Louis Moore

Kyle, you just convinced me to join the airforce!

 

 

Sign me up for the first kit, I am in cause it looks AWESOME

 

The standard tail also means you can do away with the mixer boxes too! Where did you plan on placing the engine, also is there a real purpose to the large sections connecting the two wings, would it not be lighter and easier to just use struts?

 

 

Well done, what an awesome day for you. One for the log books!

 

 

Have you guys thought about moving your state closer to the east coast so I can attend!

 

 

Hello Tom, The older motors were rated at 85hp, the later ones, only 80hp. From my observations most of the thru-bolt problems occured after they went to hydraulic lifters, though there are reports of failures on the solid lifter models as well. We will now have to wait to see if the 7/16 threaded thru-bolt alleviates the problem. This could take a while since they were released late last year. Regards, Bob

I was told the same thing RKW at a Jabiru information evening for L2's a number of years ago. The presenter said that the majority of issues with the engines have come about due to the hydraulic lifters that Jab have installed. They went to hydraulic lifters due to the industry complaining about having to re-adjust tappets every 25 hours. If memory serves (I do not work on Jabs all that often and this old, second hand info that might have been twisted in my mind over time!) he said that the lifters had a tendency to over pressurise because they were designed for holden engines and not jab's (no idea how true that is, like I said second hand and old information!). Both continental and lycoming tried engines using automotive parts suppliers for ease of production, both engines where pretty big flops!

 

 

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/more-news/pilot-killed-in-fiery-plane-crash-in-hallston-gippsland/story-e6frf7l6-1226343705535

Eric great job. Well documented too, I wish I had done something like this when I was learning to fly!

 

I am sure it will be a useful resource for others wanting to learn who want to know a little about what it involves. Keep up the good work!

 

 

Eric, I think Kyle has it right. Wait till later and Tomo will probably run over and give you a hug

 

Nice buy too, well done and enjoy the new plane

 

 

I should probably clarify what I mean- Generally it's not uncommon these days to see car engines go 300 000 k's without any work other than oil , filter & plugs (cam belts if fitted), which would roughly equate to 3000 hrs, how many piston aero engines see that without work.

Matter of perspective on that one! It is such a common argument, the automotive to aerospace comparison of mechanical parts and to be honest your comparing apple to oranges. Easiest thing to do is go and look at the Auto engine conversion being put into aircraft these days, they fair no better (in fact they usually do a little worse) than the designed for the purpose aero engines. That in itself should be a clear indication of the fact that the operating enviroment that exsist in front of your aircraft firewall is vastly different to the one in your car bonnet!

 

I think it also worth while to note though that I know MANY engines flying today that are well over a 1000 hours on condition and still running very strong. I also know engines that have been overhauled a couple of times that are running the same cylinders, pistons, crank etc... from new and not having any real issues. It's just the fact we have a mandatory overhaul period for aircraft that makes it appear aero engine will not last long, which is not true!

 

As for the jab engine banter going on, I know very little about it so not really going to jump in on that one Agree something needs to be address but thats about it! I will say this though, I read a book about pipers early days and in the original taylor's and eventually the early cubs they were flying they expected to get a WHOPPING 3 hours of the lycoming engines before they would fail. Even reading the biographies of the early aviation pioneers it would seem engine failures were par for the course of your daily flight! The jab engine was built in 1994, and from my understanding it is mostly the later model engine with issues? Teething problems are common enough with a new engine, it took continental and lycoming many years to sort their GA engines out. I am sure Jab will get there!!

 

 

I'm pretty sure every non-US citizen has to apply through the TSA's 'Alien Flight Training' scheme since the 9/11 stuff?

Yes it can, and in a lot of cases it even applies to US citizens to. Usually they waive it for Australians if your not learning in a university style of structure. But that is not a major deal to go through even if you have to, if you hold an RA Aus license they will usually wave it also. They waived it for me considering my Australian PPL

 

 

The SD-1 seems like a neat bit of gear

 

 

Just did a quick search on hire rates in the USA and they are still far cheaper (in same cases half the price) of what they are here.Most C150/152's are $70-90 private hire and 172's are $90-120. Dual rates for most 2-4 seat aircraft are $120-$190.

Flying is cheaper in the states, there is no doubt about it. Even the maintenance is cheaper, when I was and A&P you HAD to complete an annual in a specified number of hours and for a fixed labour price agreed upon PRIOR to starting the work. For most aircraft it was $600-$900. Fuel and aircraft are also cheaper, but thats only because there is a lot more of them there.

 

Yeah it's real cheap, I was thinking about doing PPL there, problem is the special visa requirements & schools that take foreigners with these visas seem to charge more.

Gnarly if you just went on a three month tourist visa you could do your PPL at any flying school with out needing special requirements or it costing any more. BUT BE WARNED having an FAA PPL is not the same as having a CASA PPL. You would still need to sit the CASA PPL examination and a PPL flight exam out here to hold an australian license. Also the training requirements for pilots state side are different to those here (they work on a different syllabus).

 

 

Welcome Sally,

 

Look forward to hearing about your aero endorsement, although I think you mad!!!

 

 

For the engine I was thinking a Briggs & Stratton 23hp unit; reasons being readily available, good aftermarket support and relatively low price. Drive would be direct.

Great job on wanting to build your own Boingk. Look forward to finding out what you decide upon.

 

I am not sure about the B&S engine though, 23hp is not a lot to get you in the air, others on here will have a lot mor info about that though!!!

 

If your looking for a quick to build aircraft I think you would need to go for a fast build kit, otherwise it is going to take time to complete the project!

 

 

Is VMAX the same as the newer V-Power from Shell? There is a Shell station close to me and I would love to be able to use it instead of having to drive elsewhere!!!!!

 

 

Deskpilot, what program is it you use to build the designs?

 

Well done by the way, I think it looks like a great little machine, would love to see it flying.

 

 

Might have to run the wheels down the asphalt next time I'm in the area !...........................Maj...

Let me know when your going to do it Maj, will get some aerial footage of the event, then follow you in

 

 

OME You know I will have to disagree with you. I don't suggest that silastic or such under the cylinders is a good idea especially if it hardens before you tension it.

OME I have to agree with Nev. While I am not a supporter of the approach I fail to see how a side effect of it is going to be something as drastic as broken through bolts. Even though it can prove to be impossible to torque down correctly with the compressible liquid there if this was huge issue wouldn't you expect it to result in cylinders coming loose?

 

There is story that yanks had all sorts of issue when they first started playing with Merlin rebuilds, so they sent a bunch of brit engine fitters out to give them a hand. Apprantly the issue was the brits rarely used a torque gauge and assembled the engine all by hand and feel.

 

 

We had better be careful here. The "pinging pinking" or preignition is usually survivable but can lead to detonation if it is prolonged. It can occur at low revs. When you leave your car in top gear at too low a speed and open the throttle. It's a fairly heavy metallic rattle not inlike the diesel knock those engines exhibit when idling. I suppose you could regard Detonation as severe pinging. It is an uncontrolled rapid (explosive) burn happening far too early. The peak pressures go off the scale.Detonation can take the side out of pistons, push the valves into a new shape shorten conrods break blocks, smash the top out of pistons. Break Jabiru crankcase bolts? ( The holes in two stroke pistons are often a melting process which can result from detonation, or lean mixture, as a lot of heat results from it also).

The thing about aero engines is the steady, continuous high load and that means things get bad real quick. Nev

Nev, Preignition is not pinging. Preignition is the fuel being ignited by means other than the spark plug earlier than it is supposed to, usually by carbon deposits, hot spots etc... Pinging is just a non technical term for detonation. We simply assume detonation is more severe because it has a more destructive name Severe detonation, severe pinging same thing.

 

The point I was making is we should not assume our engine will get detonation for a brief period before destruction occurs. If it is severe it will end quickly, if it less severe it can take a lot longer. There are cases of people putting Jet A1 into piston engines and flying for a number of hours before the mild detonation occurring finally made the fan stop.

 

 

Merv, the biggest problem with detonation is the fact that it is nearly impossible to pick up in an aircraft when it is occurring. The images you see in the PPL and BAK theory books, with the hand pushing on top of the piston to demonstrate normal combustion and the harmer smashing a piston down to give an idea of detonation, in fact even the very name gives the misleading impression that it would be accompanied by rough running, loud noises, shaking etc... While in extreme cases this can be the case, if the detonation is so bad you can feel it shaking your plane about, your engine is mere seconds away from self destruction!!

 

When I was big into sports cars I used to tune them right on the edge of detonation, which is fairly common and when you had your foot down hard in top gear or were lugging the engine up a steep hill you could here the detonation occurring in the chambers. It is nothing more than a deep metallic sounding knock in the engine, hence it being called engine "pinging". Sounds like someone is tapping a 20c piece on the inside of the cylinder walls I guess and the engine note drops a couple of octavies when it starts also. It is actually not a big problem if it is only occurring on occasion, if it is prolonged thats when you start to get issues!

 

In an aircraft, wind, prop, headsets (Especially now most of us use ANR) really aid in drowning the sound out!

 

Again just to be specific, detonation will necessarily cause fast/instantaneous destruction of your engine (this seems to be the general opinion of most people, that detonation will only happen briefly before your engine goes BOOM!). It can occur on a mild basis for a long time, I would run my vanguard engine for MILES with mild "pining" drumming away without severe side effects (Like when I was climbing up the big hill on the bypass near Wollongong). Eventually it will ruin your engine, melt a piston, snap rings or maybe even brake a through bolt! But it can be occurring every time the engine is under heavy load etc... for a number of hours before finally causing failure!

 

Mr Fix it has a fairly detailed page about knocking so I will add the link.

 

. We baby them all the time. And run them hard in the cruise at 2800-2900 and never stooge them around at low rpm.

As a note about knocking it will usually not occur at low RPM, normally it is when the engine is "working" or "lugging" that it begins to start.

 

http://www.misterfixit.com/deton.htm Mr. Fixit

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engine_knocking Wiki Page

 

 

I don't deal in metal, but I handle all the rest of your hardware needs. I often can reduce the cost of imported parts a little bit as I am min abetter purchasing position than a person buying one-off.OME

Do you get perspex sheet in at all OME? How about dangerous goods, looking for silver butrayte non taunting UV protection dope for fabric.

 

 

Sounds like it was a great trip and really good event. Any photo's Kaz? Wish I was there

 

 

Not sure Woorabinda would be a good camping spot, according to the net the settlement there is one of the most violent in Australia with around 45% higher malicious attack rate causing hospitalisation than any anywhere else in Oz! Would make it very interesting, but like you said you might not be allowed to take off again!!!

 

Is an amazing looking strip though.

 

 

Then maybe you should take it of from here as well.

Would agree Zibi and I have tried. I forgot my log in and have emailed them several times to retrieve it and ask them to pull it off to no avail!!!!!

 

 

Sounds like they did an excellent job. Well done to those guys involved and the people teaching them. Goes to show with the proper training and re-currency checks people are able to handle even the most adverse situation safely. Bet your glad you do that training with your guys Merv, well worth it.

 

"The through bolt on number 3 has failed."Sooner or later, either a student is going to face that situation, and may not react as well, or the row of trees and power line will be higher, or the paddock will contain a deep ditch ...... the list goes on, and we will have a fatality.

 

This issue has gone on and on for years, with regular forced landings featuring in the monthly magazine.

 

It doesn't say much for the administration of RAA

Don't want to be a pot stirrer but seems a bit pessimistic to me Turbo and also overlooking the fact that a well trained and prepared pilot was able to asses the risk of the power lines, paddocks and tress and put it down safely. Sounds to me like he made the perfect choice and really flew the aircraft down, did not just a fluke it and walk away!

 

If the obstacles in the path where higher, or there was a big ditch in the paddock in this situation I would think the pilot would have opted for another landing zone and still survived.