FlyingVizsla

Just back from the CASA seminar on the 3 June changes where they covered this issue (who gives way in the circuit). The CASA guy said the circuit has right of way over anyone joining, eg straight in, joining base etc must give way to anyone already established in the circuit. So someone on late downwind about to turn base has right of way over someone joining base (who has to slow down or orbit or rethink his circuit entry).

However, they also read out something from the book of words that RECOMMENDS that lower class aircraft give way to higher class eg RPTs where safe and suitable to do so (my recollection of the blurb). I didn't get a chance to get the chapter and verse.

Sue

We were out at Childers last month and saw Chinoock 10-003. It's still flying and doing plenty of hours (unlike our Scout which is still in the shed awaiting work). As noted earlier 10-001 was reassigned to a later aircraft so this is now the second oldest 95-10. There were a lot of 25- registered Thrusters that have older registration.

Great to see these early types still punching holes in the air.

Sue

It feels like a favoured uncle has passed away, even though I think I have only seen him once or twice at Natfly, I know and love him through this forum. I hope others will take up the "greeting" role - it makes new members feel special and settles them into the forum family.

Farewell Good Friend

Sue

Northrup N9M.

Looks like a Jack Northrop creation. Northrop produced a range of flying wings with various power plants, one had 4 jet engines and 2 props?? More trouble with the engines than the design I remember. Way ahead of their time. I couldn't tell you the model numbers. There was a scale model produced for training - the boss would know - but he's not home till tonight so I'll show my ignorance.

Sue

A friend of ours has a Pulsar finished and flying, now back in the hangar doing nothing for the last couple of years. My husband's theory is that the rudder is too small which contributed to a number of frights the owner got and now he seems reluctant to get back on the horse. He'd probably sell as he hasn't flown in ages and seems to have taken up other interests. Lovely plane to look at, sleek and slippery, more of a handful than the C172 though. Suggest you fly the Pulsar a bit before deciding.

Sue

The picture in Wikipedia looks pretty close. So I am now putting my money on the Horten flying wing. My husband who would know, and probably tell me the whole history and who flew it and where, and why, and how often, and their mother's maiden name; won't be home until tomorrow and then gone again. Would love to know half of what he does. So the Horten is my final contribution.

Sue

I'll be landing at Emerald that afternoon (I am being a back seat driver on QLink) so if you're there I'll wave, but I won't have time to do much more.

Good Luck for the rest of the trip

Sue

We are "absent members" as we live about 7 hours drive from Childers but our Secretary is a forum member, as are a number of other Club members. We did get to the January meeting where the date and bones of the event were finalised and flyers were to go out to all clubs after that, (I got one after a bit of prompting in March) but I do agree that there should be a bit more co-ordination. Notice it is mainly the women who think to do this?

The unintended outcome is that flyers can breakfast at Childers, compete at Gympie and lunch at Maryborough. We can't make it due to work committments, but we wish all three clubs well.

Sue

Reflective strips - they are used in Australia, generally on cones - but CASA don't approve of them and want supplemental lighting. I was being pressured by a Rural Health group to put them on one strip I was building because they thought it would be a cheap and suitable solution for NVFR.

Basically they fail because lighting must be visable from about 5(? have to check) NM out. Reflective strips only work when there is a light directly on them. The other issues are when landing small aircraft, landing lights illuminate the area directly in front. The lights about 30m apart need a wide splay to reflect back. We toyed with ideas for car headlights stationed along the outer premieter at 45 degree angles to light the strips to allow a take-off, but it would not allow a landing. RFDS were not keen either, especially as the alternative was solar flares - I did a deal with a nearby mine (its the safety of YOUR guys here, you're the biggest users, how about some community support?) and got them to foot the bill for the lights. I personally did the install - they came security bolted on rubber mats which were tent pegged to the ground which was hard enough to bend the pegs. Didn't stop the slasher driver turning a number into splinters and I lost 4 to theft - mainly the red/greens - my theory is they are mounted on a mobile grain bin so the harvester can find it during dark all night ops. I threatened to do a night flight during harvest to see if I could spot them. One white was stolen by a guy living rough in the bush for lighting. When all was forgiven in town he came back.

Sue

Looks too bulky to be a Horton - maybe a lighter modern variant? I was thinking it might come from the Silent Glider family - they had a non motorised, no tail, pod like thing that could have wings attached from other companies. Years since I saw it. Might even be unmanned, or the pilot (about my size) got in from underneath. You've got me thinking.....

Sue

Bloody hell Sue,Great post, nice contribution, I was so impressed I copied and saved it, thanks ... you did half his assignment.

David

We are looking at buying and building our own airstrip in the near future. An airpark or near an existing town airstrip would be a solution but the better-half does not want to be beholden to any bureaucracy that could curtail or regulate his flying. Besides that we need soooo many hangars.

Sue "bespoke airstrips to the landed gentry"

I guess he's doing one of those "problem solving" subjects so beloved of Uni Engineering degrees now-a-days. Trying to get kids thinking "out of the box" rather than just regurgitating conventional techniques and considering all the other gear around it. Key words are "cheap" "no funding". Great idea but it seems at the expense of practical engineering. But then, when I did Engineering we seemed to spend a LOT of time doing maths we would never use again. The practical started when you got a job.

Any cleared, smooth reasonabily solid (no bull dust patches) bit of dirt would suffice for a landing, but once you start considering it as the town's life line for heavy expensive aircraft there's a whole new set of rules. IE isolated during floods - has to be above water, servicable and with access to the town. I have fought with townies wanting the strip relocated to "over the creek" who don't understand that the 1 in 10 yr flood means they can't get to the strip and supplies can't get to them and the 1 in 100 yr means they will be sitting on their roof rather than safe and dry at the strip awaiting evacuation to the rellies.

RFDS aircraft are getting more expensive and naturally they want to make the best use of the donated dollar and not unnecessarily risk aircraft. I would hate to be in their shoes, balancing need against risk. They (or their insurance company) have been known to sue for damage to aircraft caused by wildlife and stump/rock/surface caused damage. It forces Councils to maintain their non-income producing airstrip.

Sue

If we're counting I got 1,434 views and 63 replies - and that was before the Lady Killa comp on NES. To be truthful it was really the taildragger vs tricycle argument I stoked up, not my gender, fleet of aircraft or my lithe, youthful good looks.

And to that Charming Planney ..... :heart:I am still willing to swap that highly desirable, powerful Wheeler Scout Mk1, beloved of grassrooters everywhere complete with Pixie motor and lapsed rego for the Flying Dog sans fleas, object of my desire on page 7 :heart:.

Sue

Here's a thought - Have breakfast at Childers hosted by the Isis Flying Club at 7:30 (see events calendar) then on to competition in Gympie.

The world revolves around RISK. In the case of old belts or pallets, or other materials - if they are unproven you are not likely to get RFDS to be the guinea pigs. They were legendary for landing on anything, but now have to be careful because the aircraft cost $millions now. Your biggest problem there is securely fixing them in place. The axial and shear forces at the commencement of landing roll are substantial. Look at the "skid" marks. and the prop is not far off the pavement so any deformation may cause a prop strike. Any innovative design has to be signed off before insurance will cover the risk. Usually require a CP.Eng so there is someone to roast when it all turns to mud.

Being a low use - emergency strip it may only get a cursory inspection in the dark before the plane arrives, not good for finding the weakening fixture or the subsiding base. and these belts are u/s for mining ops so what is wearing through? steel cross plys? Might be better using a recycled product like shredded tyres if they have worked out a way to bind and spread and done some R&D on it. You can pick up some reclaimed bitumen road where the reclaimer has munched up the bitumen surface into a gravel like product but you still need to bind it to stop it flying around in the prop wash damaging the plane. There have been some innovative solutions using local materials - Torres Strait used crushed coral - pretty unenvironmental now but it worked.

Right up my alley - have built a few in remote Qld.

First - consult the ALA requirements page on the RFDS website. You're a Uni student so I'll leave that research to you. Mostly they are similar to the CASA requirement CAAP 92 (1) (1) for an unlicenced airstrip. Approach, transitional slopes, distance, width, obstacle free areas, day vs night requirements, into prevailing wind. The weights of RFDS craft are also there.

Next decision is how "all weather" do you want it? What materials are available nearby (CBR rating of gravel, crushed rock, quantities). Look at subgrade and geology, quarrying approvals & royalties. I know Cunamulla, so I won't be giving you any easy answers, you will have to work this out - it is an assignment after all - some effort on your part.

Pay attention to drainage. The strip may have to be built up to get the desired slope to shed water or you may have to build diversion drains around the airstrip area. You may have to make a decision between the cost of bullet-proof all weather and a strip that is out of action for a few days a year.

If your building material is of poor CBR you could consider stabilisation with either lime or flyash pozzolanic cement. Decide on the surface type. Grass is too sparse in SW Qld. Unsealed will need resheeting constantly and I know gravel is hideously expensive out there, but so is bitumen. There is a low cost seal using a black soil treatmemt which Main Roads trialled on several roads I built - this is insitu stablilisation with a tack coat, geofabric followed by a bitumen seal. Cheap and good if you can keep the water out. Looks like an unmade bed after floods and has to be ripped up and started again. Usual road building - optimum moisture, mixing, rolling to get best compaction, final trim for smooth ride.

Conventional bitumen seal (asphalt is far too expensive - and forget trying to use bits of bitumen left over - you'll be building for years 'cos contractors don't bring extra - you order 32K litres that's what you get). The cheapest is a double double - two seals on the same day. The 2nd precoated cover aggregate should be half the size of the first and about half bitumen. Cutter should be reduced using this method over single / single as the cutter won't have time to dissapate. Weather must be right for spray. Use a rubberised bitumen as the occasional use won't be sufficient to feed rubber into the surface and it will get brittle quicker. A bitumen seal is flexible.

Maintenance - grass surface needs slashing, gravel needs dragging usually with a metal frame pulled by a tractor to knock over tufts and fill in holes - watch for rocks/stones and remove, bitumen needs resealing every 7 or so years and crack & weed repairs and broom (stones destroy props and pepper the skins). Keep cattle off. Fence & grid?

Lighting - kero soaked dunny rolls or cotton rags in half drums (takes ages to set out and light up, also a fire hazard), battery "flares" (again setting out time, checking and replacing batteries usually 9v), solar powered "all ways on at night" lights (see SeaLight, Avlight AV70's - I did a couple of strips for about $20k - $25k - last 20 years, replace batteries 3-5 years), PAL lighting (very expensive, standby power, mains power underground, radio shack etc). Car headlights are a desperate life or death option only. Lit wind sock - can also be solar powered.

Furniture - gables, cones or tyres painted white. Wind sock, black circle under (old cover agg or bitumen). White signal signs. No need for line marking, piano keys or runway numbers. RFDS appreciate turning nodes at each end of the strip and a hardstand area where they can start up without throwing up stones and ambulance/vehicle can park and off load patients.

You'll never get out of it for free unless everything is donated. Remember there are some grant moneys available from the Commonwealth for regional airstrips and Council may come to the party particularly with gravel sources, plant hire, bitumen and the locals can do chook raffles.

Sue "airstrips while you wait"

Welcome Reggie,

I am bringing that big bottle of Tawny Port up - you can have it for Breakfast! I'm sure there'll be a few from this Forum coming your way chasing it. There's more happening at that Breakfast than what's on the Events on this site - could you tell the Boys and Girls a bit more about the entertainment etc. And Guys, Childers is a great little grass strip, lovingly maintained by the Club.

Don't tell the boss - I have found a new plane and I am in intense negotiation for it here http://www.recreationalflying.com/forum/just-landed/94139-new-girl-town-7.html

I am offering to swap our Scout for a younger model Flying Dog - I am assured he has no vices.

Sue

Though it is not yet confirmed, if, I was to tell you guys, that this lovely lady is looking to give away to a good home a C152, a Rans S7, a Karasport, a Lightwing, a drafty Scout, as well as share a bottle of devine 12yr old whiskey with someone that appreciates her, simply for the kind person she really is, what would you all say.

"Send photo of plane."

Planney,

:heart:I love it, I love it, I love it - can I have it....please???

(and I am adding to Flightygirl's totals here ... what am I thinking?)

Sue

Funny thing, most "Just Landed" get about 5 to 10 replies and perhaps as many as 10 "viewed". Along comes "flightygirl" and we have 44 replies and 744 viewings!Talk about bees to a honeypot - (no offence flightygirl)! Or was it just the passion for Savannahs?

Onya flighty girl & welcome - has Darky introduced you to our Social Group Flying Gals?

Sue

Take it to a JP or Commissioner for Declarations at a Council office or other office (real estate, bank etc). They will photocopy it and endorse the copy "I hereby certify that this is a true copy of an original which I have sighted" date, sign, stamp and number the copy (and charge you for a photocopy). This makes the job easier for them than having to compare original to photocopy before certifying.

Sue

JP (Magistrate's Court)

in & for the State of Qld

I did a bit of checking on the RAAus register and found at least one 10 and 25 registration with the same number - 10-0280 Seabird Rouseabout and 25-0280 Drifter. So I might still be able to have the number again.

It is a MkI Scout No.128 with the Pixie engine. Husband is about 100kg so he must have found it hard - I am about half that so I expect it will perform better for me, provided I can reach everything. We are a long way from actually getting it airborne.

Sue

How long is a piece of string .....

First start with where you want your hangar and then contact the airport owner - for country airstrips that is usually the local Council. You are usually looking at

• Rates
   
   
  
• Insurance
   
   
  
• Services
   
   
  
• Infrastructure
   
   
  

Experiences at different airstrips over many years:

Council said we could lease a minimum 900m2 lot at the airstrip. Rates would be $1 per m2 per year to be reviewed yearly ($900 - no services), minimum $10million public liability insurance. Cost to survey and lodge plan with Council $2,500. Building application & inspection fees $180. Failed because we could not get public liability because the aircraft was an ultralight (totally uninsurable back then). Lease was 20 years after which Council resumed ownership of the hangar we built - had to have concrete floor with structural steel embedded - ie could not pull it down and take it away.

Council offered to rent a hangar to one person for $400/month, he then shared with 3 of us. Spent about $5,000 renovating Council hangar - 6 months in to 2 + 2 yr lease Council resumed hangar and demolished it for more parking - no compensation. Assume Council held the public liaibility insurance. Moved to another hangar and it was sold from under us and our lease was null & void.

Council leased an area of land to the Club for $10 and required $1million public liaibility. Members maintained the strip (mowed, painted, cleaned toilets etc). Members built hangars which could be bought and sold amongst themselves. Council reviewed lease and decided to up insurance to $5mil, each hangar owner had to pay an additional $500/pa. Next year it goes to $10 or $20mil. If lease is not renewed all hangars become council property.

Applied for hangar site - lots of beaurocratic fiddling for a year. Finally lease written by solicitor arrived - $$$'s of work to build sealed apron, 500m x 4m taxi way & drainage. Hideously expensive requirement to connect power, water, sewer and telco (all over 1km away) - and this was just an open shed to shelter 2 aircraft! $20mil insurance, and talk of more work for $$s for perimeter roadway - very frustrating dealing with people with no idea of aviation. Got out of it cheaper by buying the block next to the airstrip and building own parallel strip & hangar.

Couldn't get a hangar on airstrip (none there and not allowed to build). Attempted to buy freehold adjoining airstrip and enter through adjoining fence. Failed because Council deemed our single ultralight hangar to be a shed too large to be considered on a residential block (1,700m2 block) - offered to buy the next block to make it 3,200m2 all up - but could not budge anyone. Would have paid rates of about $2,500 per year incl garbage etc.

More about what you can do may be contained in the town plan for your town/city/shire. Some Councils disclose their fees in their annual budget. For an example see http://www.centralhighlands.qld.gov.au/council/documents/Fees_Charges/2009_2010/Airport_Charges.pdf

This Council offers hangars for rent from $40 per week shared to $60 for a single aircraft 'igloo' hangar. Itinerant - $15.80 per day, $1.20 per hour. Plus landing and parking fees.

Building a hangar - depends where you are and the land owner's requirements. Any shed catalogue should give you prices. Looking at the one that arrived today $16,800 would hold a C152 with no doors. Closer to the coast you need a higher cyclone rating and in exposed areas a higher wind rating. Expect to do a concrete floor. You need a building application and inspections and on-going rates or lease.

Alternative - if you can find a farmer with a strip and spare shed you might get out of it cheaper. We have a portable hangar which consists of a frame and a tarp. The whole thing cost about $4,000 and easily fits a C152, but needs to be tied down. It can be pulled down and transported on a trailer and put up by one (with some ingenuity) but it is not an acceptable solution for Councils. OK to keep weather off. It can be permanently attached to footings and clad with colorbond or similar.

Alternatively get an aircraft with folding wings that can be trailered.

So how long is a piece of string? Anything from free to over $100k.

Sue

Current owners of 3 hangars, 1 trailer and 1 nice farmer's shed.

Our Wheeler Scout is presently in a shed - so I was looking into refurbishing it in the interests of preserving the early 95:10 aircraft. Despite the statement that numbers are not reallocated the number 0298 is now on a 25 Thruster registered 2/2/89. The Scout was first registered 27/6/88 and the last registration slip I could find was valid up to 26/6/1991. The Scout does not appear on the cancellation list either.

So I guess, for a short period the number could be allocated to both 10 and 25? Also guessing we won't get 10-0298 back.

Sue