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Another jab down...pilot said the engine just stopped

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2 hours ago, alf jessup said:

His imaginary friend had jack to do with his survival, his skills taught had a lot to do with it as well as the aircraft design.

His running out of fuel is very poor airmanship, thinking I might make it is not a smart way to fly knowing you are eating in to your reserves.

Glad he survived it and will no doubt never run out of fuel again.

Yep I agree entirely. 

Imaginary friends who are ascribed great powers to save a life after the problem occurred but we're unable to prevent the disaster in the first place leaves a bit to be desired.

 

Would have made far more sense to invoke his powers and make the aircraft run on air or for fuel to materialise out of air or glide to the destination no matter how far away. 

Then the rest of us might actually start to think there might be something in this god story.

 

But as it is - life spared by virtue of a solid airframe seems to be the most likely explanation. 

 

 

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21 hours ago, fly_tornado said:

you would think by 2019 Jab would come up with a reliable fuel gauge.

I don't think anyone has made an accurate gauge, fuel flow meter measuring what has been used versus known quantity via accurate dip-stick or visually full tanks of a known capacity would be the best way of determining fuel remaining. cars, caravans and trucks are not reliable in tank gauges.

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Those Jabs must have,learned a lot from Austers.

 

Salvation Army padre to the North, Vic Peterson upgraded from a Tiger Moth to an Auster after he put the Tiger down in a coastal swamp near Port Keats.

 

He was heading into Darwin from the SW when, about 50 mile out, the engine stopped. Over dense bush at the time, he pancaked into the tree tops.

 

Escaping with just some cuts and bruises, he commented afterwards that :”I probably wouldn’t have been hurt at all if I’d done up my seat belt!”i

 

AUSTER...The Steel Aeroplane.

 

kaz

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No mention of his STUPIDITY in going without enough fuel.  totally .ILLEGAL as well. Atheists are at a considerable disadvantage , having no INvisible means of support to count on, when you brain doesn't work straight or at all.. Nev

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41 minutes ago, facthunter said:

No mention of his STUPIDITY in going without enough fuel.  totally .ILLEGAL as well. Atheists are at a considerable disadvantage , having no INvisible means of support to count on, when you brain doesn't work straight or at all.. Nev

We are at a statistical advantage ( not much but maybe a little)

 

A few years back a study got done in the USA to statistically look at outcomes from life threatening illness when people prayed for the patients. 

I forget who did the study or how good it's methodology was but the outcome showed a small worse outcome for those who were prayed for vs those who weren't. As a result it never got cited much after that but you can bet if it was the other way round we would never hear the end of it. 

 

The outcome difference was barely borderline statistically significant which means that it was highly possible the outcome was just a reflection of coincidence ( which in reality is what it probably really was) but it was on the wrong side of curve for any theist to claim anything positive for their argument. The outcome gives a little tongue  in cheek ammo for  skeptics though. 

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 There's been quite a few instances with some life- threatening in flight situation certain Pilots have mostly confined their activities to praying and nothing else. The Airlines involved don't usually use that as a ticket selling point and deny it happened but the CVR tells other wise.. Nev

Edited by facthunter

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30 minutes ago, facthunter said:

 There's been quite a few instances with some life- threatening in flight situation certain Pilots have mostly confined their activities to praying and nothing else. The Airlines involved don't usually use that as a ticket selling point and deny it happened but the CVR tells other wise.. Nev

I had this instance told to me by a military pilot instructor: (and yes he actually knew the instructor involved well)

A student of a particular faith was proceeding well through his course and had covered autorotations, when in the final stages of training they had an actual engine failure. The student at the controls folded his arms and said "inshallah" (god willing), the instructor beside him wasn't so keen with that response and took it from there.

Edited by M61A1
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2 hours ago, Jaba-who said:

Yep I agree entirely. 

Imaginary friends who are ascribed great powers to save a life after the problem occurred but we're unable to prevent the disaster in the first place leaves a bit to be desired.

 

Would have made far more sense to invoke his powers and make the aircraft run on air or for fuel to materialise out of air or glide to the destination no matter how far away. 

Then the rest of us might actually start to think there might be something in this god story.

 

But as it is - life spared by virtue of a solid airframe seems to be the most likely explanation. 

 

 

God doesn’t work that way, as many people have found out the hard way. There was a flood and a guy managed to climb on to his roof. Some time later an SES boat came past and offered to pick him up. “No thanks” he replied “I trust in the Lord. A second SES boat came past later and got the same reply. Later a helicopter noticed him and attempted a rescue but they got the same speech. The water kept coming up and he drowned and found himself in front of God. He let out a string of expletives about how he had trusted God and been let down. “What do you mean? You idiot” said God, “I sent two boats and a helicopter!

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You've never seen anyone pray so hard, as an agnostic who's convinced he's going to die within seconds.

 

I think the good minister represents that risky group of believers, who are "so heavenly-minded, they're no earthly good".

 

He needs to focus a whole lot more on the practical aspects of keeping on living on this Earth, whilst flying - which practical aspects involve keeping track of fuel burn and fuel reserves.

 

Then again, the religious fundamentalists have always had an indifferent attitude towards staying alive.

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I was asked to investigate the cause of a 6x4 fuel tanker crash on a Pacific Island. The driver was descending a steep hill, in top gear, when the brakes failed. The truck picked up momentum very quickly and the driver’s only action was to yell “Jesus save us!”, but the truck continued on, rolled over and he was killed. The passenger survived. I found that the air system had failed, but he still had a perfectly good spring park brake system to flick on.

 

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7 minutes ago, turboplanner said:

the driver’s only action was to yell “Jesus save us!”, but the truck continued on, rolled over and he was killed. The passenger survived.

50% right

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2 hours ago, ClintonB said:

I don't think anyone has made an accurate gauge, fuel flow meter measuring what has been used versus known quantity via accurate dip-stick or visually full tanks of a known capacity would be the best way of determining fuel remaining. cars, caravans and trucks are not reliable in tank gauges.

The Cherokee has a dream system with deep wing tanks and a measuring tab about half way down so you can visually check the available total fuel quite accurately, then deduct to usable etc.

 

What I have also done several times on difficult trips is arrange for the tanks to be left low the night before the trip, then fill with a known quantity before takeoff and deduct the fuel burn from that.

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2 hours ago, ClintonB said:

I don't think anyone has made an accurate gauge, fuel flow meter measuring what has been used versus known quantity via accurate dip-stick or visually full tanks of a known capacity would be the best way of determining fuel remaining. cars, caravans and trucks are not reliable in tank gauges.

It took me 6 months and a few calibrations to get my fuel flow meter working accurately.

But it's within a few percent of actual usage. "Quite accurate" would be the term I would use.

My gauges (2) are spot on at the calibrated 1/2 level and when the low level light comes on I have 10 litres left in that tank.

Cross referencing the flow (which has fuel used) and level sensors has given me very good fuel management. 

 

This company claims to have a level gauge that is within 0.5% accurate.

http://www.beliteaircraftstore.com/fuel-probe-system/

 

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37 minutes ago, onetrack said:

You've never seen anyone pray so hard, as an agnostic who's convinced he's going to die within seconds.

 

I think the good minister represents that risky group of believers, who are "so heavenly-minded, they're no earthly good".

 

He needs to focus a whole lot more on the practical aspects of keeping on living on this Earth, whilst flying - which practical aspects involve keeping track of fuel burn and fuel reserves.

 

Then again, the religious fundamentalists have always had an indifferent attitude towards staying alive.

You might find an agnostic praying but not an atheist... one has faith in a greater power but is not aligned to any particular flavour of earthy expression via a religion... the other has no faith. 

 

In the quarter second or so when I reduced the length of my Ute by nearly two feet in length and went from 90kph to nil I only had one thought - this is going to hurt and one word - starts with f but the software prevents me typing it here.  

 

I’ll leave it to you as to how I identify 

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This is a cheap and foolproof system, probably not casa approved but god would like it.

20190111_142640.jpg

Edited by Thruster88
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One Hundred & five litres.

Seems a lot for a 582 Rotax, Or do you do a lot of long distance flying ?. (20 LpH =5 hour)

spacesailor

Edited by spacesailor
missed whole sentence

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11 minutes ago, spacesailor said:

One Hundred & five litres.

Seems a lot for a 582 Rotax, Or do you do a lot of long distance flying ?. (20 LpH =5 hour)

spacesailor

It's the beech 23, 220 total, a lot for a little plane.

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8 hours ago, ClintonB said:

I don't think anyone has made an accurate gauge, fuel flow meter measuring what has been used versus known quantity via accurate dip-stick or visually full tanks of a known capacity would be the best way of determining fuel remaining. cars, caravans and trucks are not reliable in tank gauges.

 

This is what helps me.  I can look over my shoulder and see if there is fuel in the collector tank.  I have found on long trips when the wing tanks (2 of 104 litres total) are less than 20% remaining that the collector tank fuel level lowers due to refilling being slowed.  I believe the main contributing factor for this is due to the lower volume of fuel in the wing tanks being a lesser mass weight that does not force the fuel down the fuel feed lines between the tanks and the collector tank; remembering that the displaced air needs to go up these same lines.  I can see the glass fuel filters and observe the flow rate through them, as the delivery rate slows the fuel level within the filters lowers.  I have them mounted vertical.  I like to see things so I know what is occurring as much as possible.

 

This setup allows real time monitoring of the fuel situation and on two occasions I have diverted and topped up with fuel.  Once going to Watts Bridge and turned around and landed at Kingaroy for fuel and another time returning from Donnington and I diverted to Lakeside and took on some fuel.. Each time I would have had enough fuel but best to be sure.

 

I am going to change the vent setup so the air in the collector tank bleeds off via a dedicated line and that should / may prevent this situation of slow delivery of fuel into the collector tank.

 

Without this set up I could find a situation where the fuel is not delivered to the engines fuel pump in sufficient quantity from the wing tanks due to surging / free surface within the tanks and the engine will perform accordingly.

 

You can see the air / fuel level in the image and when the level reaches the alloy band the low fuel light displays and that is 5 litres remaining.  When that occurs I am in no doubt about how long I can fly for - about 15 mins at reduced rpm.

 

 

20181104_074039 Head set jacks..jpg

Edited by Blueadventures
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49 minutes ago, Blueadventures said:

 

This is what helps me.  I can look over my shoulder and see if there is fuel in the collector tank.  I have found on long trips when the wing tanks (2 of 104 litres total) are less than 20% remaining that the collector tank fuel level lowers due to refilling being slowed.  I believe the main contributing factor for this is due to the lower volume of fuel in the wing tanks being a lesser mass weight that does not force the fuel down the fuel feed lines between the tanks and the collector tank; remembering that the displaced air needs to go up these same lines.  I can see the glass fuel filters and observe the flow rate through them, as the delivery rate slows the fuel level within the filters lowers.  I have them mounted vertical.  I like to see things so I know what is occurring as much as possible.

 

This setup allows real time monitoring of the fuel situation and on two occasions I have diverted and topped up with fuel.  Once going to Watts Bridge and turned around and landed at Kingaroy for fuel and another time returning from Donnington and I diverted to Lakeside and took on some fuel.. Each time I would have had enough fuel but best to be sure.

 

I am going to change the vent setup so the air in the collector tank bleeds off via a dedicated line and that should / may prevent this situation of slow delivery of fuel into the collector tank.

 

Without this set up I could find a situation where the fuel is not delivered to the engines fuel pump in sufficient quantity from the wing tanks due to surging / free surface within the tanks and the engine will perform accordingly.

 

You can see the air / fuel level in the image and when the level reaches the alloy band the low fuel light displays and that is 5 litres remaining.  When that occurs I am in no doubt about how long I can fly for - about 15 mins at reduced rpm.

 

 

20181104_074039 Head set jacks..jpg

What size engine?

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14 hours ago, alf jessup said:

His imaginary friend had jack to do with his survival, his skills taught had a lot to do with it as well as the aircraft design.

His running out of fuel is very poor airmanship, thinking I might make it is not a smart way to fly knowing you are eating in to your reserves.

Glad he survived it and will no doubt never run out of fuel again.

 

   Yep ,as the old saying goes “on a wing and a prayer”........ Bob  

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To indicate how many people put their faith unconditionally in the GOOD  MAN ABOVE whilst flying on this planet, I was once  flying a devoted Minister of the cloth to conduct a funeral service at a country church & we were cruising above the clouds at about 8000'. Whilst cruising at this altitude the Minister was obviously in  deep meditation when he suddenly said ' I FEEL CLOSER TO GOD UP HERE'. I thought what the Minister had said for a few moments whilst cruising in smooth air, when the light bulb went on in my head & I then  said to the Minister, "See that fan in front of the plane going around, it is keeping us both safe & cool, but if that fan stops you will soon be closer to the devil than the  Man above".

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A robber broke into a house. A parrot in the house screamed “Jesus will get you!!”

He told the parrot to shut up.

Jesus was a Doberman.

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