Rotax 582 installation

[Thruster87]

I'm now considering putting a 582 on the TST instead of the 503. Which gear box + ratio + prop is the best combination.Mainly used for scenic short duration coastal flying below MTOW. Cheers

 

 

[eastmeg2]

I'd think you would use exactly the some as Airborne put on their 582 powered trikes.

 

Gearbox 3.47:1 (c = no electric start, e = electric start)

 

Prop: either 4 bladed Brolga with 17 degree pitch blocks, or I think with the Bolly props they now use it's the 3 bladed 72 inch diameter prop.

 

 

[Guest TOSGcentral]

I am afraid Eastmeg is a bit off the glideslope there. Ensure what you put on is approved for Thrusters under 95.25!

 

Here are some pointers:

 

1. Check first that you have an adequate boom. An early batch of TSTs came out with "thin walled" booms. Your boom must be 1.42 mm wall thickness at least. If less then no 582 I am afraid

 

2. The engine will fit straight onto the existing 503 mount. However this is unlikely to be off-set so you will require to fit a fixed rudder trimmer or put up with irritating co-ordination effects from the higher torque.

 

3. The engine is heavier so you will have to be careful about doing a forecast CofG survey to see if you have to mount it a bit further back. As most two seat Thrusters are usually well towards the forward limit anyway then the engine mount may have to go a little further back on the boom.

 

4. You can use the A. C. or E box. The C is very good, having the rubber shock absorber in the drive chain that saves the crankshaft in the event of a prop strike. The C box has nothing to do with the engine starting system and will take electric or recoil starters as these are at the other end of the engine. The E has the same shock absorber and is excellent. The starter moter is at the front (adding to forward weight moment) but this frees up the back end so you can have a back-up hand recoil starter as well!

 

5.Your prop set up should be 3.1 gearbox ration driving a 68" 3 blade Brolga running on 16 degree pitch blocks. This will give you 6400 rpm static and 6700 rpm in full power climb. This is the preferable combination for training. A privately used machine can go to 17 degree blocks which will not affect your airspeed, will reduce your climb very slightly but will improve your fuel economy a little.

 

Remember this is a water cooled engine and MUST have the factory approved additive in the coolant (that also contains lubricants). If you do not have these then the seals on the transverse shaft that drives both the water pump at one end and the rotary valve on other will fail and you will get water in the rotary valve oil bath. This will then start knocking out the transverse shaft bearings

 

To keep an eye on this - as part of your pre-flight glance at the small plastic reservoir high on the port side of the engine. The oil level should be remaining virtually constant (these engines do not use a lot) and should remain the same colour. Any paling indicates emulsification via water entry.

 

Use the same oil in the reservoir/bath as you use in your fuel/oil mix.

 

Tony

 

 

[Thruster87]

This is what is SOOOOO good about these forums Thank you Tony

 

 

[Thruster87]

What about the radiator setup? is it better to use the rotax single or twin or go OEM. Oil injected or pre-mix? Anyone have pics ? Cheers

 

 

[Guest TOSGcentral]

Gol for the standard two radiator set-up but ensure they are high rise not low rise radiators.

 

I dislike oil injection on principle! It adds weight and complexity to something essentially simple. The oil flow is so low that it cannot be accurately measured in terms that a pilot can read, so if the thing packs up your warning will be a seized engine and the subsequent bill (plus cost of whatever you do to it trying to get it down)!

 

Tony

 

 

[Thruster87]

Just got a price from Bert Flood 582 $5320.00 C box $1368.00 Twin Rads $695 + GST = $8121.30 + Brolga prop 68" 3 blade $905 Total including del is $9097.80 . Compared to 503 + B box total $5264.60 as I can use the existing prop.

 

 

[Guest micgrace]

HI Tony,

 

I'd have to agree on the oil injection setup as suspect. Just one more thing to go wrong. However, we are fast approaching the problem of having ethanol foisted upon us. This could be a problem when using premix, even though I consider that superior to oil injection. What's your thoughts on premix with ethanol mix fuels?

 

Micgrace

 

 

[Guest TOSGcentral]

I have not really formulated any views yet. I am basically waiting for some kind of stable standard to be established of fuel that we can confidently get from the pumps - plus - hard recommendations on the use of any such standards from the relevant engine manufacturer of the engine in use.

 

Tony'

 

 

[Thruster87]

Engine Lubrication

 

2-stroke oil specifications

 

Rotax recommends using a "super" two-stroke oil which corresponds to ASTM/CEC standards and/or API-TC classification. It is also essential to choose an oil which is designed for an air cooled engine even if you own a liquid cooled engine.

 

2-stroke oil type

 

For most Canadian users a mineral or semi synthetic oil is recommended.

 

Synthetic oil should only be used by those who operate their engine nearly every day. Even when shut down, air is constantly circulating through a 2-stroke engine; it is never sealed like a 4-stroke engine. Even though it has excellent lubricating properties, a synthetic oil does not effectively protect a stopped 2-stroke engine against corrosion: it tends to attract moisture and will run off the parts rather than leave a protective coating.

 

Mixing

 

If you own an oil-injected engine, you simply need to keep your oil tank topped up frequently. Otherwise, it is necessary to premix your oil and fuel. The ratio is 50 to 1, or 2%. This means you would mix 400mL of oil in 20L of fuel, 500mL for 25L, and so on. Using more oil than recommended would not help your engine in any way: it will accelerate the formation of carbon deposits which will eventually break loose and accelerate wear.

 

Rotary valve lubrication

 

The oil used in the rotary valve lubrication circuit of liquid cooled engines (462, 532, 582, 618) should be the same 2-stroke oil used for primary engine lubrication.

 

To be avoided:

 

• Oils whose label do not bear the above mentioned required specifications
   
   
  
• Oils primarily designed for outboard 2-stroke engines
   
   
  
• Mixing ratios other than 50:1
   
  

 

 

 

 

[Thruster87]

Fuel

 

Octane rating

 

We recommend using a "premium" type automotive fuel with an octane rating of 91, a minimum of impurities and little or no alcohols (maximum 5%).

 

Some may have noticed that the Rotax documentation specifies an octane rating of 90, based on the RON standards used in Europe. This is the equivalent of an 87 rating under the Canadian AKI standards. A rating of 87 is indeed considered "regular" fuel, but we still recommend a "premium" fuel for two reasons:

 

• First, when fuel is premixed with 2-stroke oil, the octane rating is reduced by about 2 points. An 87 octane fuel would therefore become 85 octane.
   
   
  
• Second, fuel evaporates and loses its octane rating when it lays in your aircraft's fuel tank or in a plastic jug. A "premium", 91 octane fuel will see its octane rating reduced to unusable levels after as little as three weeks. Fuel with a lower octane rating would obviously have an even shorter usable life.
   
  

 

Too low an octane rating will create detonation and pre-ignition which can damage the piston crown and even melt a hole through it.

 

 

[Thruster87]

The problem with methanol or ethanol, is that it resists blending with two stroke lubricants. Thus fuel mixed with oil in a tank do not "blend together." efficiently and effectively. Engines that use oil injection systems are not as prone to this gas and oil separation since the oil is added at the last possible instant, as the fuel enters the engine. Cheers

 

 

[Thruster87]

Hi Tony is there by any chance a step by step 582 installation manual/guide including the exact offsets for the engine mount for a TST. etc Cheers

 

 

[Guest TOSGcentral]

There is no manual for the task.

 

I did do a comprehensive article on changing over 582s for the TOSG Bulletin but that was mainly about changing over bits from the old engine to the new (there are a couple of tricky bits in doing that – particularly the gear box) but that should hardly effect you as you will be just be bolting an engine on.

 

I also did an expansion to a plain language ‘How to do a Weight & Balance’ paper that went through the steps of putting a heavier engine on a Thruster in the right place and you can have a copy of that if you wish.

 

The engine off set is fixed for the 582 rather than the aircraft model. That was also a free Bulletin hand out a while ago of templates by which to drill new bearers. I can also let you have a copy of that.

 

Remember to check your TST wall thickness is 1.42 mm as some early TSTs came out with thinner walls and 582s should not be put on these aircraft.

 

None of this is particularly exotic stuff, just that it is not normally available. That is what TOSG does for the Thrusters.

 

Aye

 

Tony

 

 

[Thruster87]

I've got all the bulletins issue- 29 2003 onwards.I'll go thru them again. Cheers [boom wall is 1.6mm]