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Turning Learning - with Rich Stowell

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Couldn’t agree more on what makes you turn.  Go and find any flying flea pilot - there are a couple in oz - and ask them how you turn a two axis aircraft.

The answer is you roll the wings to the bank angle you want and then pull the nose around with the elevator and when you get to where you want in the turn you roll the wings level and lower the nose.

 

Huge fun the little fleas because you can roll in bank REALLY fast and if they have enough power to hold a level turn the front wing as elevator can pull you around REALLY fast with noticeable G... fun to do and quite visually odd looking from the outside compared to normal three axis. 

 

Edited by kasper

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Unfortunately MOST pilots won't get the practical training in these matters. unless you make up your mind to do some of it. It may save your life.   It HAS saved mine many times.. The type of accidents we are having indicate more knowledge of" just what is happening  to the aeroplane" is needed. Nev

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Have to agree Nev.  from my experience there seem to be two very far apart groups of ultralight pilots. 

Those who use the planes for longer distance travelling vehicles with not much else and those who tend to pootle around their home area and seem to do a lot of circuits and general handling with occasional trips.  

 

And I’ll say it again - pilots who have flown and especially learnt on two strokes tend to be more aware of handling engine issues and dealing with outlandings than those who have never flown them.  

 

In my opinion  It all starts with the initial training - your habits are set really early in. 

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 You are only ab initio ONCE. If you are taught wrong it will stick with you forever. Like a house with weak foundations. It also affects your  "confidence". You know you can cope because you have been taught to and "been there" rather than told don't do" whatever " because it's dangerous and the plane is not certified for it. Nev

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This is rather like the old use of elevator debate. where elevator is said to control speed and throttle controls climb.

Now the video is saying the elevator controls turn, but there will be no turn unless the wings are angled and this is usually accomplished by using aileron, but can be done with rudder.

To turn correctly you need to use aileron, elevator and rudder and keep them all balanced.

My personal method is to apply aileron and rudder at the same time, with elevator maybe coming immediately after, but it is really one movement and difficult to really work out what you are doing without making a point of analysing it as you do it. Much the same as landing and analysing how your feet are working and finding out that there is much more going on than you think at the time.

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 You don't  use  completely fixed ideas about any ONE thing in these matters.. It's all in combination. Elevator controls angle of attack  of the wings, which then determines things like how much lift you get and WHEN you stall,, (where you don't get much lift anymore).

       Rolling quickly into and out of turns USUALLY requires a fair amount of deliberate rudder application  just leading or with  the initiation of the turn  or rolling out of it, to feel right. IN the turn the rudder should be neutral. pretty much. A BALANCE control at that stage.. The ailerons having placed you at the desired bank go to neutral, approx but IF climbing or descending you  take off  or hold on bank as appropriate. That's a complication we can ignore when discussing the elevators role in this, which is where we started.

      To turn you need more lift from the wings so back stick provides that.  The wing then provides enough  lift to keep  the plane at it's height AND (as well) provide the extra force to make it change direction (do a turn) . Back stick alone turns the plane if the bank is the" impossible to sustain" 90 degrees. only. At all other angles of bank, the connection is less obvious.. The inclined lift  is what turns the plane.. It PULLS it one way or the other when the aircraft is banked. IF you need more lift you need more POWER and another way is to have MORE speed (as well) L/D is a  fixed figure in these considerations if you alter speed  to keep AoA at the best figure. for efficiency and stall avoidance. (margins). Nev

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Yenn,

 

for the most part I agree - once you are flying you do tend to do aileron/rudder to roll the wings - rudder dealing with adverse yaw - and elevator at the same time.  

 

Abd for most most flights that’s ok.  The purpose of the video was to demonstrate that what makes the aircraft turn faster or slower is back elevator. 

 

This knowledge kicks in more if its ingrained at the times you want/need to close up or open up a turn.  If you use elevator and power to tighten up a balanced turn - eg on last two turns of a circuit - you are FAR less likely to end up in the skidded/slipped flight that is very dangerous to life and limb as it is slow flight in unbalanced state ending in spin/spiral. 

These demonstrations were part of my ab initio training where primary and secondary were taught and demonstrated. 

 

And roll ill wings then pull yourself around the corner is exactly how flying fleas have to turn - no ailerons.  And exactly how a flying wing works - roll in then pull up while balancing height with power.  

 

All exactly as the video demonstrated - it’s to show control effects and if you apply that knowledge in flight you avoid risks of other more risky control uses

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