antzx6r

Hey guys, Sorry for the late reply on this one, but i've been tied up moving family between states. I managed to get there by car. It was my first visit to the great eastern and evans head for that matter. I've driven past many times and had no idea it was so close. It was a great event. Dispite the cloud cover, I still managed to get horribly burned. (All that looking up) Not much to add to the above except that the Trojans, Yaks and the Mustang with that amazing merlin roar provided fantastic low passes across the airfield. I got some mobile phone video of it that i'll try to post when I figure it out(let you know when i do). I took the oportunity to see what all the fuss is with the Drifter. Having only trained in Jabs and Tecnams, I have been ignorant for too long of the bugs in your teeth flying experience. Well no more! Wayne was kind enough to give me the front seat for my tif (though I'd never flown a tail wheel) and I have to say I was a little nervous on the very swift enter and backtrack on 18. But climbing to 1000ft my nervous over controlling movements quickly gave way to utter amazement at the uninterupted view of beautiful Evans Head. Looking down at the instruments was (virtually) useless except for checking engine performance. You really are flying by feel with the Drifter. I did a few turns as Wayne gave me pointers on how she flies. Then he showed me how the Drifter really performs and back to the airfield for a swoop down to the grass side strip and some amazing ground handling to finish up. I recomend it to anyone out there who like me thought the low inertia high drag(though the Drifter glides quite well I discovered) is only for the fool hardy. You really haven't experienced real flying till you've felt the wind in your hair. Go do it! Not many photos but here's a few. Ant.

Hey Pud, sounds like a great flight. I also just finished my x-country endorsement not many hours ago. My first solo nav was actually 2 attempts with turn backs due to weather closing in. On the third I had to divert to a coastal route around the higher ground to stay clear of cloud. Hoxton Park to Cessnock via Warnervale and back again. When I got to Cessnock there was a hefty xwind and my first approach was unstable and I just couldn't get it sorted all the way on final. I could just imagine all the eyes on the ground looking up at this tecnam waving wings all the way down final leg. So, much to my self disgust, I called for a go around and took a few deep breaths telling myself "I can do this! I have done this! It shouldn't be this hard!..." Round the circuit once more, set myself up on final with a slightly faster approach speed which took care of the gusty xwind. Flare and hold off was a bit longer as a result, but all in all I felt it was a text book landing. When I got back to YHOX, I was so increadibly impressed with myself. Every other flight I had done with my instructor went exactly as planned. This one required planning, replanning, diversions and decisions to not preceed with a sloppy approach at a foreign airstrip By My Self! :star: I was chuffed to say the least. I thought "this is what real piloting is all about." We all look for things that could have been done better (lord knows plenty in my case), but the truth of the matter is things rarely go as planned. If they do, great. But chances are they won't. It's the decisions we make to adapt and conduct the flight in a safe manner despite what nature and whatever else throw our way that make good pilots I recon. This is not to say there is no need to plan and prepare. On the contrary, planning is the single most important part, but being flexible, safe and professional in the way the plan unfolds makes you a pilot and not just a guy/girl that can fly a plane. p.s. Thats what instructors look for in the tests as well I think. Thats why they always throw in something unexpected somewhere in the mix. See how well you take it in your stride. Some instructors might like to add something here...

I'm from the other side of this discussion as it were. I started on the Jab and Tecnam (and Cessna for a bit)and now wish'd I had started from a low innertia tail dragger like the drifter. They teach much better balance control and exact flying. Now I probably have a load of bad habits and sloppy techniques to work on when I go on to higher performance taildraggers like the pitts and RVs which I always planned on aiming for. I have also now developed a bit of a curiosity about these little blow flies and want to know more. I might even go that way for a first ownership. My first sail boat was a little 19ft endeavour. You can't beat simplicity to learn and gain solid experience. So Kev sounds like the place to go. Given the choice now, I'd have gone that way to start with. Live and learn I guess.

I don't know if its all that dramatic. In the last decade or two "ultralighting" has come a very long way in terms of freedom to take the sport to whatever level we feel. And despite this, what has been asked of us? It remains as cheap as we care to make it. The only thing demaded of us is to be well educated. Our training is almost on par with PPL. No more hurling ourselves in the sky and hoping for a soft landing... So considering this I think we're doing quite ok at the moment. And the people in RAAus' left hand seat seem to have this fundamental idea well in mind when it comes to our future. I too am a little concerned by the idea of C150s and such coming from 100 hourlys by LAMEs to self maintained RAA regos. Its not a simple thing keeping a 40+ year old aircraft flying. Some thought needs to be put into this fact. I know similar age experimentals are flying around. But it still needs some thought. IMO

Wow... Anyone know what the 2008 costs might be? Its almost worth taking a holiday and getting the FAA license while you're there. Then do a conversion when you get back. Bit of a round about way of doing it, but I have a bad feeling that its going to cost me and arm and a leg just for a conversion from RAA to GA. I would also like to build an RV some day and also visit the factory. I could do the lot in one hit. Anyone with some inside knowledge?

Mmm... prolly not a great idea to take em up while they're on the sauce either, but I guess you knew that ay...

I think the problem cralis, is that history has shown a bit of a laps in the old self control for some with regard to flying ops and alcohol. We just want to make sure we send you off with the right attitude. Flying and drinking don't mix. More so than driving and boating etc. They really don't mix... at all. Enjoy a beer or 3 but have in the back of your mind that you need to be extremely alert for that TIF.

Ok... define GA. It gets thrown around here like its very nature is evil. A medical and L2 maintainence are both 'user pays' expences. No impact on anyone else. Besides, those things arn't bad things. Things change, grow, evolve... This is a good thing! Without it we would be hidden away in the outback somewhere, below 300agl, in rag and tub death traps(no regulation) slowly dying off with CFIT (or uncontrolled! not trained). We are evolving into the recreational side of aviation. We are no longer ultralight. That's just part of what we are about. If you want to be an ultralight organization, start a club. "Self regulation" is bigger than that. What we will never be is commercial. THAT is GA! :hittinghead:

I realize people don't want extra endorsements to make it more expensive for everyone, but if the extra expenses were limited to those with the endorsement, I can't see why this couldn't be implemented. What makes GA more expensive? The medical? A little bit but a couple hundred every two years isn't that much. CASA fees? Not really, I think its actually cheaper isn't it. Predominantly, it's the aircraft costs isn't it?!? So if you still fly a Thruster, it's cheap as. If you fly a Millenium Master, it's not so cheap. And if you have an aero endorsement, your insurance will be more, you might need a medical(pointless tho they are), the aircraft will need more upkeep costs and the training will cost a bit more. I can't see how this will mean RAAO will have to up their costs That much. CASA didn't have too, and they look after everything up to QANTAS level. For those that say if you want that, why not go to GA, well, I'm on my way that way, but... It is still recreational flying and I like the reletively low level of BS in RAA. It's like these forums. When the people feel something is needed, Ian listens and implements whatever the masses need. In casa, it has to go through various gov departments. It gets stalled because someones away on long service leave. It gets used as political leverage or for a personal vendeta against one of the back benchers. Then it gets put out to the general public for discussion(media have a field day). And finally, if it survives that, you end up getting something nothing like the origional proposal. RAA is much better. My ASIC only took a few weeks. And I stuffed up the original application. Anyhow, I just cant see how it would be different from say a formation flying endorsement. Just with strict rules on what aircraft, where and whatever else is needed.

I'm moving up to the Brisbane area in a couple of weeks. And like the above posts am looking to get a PPL conversion soon. Firstly, where are all the RAAus folk flying from up there? I'm looking for a school/club to hire anything from lightwings to Sportstars. Mostly HP types. My experience is Jabiru J160 and Tecnam golf though I would like to expand that experience so not restricted to those two. Whould be nice to do a tail wheel endorsment too. Secondly, Motzartmerv, I here you instruct at camden in a school with both RAAus and VH rego'd aircraft. Is there anyone in a similar position around Brisbane. I'm looking for a school that will look favourably upon my RAA hours and training to do the PPL conversion.

Oh, I vaguely remember something about certified engine as well. So a jab or rotax is ok apparently but a single cylinder lawn mower engine on a scout is definately not. Perhaps someone more knowledgable can expand.

Flight over built up areas is interesting. On one of my first navex flights we did the bankstown lane of entry. I asked my instructor "arn't we heading over a 'built up area'? He said "can you see somewhere to conduct a force landing?" There were a few playing fields and golf coarses. He said "so we're within gliding distance of a safe landing area then" To tell you the truth, I thought it might have been a solution like that. Otherwise all RAAus aircraft would have to go all the way around the west of the richmond military area to get up the coast. I suspect the same will apply to GAAP entry lanes. Also, a side point is that currently if the pilot holds a PPL, an RAAus plane may be flown into CTA if equiped with a mode C TX and radio. (I'm pretty sure) So it's only the RAAus pilot certificate that won't let us into CTA at present. Add to that aerobatics. :thumb_up:

I think the reason it wasn't done like this is primarily they didn't want potentialy incorrect manuals floating around the internet for the 'non tech savy' fliers to stumble across. It can still happen I know. But its less likely.

You do. This is just a thought on the tendancy to want to make the call earlier when the area looks (or sounds) busy. As Big Pete has already said, the more important thing I think is to have a good mental picture of the field, then visualize the aircraft in there positions as they call them. Calling too early will just make the area for which to visualize that much bigger. So for instance, someone calls inbound 15nm, you then have to rethink how long it will take for them to get where you next need to have them in sight. It just adds to an already confusing situation. I've been really working on this of late, because traffic around the ctaf in areas like Hoxton Park can get quite busy. And I hate being suprised to see someone nearby you didn't see till then. No real bad close encounters yet. But it only takes one. I say keep the calls as close to standard as possible. And no calling 10nm when you're only 4! This is hard enough as it is.

Conversly, if he'd known the area, he wouldn't have mistaken bridges (notice the vear to left to cross over top the wrong bridge) and slid straight down to join base 10L. Also, albeit less significant, if he'd had more time on type, he may have set up for slow flight more instinctively and had less attention drawn from looking out for the field. Any of these factors could have made it a non-event. Weather is is just the most unforgiving. And as a side point, the most fear inspiring. Hence the discussion.

I read through it and agree we should discuss the events and possible causes to get others ideas on it. One thing I noticed was that when he dropped below 1000ft the airspeed showed two distinct dips down to near 100kts. This is still within the envelope of aircraft but the fact it showes the dips tells me that being closer to the ground and close to cloud, he may have felt the terrain and cloud rushing at him. That together with not having sighted the airfield yet (getting worried) and thus not thinking to setup for slow flight may have led to a steep(er) turn with not enough airspeed to execute the turn. This poor fellows over confidence may not have been in entering the near IMC but maybe back in the planning stages (IMO). The compounded conditions (wx, low hrs on type, unfamiliar with the area) should have told him to leave it for another day(or later) or take someone experienced in as many of the three conditions as possible (or at least one). But after saying that, at the time of the broadcasts, it looks as though he has (a) not believed the tower when they told him he was over the wrong bridge and (b) turned in toward the bad weather and built up areas and brisbane CTA when he thought he'd over shot the field. There are some confusing decisions being made. A lot could have been done to ease the situation right up to the accident. Not to speak ill of the dead, but at 300 odd hrs I'd of thought just one of those decisions could have been made better and thus saved his life. I guess when things get busy, the mind has a hard time making the same decisions we would have made in a comfy class room or sunny day with the instructor in the right seat. Moral to this might be to build ones experience up to these types of conditions slowly. Don't think "I should be able to do this" and press on. I've been guilty of that myself. (In my defence, I do tend to chicken out of things I have been adequitely trained for. It took me three tries to do my first solo nav to an away airfield.) But it is something to keep in mind. Ant

It will be a sad day if CASA pull the type certificate on the lancairs. A perfect example of knee jerk simplistic reaction to a compounded problem. The fact that it's fast and requires proper respect and training shouldn't render it grounded. We see this kind of reaction more often these days. Kids are killing themselves in cars so we see rules on car size/type and log books and 3year provisional licences. Kids are still killing themselves. Gun laws are introduced because of the number of violent crimes. Now the criminals have easier access to guns and farmers and recreational hunters need to jump through hoops. Usually unsuccessfully. And of course there's ASIC cards and airport security. For a dominant species we really do make some childish decisions as a community. Individually intelligent but dumb as sheep in a herd. There are some good points comeing from this thread however. I remember an issue of Flying mag discussing VFR into IMC. It brought this idea of always having an alternate. If followed correctly, like Tony says, VFR into IMC... bollocks! You should allways have an airfield within range with VMC enroute. Why experienced pilots still get caught is a mystery. Maybe its a case of minor incursions on the edge of bad weather building up to the one that flanks you and cuts you off from home. Apart from maintaining our own vigilence theres not much that can be done. On the autopilot discussion. I'm a firm believer in being over prepared and capable of more than you plan on getting yourself in for. I'd love to Get IFR trained but the upkeep i think would be beyond my means for recreational flying (GA of course). So the only option is to just stay out of it. But good sence tells me that being prepared to survive if something beyond my control puts me there is smart. That doesn't give me a licence to be less diligent about staying out of IMC. Autopilots don't kill people, people(bad decisions) kill people.

Oops, I may have insinuated she (lou) was a man in my reply. Maybe I should have done more research eh?

Every time I here this type of explanation for various stuff, I get an immediate flashback to hitchhikers guide. If it wasn't so depressingly hard to get anything done it would be hilarious. I suppose you gotta at least smile.:clown:

However if a PPL examiner who also holds a RAA ticket does the BFR in a RA rego'd aircraft, that would seem to cover it. I could also be wrong tho.

What indications are there that the jet is even airbourne? flight instruments are small enough that a couple of pixels could be doctored to show any alt.

Congrats. I'm looking to do the same in the not to distant future. Interestingly, re: the trick questions, on my RAA x-country exam recently (pre the new ops manual, so may have been changed) I got one Q that actually gave two correct answers. Not a trick really. They were identically worded. I had to answer "B and D" and it was correct. I doubt CASAs cyber exams would contain the same qwirks tho.

When looking for a training facility one of my prerequisites was to be in a quieter(aircraft traffic) less populated area. I didn't intend never to train in a built up area, I just felt that as a new student, I needed to get used to flying the aircraft proficiently before dealing with crowded cts. I tend to agree with dopey kneejerk pollies in this respect. For at least ab-initio training, students should be taken to less crowded areas. By first solo, a student can still be overwhelmed by multiple radio calls. There is no real training for keeping your cool and your eyes out of the cockpit and keep situational awareness. Hell, at 70hrs, I still get overwhelmed. And this is something we as pilots/instructors can do to help the situation without relying on gov. or CASA or airservices to implement. Instead of just blindly following the masses closing airfields left right and centre, something needs to be instigated to keep the industry going. Like legislation that any funds gained from the sale of airports needs to be put back into building new airfields in less populated areas. Because it seems that councils have gone crazy with the idea of making profits from the sales. Sad that this kind of thing becomes political ammunition. Deepest condolences to all conserned. Of all the loses we experience in aviation, these are the most gut wrenching. When one so young is lost.

The trick to cheating tezza is not to tell anyone about it... She is a beautiful bird though isn't she.

Whoow, that was intence! Moving right along, Ian is quite correct. This is an interesting topic. The trouble is, there is a lot of smoke and mirrors and here say on what this thing is, how its going to be implemented and where. So it would be nice to here from some who have looked into it, and pass on some info on the proposed "deal". We don't need any "I heard from a reliable source" as it only adds to the confusion. Try to keep personal thoughts out of it. i.e. "its expencive so I don't want it". Instead try "I heard airservices want everyone everywhere to install it at there own expence. Is this true?" Lets become the most informed, not the most misinformed. Has anyone worked out how this is really going to impact on RAA (and all rec flyers - saaa) Are they proposing we all get cross-industry funding and is this going to be offered for the forseeable future or limited only untill airlines decide to stop funding when they get sick of handing out $10000 cheques? Helpful comments please. No pprune slandering matches.