Typhoons Vs Raptors At Red Flag

[willedoo]

Interesting articles about German Typhoons in close combat with F-22 Raptors at the last Red Flag.

 

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/07/f-22-germans/

 

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/07/f-22-fighter-loses-79-billion-advantage-in-dogfights-report/

 

 

[siznaudin]

I wonder what the current definition is of "close range" these days - 20kms?

 

With fighters weighing in at 30+ tonnes*, it's all very far from WW1 & WW2 dog fighting I reckon!

 

*Su30 Max takeoff weight: 34,500 kg

 

 

[willedoo]

I wonder what the current definition is of "close range" these days - 20kms?With fighters weighing in at 30+ tonnes*, it's all very far from WW1 & WW2 dog fighting I reckon!

*Su30 Max takeoff weight: 34,500 kg

I'd be just guessing at anywhere within visible range. Reading between the lines on those articles, the F-22 is no better up close (no surprise) but the problem is how to get close to it with an unstealthy aircraft. Looking at it from the other side, the Raptor doesn't need to get that close if he detects the other from outside visual range. All this assumes the Raptors missiles can work properly and hit the target, though. The Russian theory is a bit different, they believe it will always come down to a tangle at some stage, no matter how good your aeroplane is. Probably explains why they've never stopped dogfight training, they do it all the time. But it makes you wonder if all those combat maneuvers they pioneered in the Su's are only good for airshows, or if they really would work in a modern dogfight.

 

Cheers, Willie.