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red750

Two injured in helicopter crash near Mansfield today

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Posted (edited)

A helicopter has crashed with one woman seriously injured just outside of Mansfield. A second person was treated by paramedics before being airlifted to the Alfred Hospital.

 

Emergency services were called just before 3pm today to Mansfield-Woods Point Road with six vehicles responding to the scene.

Two air ambulances were called to the property south of Mansfield to assist local paramedics.

 

The helicopter was a Robinson R44.

Edited by red750

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 Yes, I don't fly in them. Never have and probably never will.. Nev (er).

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22 minutes ago, facthunter said:

 Yes, I don't fly in them. Never have and probably never will.. Nev (er).

Robinson’s or helicopters in general.

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  Generally all of them, There's so much mechanically that can fail. If a particular "show " had a really good maintenance and training  deal I might just go if I got the ticket myself and flew it eventually. There's a tendency for pilots to get attached to their planes even whey they are "dogs". While I'll fly almost anything I want to decide when and where this will happen. When you are flying for someone else you must go unless there's a law being broken, pretty much. A few times in my life I felt I was pushing the odds and was keen to progress to better equipment. that at least could de ice itself and had reliable (Jet ) engines and a good airframe..I know chopper pilots love their "Kites" but if you do  a lot of hours the risk is there and the dots may just line up. . Nev.

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59 minutes ago, facthunter said:

 Yes, I don't fly in them. Never have and probably never will.. Nev (er).

Robinson helicopter is the fourth most popular type on the VH register behind cessna piper and amature built with 1188 units. They have a very good safety record. ATSB investigations show almost no mechanical failures. 

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Haven't flown in a Robinson, but have flown in a Bell 47J2 at least half a dozen times. Also in a Hughes (Schweizer) 269C flown by the late radio personality Bill Acfield, who ironically died in a car accident in 1977, and in the big Sikorski S61N Ansett had on Hamilton Island. They used to fly it to Melbourne for maintenance, and were giving joy rides at Moorabbin one day. If I win Powerball, I'll take a flight in a Jet Ranger and in a Eurocopter of some variety. 

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7 hours ago, facthunter said:

 Yes, I don't fly in them. Never have and probably never will.. Nev (er).

I’m with you Nev.

Would rather walk than sit my @ss in a Robbo of any type.

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Like any other flying machine, the R44 can bite you if you fly it outside it’s limits.

Flown properly its a very capable and safe aircraft.

 

 

 

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When you see how some of those cowboys (I use the term literally) fly the R22's in cattle mustering, as is often shown on TV, it's a wonder that not more don't crash.

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Good maintenance and training help but  the situation you operate them in is a significant contributor. Low inertia of the rotor system in small helicopters limit's  good recovery at low altitudes as well.. I'm not about bashing Robbo's. I haven't up to now mentioned them. For what they are they are OK. Their market success proves that.  Nev

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56 minutes ago, facthunter said:

Good maintenance and training help but  the situation you operate them in is a significant contributor. Low inertia of the rotor system in small helicopters limit's  good recovery at low altitudes as well.. I'm not about bashing Robbo's. I haven't up to now mentioned them. For what they are they are OK. Their market success proves that.  Nev

I believe that just in sheer numbers there are more accidents with Robbos than any other helicopter. Conversely, I believe there are more of them flying than just about all other makes of small helicopters combined. I have flown in Jetranger, Hughes 500, R44, Bell 47, Squirrel and another Bell of which I don’t know the number, up on one of the reef platforms. If I ever could have afforded it, I probably would have got the licence, as it is I have to stick with my little fixed wing CH701. Do I worry about dying in a helicopter? No! but I figure if you have to go, a few minutes of sheer terror beats months of cancer!! (Doesn’t mean that I want to go that way though!)

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Don't forget the entire contingent of US helicopters pranged  on the way to rescue the US embassy people in Iran. They were the best the US  could put in the air. There have been plenty of other military examples of issues with them. Russian stuff is  somewhat notorious. I really don't wish to upset the helicopter fraternity, but I'm consistent with my desire to have all attitude control so that's 3 axis fixed wing for me. Nev

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19 hours ago, red750 said:

Haven't flown in a Robinson, but have flown in a Bell 47J2 at least half a dozen times. Also in a Hughes (Schweizer) 269C flown by the late radio personality Bill Acfield, who ironically died in a car accident in 1977, and in the big Sikorski S61N Ansett had on Hamilton Island. They used to fly it to Melbourne for maintenance, and were giving joy rides at Moorabbin one day. If I win Powerball, I'll take a flight in a Jet Ranger and in a Eurocopter of some variety. 

We had a Kiowa (Bell 206 JR variant) make an attempted attack on our avgas bowser from about 30’ AGL on Friday. 

 

Nasty bend in the tail boom!

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The sentiment that Robbos are overly risky is just the helicopter version of the knockers who say Jabiru’s are risky. 

 

The actual fact is that given the numbers in service and the hours flown they are actually pretty safe. This is especially the case given so many of those hours are generated in the highly risky mustering environment. 

 

Yep, they are not as safe as some fixed wings or driving a car, but the overall stats aren’t as bad as some people make out. I have just under a 1000 hours in command in R22 and R44 and never had a major problem. 

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22 minutes ago, Jaba-who said:

The sentiment that Robbos are overly risky is just the helicopter version of the knockers who say Jabiru’s are risky. 

 

The actual fact is that given the numbers in service and the hours flown they are actually pretty safe. This is especially the case given so many of those hours are generated in the highly risky mustering environment. 

 

Yep, they are not as safe as some fixed wings or driving a car, but the overall stats aren’t as bad as some people make out. I have just under a 1000 hours in command in R22 and R44 and never had a major problem. 

If you take raw figures, all ATSB Reports which include incidents as well as accidents, the figures are:

 

Robinson R22: July 1984 to November 2018 - 126 = 3.5 per year

Robinson R44: 1994 to February 2019 - 75 = 3 per year

Cessna 172: July 1984 to November 2018 - 185 = 3.77 per year

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Posted (edited)

I think perhaps the helicopter haters above, have failed to inform themselves of the reasons behind this Robbie crash - it was a wirestrike. Pilot error, pure and simple, nothing to do with Robbie reliability.

Very sizeable numbers of Robbie crashes can be sheeted home to cowboy operation.

Typically, the bloke in the N.W. of W.A. who decided he could ignore the factory recommended rotor life and decided on his own bat he could double the recommended rotor life. He paid for that decision with his life.

 

https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2019/aair/ao-2019-031/

Edited by onetrack
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While this accident was not a fault of the helicopter, I tend to agree with the anti chopper sentiment. A few years ago there was a spate of accidents including a couple of rescue choppers. Those could mainly be put down to cowboy operators.

Now if you get the CASA advisories concerning airworthiness and things to check, you will see that probably more than 50% are helicopter rated.

Edited by Yenn

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This ATSB report is 15 yrs old now, but even in 2004, the safety of light helicopters, and Robbies in particular, was no worse than any of the other heavier or more commercial versions.

 

https://www.atsb.gov.au/media/36750/Light_utility_helico.pdf

 

One has to remember that Robbies are bought in big numbers, often flown to their limits in conditions that are regularly extreme, and owned and operated by rural property owners and employees, who quite often have a cavalier approach to aviation.

 

The helicopter played a major part in every area of the Vietnam War and the UH-1 demonstrated a robustness and reliability that was nothing short of incredible. Chickenhawk is still my favourite read. :cheezy grin:

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