be able to remove the oil filter without having to move the pipe.  Since these pictures were taken (and 150 hours - or so - of flight time) much has changed - Silicone rubber coolant pipes to and from the radiator, a new proper set of plug wires, a different oil cooler and aft supports for the radiator.  Lots of other stuff too - maybe someday we'll have another chance to compare notes.

     I also had to remove, clean and re-position the coolant nipples but this was because the original installation of my 600-hour 912UL was on a bed mount in an Aeroprakt A22 (Foxbat). I'm sure you're already aware the Loctite is a specialized one for the coolant nipples and it softens up nicely with the application of a little heat. The nipples do not have to be "tight" in the position you want them when using the thread sealant, so, even by shortening the threaded ends by a few mm, you will be able to gain some clearance. 

Re-bend the pipes?     Shorten the coolant nipples?   You've got options!   (And Mark Kyle and the Aussie never seems to run out of great ideas if we do.)  

 

     All the trouble and all the effort is forgotten the moment the wheels leave the ground.  I suspect it must be like childbirth. The airplane is a true joy - docile, forgiving, responsive and predictable.  I've only been flying a few years, but it would have been many more had I had a sample Savannah flight thirty years ago (like the ones I had with Ken in Feilding and Pete in Masterton while in NZ in 2017). 

      All the very best,

      Canada Dan

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Hi Dan and thank you for your kind words. I'm pretty happy with the way the Sav is coming together, for a first try. (And I'm sure anyone who ever built one, or any aircraft, come to that, would do a few things differently second time around...not that I'm planning one!)

And thank you for the pics: it surely all helps add to the general picture.

Since my previous posts, above, I have made progress. In the case of the exhaust, I have turned the No1 cylinder coolant pipe out well to the right, and shifted the pipes as far to the left as they would go with available play. The result is a small gap between coolant pipe and exhaust, but enough to avoid contact and fretting, I hope: I will need to keep a close eye on this, certainly during initial running. (I will also be watching carefully for coolant leaks, as I have had to move two engine pipes and 3 pump pipes, and two in particular were moved several times.) That part was completed by purchasing and fitting an extra length of coolant hose from pump to No 1, as the original hose was now far too short. Should I have further issues, I will set about modifying the No 1 exhaust pipe.

 

With that done, I have been able to complete the remaining plumbing and wiring. And with the exhausts tucked so high, fitting the cowling was a breeze, with clearance all round. I am presently fitting the prop (so many things I have never done before, so much still to learn). I am waiting on delivery of the oil pressure gauge, the panel is all built and wired but still on the bench. Once I have that in, (and no doubt a number of other bits and pieces) I'll be ready for engine runs etc, then some time later I take the various pieces to the airfield and bolt them all together.

I'm deliberately not setting any deadlines, but I just the other day reserved the registration, and it's looking like i'll see air under the wheels for autumn.....)

 

In other local news, Perry is putting hours on his new S, Peter has begun the build of his (but only when the weather grounds his VG) and Hank has also made a start.

Good to hear from you and hopefully you're getting some sky time. Go well. IBob

 

 

 

 

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Looking good IBob.  Getting closer.

 

I was helping a mate during last week with his 5 yearly rubber and Annual with his Sav S.   After doing that I believe that fitting 90 degree connectors for the oil cooler would assist with the hose runs to the oil pump and the oil canister.  I'm going to try and source some for him in alloy during the maintenance he found some in steel; but heavy.  Its a shame the oil cooler has such a large diameter male thread connection as it limits the available items.  (On my Nynja build and the rotax oil cooler used allowed fitting the tight 90 degree connectors in their catalogue - under the ruler in image 844.)  

 

Regarding the longish radiator coolant hoses; the UK Skyranger people make a set of light alloy pipes that are great and at hose change time only need the short connectors in rubber or Silicone; saves the long rubber hose runs. (Grey pipes in images 750 and 778.)

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Plane is looking great Bob.

 

Those corrogated oil and water pipes dont really fuss me at all. maybe its fine. I would think ICP would have done a fair amount of testing with them to make sure they are ok but they are really thin and the vibration...dunno...think I maybe speaking through my bum again :).  They certainly make the install of the water and oil much easier thats for sure by the look of it. You have done a great install there. I noticed you have a few nylon cable ties over the water tubes on the rhs...maybe think about stainless cable ties or wire tie the parts as with the heat the plastic ties may fail quite quickly then stuff can fall down around the exhaust pipes

 

 

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Blueadventures, and Kyle Comms, thank you for your input.

This is my first and only build, so I have nothing to compare it with. What happens with those corrugated pipes is that they can be formed into surprisingly tight bends where necessary, and they just stay there. So they lend themselves to the manufacture of quite precise shapes, though I lost a fair bit of knuckle skin here and there, as some of those shapes have to be formed in situ if they can't be threaded in after forming, and you have to get quite physical with the larger stuff.

We were initially nervous about it here too, Mark: it first appears in the build for the fuel lines in the wings. But it seems to be surprisingly strong and durable, and we assumed that if it was failing we would have heard about it: my kit left the factory Dec 2014 and they are still supplying it. My other thought was that there must be considerable pipe losses due to the corrugations, but I guess they factored that in, and most runs are either short or low velocity.

 

The result, when combined with my unusually high exhaust pipes, has been very compact, and the cowlings went on easily with clearance all round.

Rubber replacement, when it comes, will probably see a few more barked knuckles, and will probably be most easily done by dismantling the whole lot (and there's actually not much of it) rather than hoping to reach in and do this pipe then that pipe. I guess I'm going to find out!

 

Thanks for the heads up on the cable ties, Mark. I assume you are referring to the ties on the larger pipes on the RH side? I will look for something more durable there. I went through bulk ties as I routed then rerouted, fastened then refastened stuff, working out how to fit it together mostly neatly. But it will be simple enough now to replace ties in vulnerable areas, as you suggest.

 

Blueadventures, yes the fittings on the oil cooler are surprisingly large. Fortunately the Sav has a prop extension up there, so there is more than enough room.

I like very much the look of those alloy pipes. I guess you could say the corrugated pipes ICP supply are a DIY version of that; as noted above, I'm hoping they prove as durable!

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