rrogerramjet

Dear mr Ramjet, on your avatar it says you sometimes land hard ! I hope this is a joke because bad landings are not acceptable and everyone should strive for perfect landings or go around ! Don't drop it on ! Seriouslely it could be your problem ! Seen people do crap landings and smile saying " how's that " answer is " are you serious ! That was bad "

Hi @Camel of course it's a joke. Are all my landings perfect? No. Thanks for the armchair instruction though.

Cheers

Ramjet

Hey fellow aviators,

I thought I'd provide an update for those interested. Basically, I feel so soured by my experience that I stopped flying. I simply could not face one more flight with the sneering 'I found some other minor error with your flying and you are never ready for a test' instructor. (See my previous post)

It's cost me double what I had anticipated, and since my hiatus I can see even more hours 'wasted' in reinvigorating skill and technique. Who would have thought that an instructor who is recommended as 'good and thorough' would scare someone relatively competent completely off flying altogether.

My view is that it has been a lesson in milking, personality conflict, and ultimately an instructor who is a pilot, but not a great teacher, motivator, or mentor. Basically someone who can teach, but with some questionable attributes when it comes to being a quality instructor, sharing knowledge in a way that imparts growth and skills capability on the student, not " that's wrong, that's not how you do it" (see my previous posts again)

So to that end, now I have managed to save some more money, (which should have been attributed to aircraft purchase not PPL!) where to get my PPL?

I'm in Canberra and have have considered FlyOz in Cowra but they run Piper aircraft. I'd really like to finish off in a C172 CS prop. Any recommendations?

Thanks again,

Btw I'm going to Cess nock , see you there!

Roger

Not sure mate, so long ago. I was based on the border but worked all over the bottom half of NSW such as Goulburn, Cootamundra, Temora, Wagga, Tocumul, Deniliquin ahhh so many more but can't remember.I remember landing on a racecouse to take a whiz one day, the horse trainers couldn't believe what they were seeing.

I landed on it day before a race meet, nags everywhere, they weren't too happy,.

We explained to the folk who came tearing up the strip at us in their Landcruiser traybacks (as we were trying to roll for takeoff!!) how they need to put the markings on the strip to indicate closure and they should also notify airservices for a NOTAM. 3 days after the race meet none of that was done but some weeks later I vaguely remember a permanent closure advice.

So for anyone who needs to land at Harden, sorry about that we may have triggered that outcome, I can assure you as of November 2017 it was still a great surface to land into, if you need it....

HI

This site has been down for weeks : http://www.aviationadvertiser.com.au/

Anyone know anything? I presume it was run by an Aussie flyer / company or some entity related to the aviation industry. There were a couple of planes I was interested in , but now I cant contact the owners. :-(

cheers

Ramjet

The latest bomb carrying terrorist drone confirmed..."...Two months after an Israeli Apache helicopter shot down an Iranian drone dispatched from Syria, ... Israel’s military censors on Friday finally allowed local media to report that the drone was not merely taking surveillance footage, but was carrying explosives and was primed to attack and damage an unspecified target somewhere in Israel..."

 

Attack drone revelation shows grave, immediate, adjacent threat to Israel: Iran

 

Israel, and the world, has a big problem. Very hard to combat bomb carrying drones worth a few hundred dollars with defensive weapons costing 10's of thousands of dollars. Eventually the defenders go broke.

 

Somebody has been proactive in stoping the terrorist drones at their source. In 2016 terrorist drone 'expert' Mohamed al-Zawi were assassinated in Tunisia. And just recently another terrorist drone 'expert', Fadi al-Batsh, were assassinated in Malaysia.

 

Hamas blames Israel for killing its drone expert in Tunisia, vows revenge

 

Hamas threatens revenge against Israel for killing of drone and rocket expert

 

Of concern to Australia is the terrorist drone designer that has been living just north of Oz for the last 10 years. How many Malaysian bomb-drone building experts have been educated by Fadi al-Batsh in the last 10 years ?

 

.

Havagrt ANZAC day!

Ramjet

Usability, intuitive features, all files are in a proprietary format so you never get off Apple and can't share with non Apple users (the trap!), hard to go wrong, good for idiots who know nothing about IT = Apple.

Global interoperability, designed for wider file sharing, no proprietary 'ecosystem', less good for idiots = Windows

Too easy, possibly less safe, can't go wrong ever, need 'apps' over programs, awesome for IT idiots = Android

Yep and the Chinese govt can review every single thing you do on the platform. No thanks.

Data safe,

Ramjet

Hi

Been looking at aircraft to buy and more than one hangar conversation has revolved around the cost of, and ability to complete oneself, maintenance.

Nothing I've found on CASA or on RAAUS website has elicited these differences clearly. Tbh I still can't work out the difference between 23 and 24 rego, its probably buried in the RA manuals somewhere but the Technical manual certainly doesn't explain much at all.

So from a self maintainer perspective, what could I do myself if I bought any of these regos and does the self maintenance requirements differ between each?

I'm presuming I need to do the certs/courses for RA self maintenance (and initially do all work/seek advice with someone who knows what they are doing)

I'm also balancing cost wise that my ability to maintain a VH craft is a specialists job and beyond pumping up the tyres and topping up oil there ain't much I can self service on a VH without LAME certification.

So when these old dogs in the hangar say "it's so much cheaper when you can maintain it yourself" what exactly do they mean? Surely I can't do my own full rebuild right there in the hangar and set my TBO back to 0hrs? Right?

Thanks

Ramjet

Well if you're clicking on unknown attachments from unknown senders then you probably get what you deserve.

There's some really simple practical actions people can take which improve online security 99%. If you don't know the sender, didn't ask for it, or are presented an 'upgrade' 'install' or 'offer' that you didn't ask for then don't click on it. Those rules alone will see you safe of 99% attempted attacks.

Surf safe!

Ramjet

FYI for anyone following this woeful tale I just checked my logbook and it was 24.3hrs when previous instructor was recommending I book in for flight test.

The first 11hrs were with original instructor., doing mostly endless, boring circuits.

The next 13 were with the the instructor who left the school just before I could sit test. 3 flights in we were doing 3hr navs and in just on 10hrs had knocked off PFL, PSL, Short field, EFATO, glide approaches, CTA and diversions.

In fact my log book shows the last 4hrs was a nav we did way out West pretty much 'just for fun' and demo all the skills. So that last nav was basically my pre test, in just over 20hrs. With only 2hrs IFR as the last manadatory requirement.

Now I've just clocked 45, another 21hrs.....back with the first guy. And only just done my IFR.

Do I sense a pattern here. ..?

Fly safe.

Ramjet

It occurs to me that the lesson in this tale of unhappy conversion experiences is - think ahead and only do your RAA PC at a school where you can then transition onto RPL and PPL. With this approach, you will be meeting the standard for RPL/PPL right from the start - same instructors, just different syllabus. For a c172 conversion over to RPL, I'd expect that an RPC with 30-35hrs TT - should be able to do it under 10hrs, and that includes the IF. This, particularly if the pilot has been well trained in 'attitude flight' from day 1. GA aircraft are 'tanks' compared to RAAus, and certainly easier to fly. I can't understand why some GA instructors make such a big deal about it.The other point that I'd make about conversions is - temper your enthusiasm and don't aim too high. Do your RPL without traffic pressure somewhere up country, and then look at doing the Class D CTR endo. Look at full PPL later on. You can fly over 98% of Australia with an RPL + D CTA - isn't that enough for starters?

As to the box-ticking exercise that flight training has become - it's done to cover bums, nothing more. At my stage of life, I'm going to continue to focus on the basics, and if the student forgets a few small items, or is a little inconsistent - I'm not going to pedantically hold them back. And, I write that into their student records!

 

happy days, and good luck RR.

Last time it was in the circuit, complaining I went a little long on downwind and then trying to tell me all the extra power I would have to drag in on final because of that, then cautioning me about Vfe, when we were right on the numbers ! (80kts) so I thought, FU theres other ways to do this, left flaps up all the way over the fence and dumped the lot 50ft from the threshold...... maybe a 7/10 landing, I was quite happy with it, not perfect but safe and straight. But now it's 'your circuits aren't good enough, let's practice them again next time' FFS ...really??? I've just come down off 1.5hrs IFR so I'm a little shagged, what do they expect?

There are other hidden agendas at play here I'm sure, and the more I think about it, income stream is most likely a prime factor. i. e. Yes Im being milked.

I press on, I'm close now...

Fly safe

Ramjet

Do I really have another choice? Jumping schools to have to spend yet another 4-6 hrs demonstrating what I already know.

I have already contacted another school, so if it does come to that I know where Im going. I'll most likely go there for my NVFR/PIFR unless a better option comes up...I am also yet to buy an IFR rated plane (or any plane), so no rush on that front.

Fly safe

Ramjet

Did you find some clarity Ramjet?

And in that I am conflicted. Some time ago, about 14hrs, an instructor was prepping me tantalisingly close to a test, we almost booked it. With a quick and direct method we addressed curriculum items one by one and bashed at them until they were subdued, conquered and mastered to at least a level of non life threatening skill, certainly enough to squeak over a PPL test mark.

Now my current instructor has different standards and expectations, they simply wants to see a perfect demo, with every single flight. No minor circuit errors, no forgetfulness, no navigational errors.

I see two very distinct approaches here, I simply much preferred the former. That is also attributed to the consistent time and commitment I put to that regularity of training. Frequency counts for a lot of 'skill' when the drills aren't quite fully embedded as second nature.

There are no doubt some poor training skills being demonstrated here, which add to my frustrations, I can't change that. I could bang on about them for ages. I also need to equally reflect on the fact that I almost consistently make some kind of flight error during a session, nothing that will kill us, mind you, just little stuff.

My biggest issue is having asked numerous times to be shown the competency marks against each syllabus item so we can concentrate on what I need to learn/relearn and I am now convinced that those markings do not exist. (They will have to be on record prior to a PPL test I am led to believe)

Or the fact that my previous instructor made extensive notes (and most probably scored against those syllabus items) but this instructor wasn't aware of those notes existence, hadn't read them prior to re-engaging with me, and hasn't since AFAIK, simply made me 'fly around some more' to see where I was up to (thus the last 10-12 hours...)

But their shortcomings, given that I now recognise them clearly, should not be my failure. I must understand and demonstrate what this instructor wants to see. If I was going to let someone loose in the sky with my name signed in their log book, I'd probably feel somewhat the same.

I am assured by numerous others that this instructors standards are high and I am 'lucky' to have them training me. Perhaps, when a potentially life threatening situation arises, or I review a gross enroute or planning error and thank them for making me so meticulous, I'll be appreciative.

Right now, learning and teaching in a small cockpit together is a symbiotic relationship of sorts and I need to work hard at passing that shared expectation, irrespective of my perception of the paucity in the quality of the 'hard' training skills.

I am certainly much more direct in what I want to learn from hereon and to that directness, weather played a favourable part in seeing some final obligatory training put onto the log book last weekend.

I am 44hrs in, about 20 more than I expected, so basically double the investment I had anticipated, there's no stopping me now. I was almost ready for a PPL some 14 hrs ago.... we'll simply put that 4K down to 'experience' , in more ways than one.

Marcus Aurelius again.."Today I escaped all circumstance, or rather I cast out all circumstance, for it was not outside me, but within my judgements"

And that is how I plan to get a PPL....

Fly safe

Ramjet

Rogerramjet, I know you are in the ACT, but if you are ever up in QLD, go see Neil Hoffensetz at Ayr Flying Services. He has a good reputation up here with some very highly qualified (atpl types), and there is no pretentions to him, no ********, if you are good to go, you are good to go type of attitude. Doesnt milk you for all you are worth, and actively speaks about not doing so.

My instructor is fussy, that's okay, but it's really getting ridiculous and he doesn't seem to have a clear curriculum path in mind, which my previous instructor did, and had me to '2 weeks away from test, let's do this thing' attitude.

Currently it's a subjective assessment against their own 10000hr? skills which as a low hour pilot I will never meet. Ever.

Might see you in Mackay!

Fly safe

Ramjet

Thanks for all the views, I posted this last one to confirm what I had already suspected. I'm being dragged out for whatever hidden agenda the instructor has in their head.

So, I'll be seeking a 'fast and forceful' path to completion of my PPL and they will suffer the loss of my intent to train PIFR, which I had hoped to have begun already. If I can't get what I need, I'll cut my losses and go elsewhere.

This extension from my initial estimate of 20hrs or so has now cost me about 6K. I'll definitely be doing my PIFR elsewhere.

Thanks for some of the views and insights, I'll post back with an update after this weekend, who knows I might finally even get that last 1.25hrs of mandatory IFR done! I wouldn't want to be my instructor tomorrow morning, 'not happy Jan!'

Fly safe

Ramjet

Sounds like milked or raped.Caught between a rock and a hard placeDo you keep getting milked or go to another school and see if they start you over again basically from scratch

I'm the guy who's always filling up the plane before (and often after) every flight. At 10 to 15 mins engine time = $50-$80. Seems it's never ready just to fly.

My landings are never quite good enough. Ever. Not once. Not even in 15kt gusty crosswinds, surprise, surprise.

My PFL procedure isn't 100% by the checklist, every, single, time. I was taught to aviate, navigate, communicate. So if working through fuel checks, getting enough exact info to Melbourne Cntre and briefing pax on exit, epirb and first aid isn't quite done perfectly, bad luck. I'm landing the plane, that's my priority.

My CTA and radio work is fine, I make an odd approach error to unfamiliar G class airfield (being used for circuits at the time admittedly) and that warrants another 3-4hr nav?

I make one navigational error (admittedly a bad one) and that warrants us going 5hrs West into the desert so I can "learn to read a WAC better" ?

My 500fpm descent to 1500AGL was mistimed by 1 minute, so that warrants yet more navs?

So when said instructor spots navigational error he says "do CLEAROFFS" then as working through CLEAROFF interjects with 17 questions " Height! Read your map! What time did you depart? What about that river down there?! What's your heading? How much fuel do you have?" Ummm...I'm still working through my CLEAROFF thanks, so you're not helping. I.e. Loads up the pressure, designed to fail so he can sit back at the end of the flight and say " You're not ready" He tries it on every time I make even a minor flight error. Maybe he doesn't even realise...??

I might be hyper critical and I know I'm not the tidiest pilot on occasion, but I can point it, land it, control it pretty darn accurate 99% of the time.

I think instructor just wants to see me through a 100% absolutely perfect nav and PPL skills just once. Though I am well aware that test instructors will often let you come back for another attempt later in the PM or next day to finish off some missed skills. Indeed, I think like golf, it's how you recover from the rough that demonstrates the skill.

There is also the implication of lack of frequency, the more I fly and don't quite get there, the less I want to fly....so I've been reducing my flying time to the bare minimum which does expose weaknesses in skills and competence.

How about when he says let's just go over the basics next flight (PFL, PSL, Circuit approaches) then on my arrival decides a short nav is in order, then post brief complains to me that we lost time (ie flying income) planning for the unplanned nav! What the...?

So my strategy is to:

a) sit down and demand completion of tasks that will see me ready and lock in a series of dates with those specific outcomes defined, like finishing the mandatory instrument flying.

b) Next time he starts carrying on mid flight simply say "I am in command, please be quiet for a moment, I will seek your input if and when I need it"

After 44hrs ( yes count 'me. .. 44! Longer than it took to get ALL my RA certs) , having come in with an expectation of a syllabus something like 'go over the basics +conversion to heavier type + CTA practice = PPL Test time, am I being milked? I think a bit of each, my instructor has very high standards and isn't here to 'just get me through' unlike the other instructor who had no acommitment to the bottom line of the business, just good flying outcomes. So perhaps the behaviour serves a slightly hidden income continuation agenda. Maybe that's a good thing? An EXPENSIVE good thing.....? I don't know, but being always '1 more nav' away from a flight test gets bloody frustrating.

Cheers

Ramjet

My experience: Though I should clarify that I'm only at RPL now, but working towards PPL as time allows.I carried out my ab initio training at an RAA school in SEQ, predominately in J170 but also J160 as well a little bit. I passed my RPC flight test at 24 hours and promptly did nothing for three months due to an interstate move and new job.

I went to the local school which used to be do RAA and GA, but now only does GA, "RA planes are no cheaper to run anymore so there's no point." I was expected to get the run around a bit, but after a few hours of flying around doing manoeuvres and circuits my instructor was happy with my flying. And I must say after the Jabs the PA28 that I am now flying is super comfortable, stable and all round pleasant.

 

We sat down and formulated a plan to work towards RPL, and he insisted on doing the two hours of instrument time, which I'm still not convinced is strictly necessary for a non-nav endorsed RPL, but anyway, I really enjoyed it actually :) We also did some fairly "severe" upset recovery, certainly way more upset than anything I'd done in RAA. Especially when under the hood... Recovering from an inverted stall half a dozen times when you can't see anything is a sure way to get air sick that's for sure! But again I'd say it is worthwhile and certainly not a waste of time or money. Hopefully I never get myself in such situation but if I do, somewhere in the old noggin is a method to get out of it...

 

A few more circuits at a very congested, high stress Class G aerodrome with three RPTs and four water bombers operating into at the same time and voila flight review signed off and I'm good to go: 5.7 hours, 2 of which was instrument flying. This may seem excessive for some, considering that RPC and RPL are meant to be equivalent, but I feel it was all very worthwhile, pushed me further into stressful situations and made me a better pilot. Time and money well spent. Now onto Navs and PPL.

Your experience seems much more realistic (putting aside the very unusual attitude training!) and practical. I havent even completed my 2hrs IFR practice, despite asking numerous times.

My experience leads me to believe I'm being milked, though its been a slow realisation. I'll post more on that later when I find some time.

Where the hell do you get to do that 'aerobatic training' as part of your GA experience? (PM me)

Cheers

R

Lol. The 24hr news cycle was always going to lead to fake news fillers.

. Instruction... Some people might show a greater "aptitude" for it. but a lot can be taught about how to instruct. TRAINING is important in ALL parts of aviation. An instructor will learn fast in the early stages as the students will put the plane into situations the instructor never would. His standard of flying should always be upstream of "sound". Briefing in the air should be minimal It's not the best use of your money as you can't concentrate and you don't have the aids and whiteboard or charts there.. Talking someone through a particular sequence is not what I would call a briefing. Briefing before flight covers the skill and technique involved in the sequence in conjunction with a study guide or manual. The debriefing covers how it went and any questions the student may want to clarify and consolidate what happened..

Students are always different. The instructor has to vary the "way" the skill is imparted to the individual. The older way was to just do the more or less standard patter and keep things "by the book and simple" More ROTE learning than is optimum). Always a % were expected to fail.

It's unlikely a low hours instructor will have developed the skills to do this effectively that is why he/she acts under the CFI significantly in the early stages of their instructional career.. Obviously a fair bit of psychological "nous" of handling people's idiosynchracies and preconceptions is an advantage. People are and always will be, complex creatures. Nev

Good points @facthunter. Its a complex interplay between instructor and instructee. In your humble experience, do you still think there are some people who, under any tutelage, will never achieve the practical skills to pass a flying test?

Cheers

Ramjet

It wasn't meant to be a personal Barb. But if you took it as such I am sorry.

I was merely pointing out that within RAA there is far more to becoming a CFI than a Cert 4.

As it turns out you will never have to worry about being a struggling student in my cockpit because I am not an instructor.

I did once consider becoming one purely to try and improve my own flying skills, but RAA instructor rating according to the Ops Manual is more directed at instructional techniques rather than flying training so I decided not to bother.

For me personally becoming an instructor so that I can teach is a low priority as I fly for pleasure and worry that if I started to instruct it become another job to me.

Thanks and appreciated @Geoff13 ,

Interesting comments there, you were considering CFI to improve your own flying skills, so it might be your motivations were misdirected, but you recognised that.

I wonder how many long term PPL / CPL who never quite crack the big time commercial game (or make a choice not to) but after a 'semi career' of flying in smaller ops say, ah well I'll just get my CFI and be an instructor, theres a job.

I would suggest the RA and GA instructor endorsements should start with some sort of psychometric assessment on your ability to instruct, as a stage gate for continuance. Mind you I can get a teachers degree without any such assesment... and then teach all your precious little children.

Aptitude to pass knowledge is often an intangible.

Cheers

R

Roger,

 

I'd suggest that you talk with several CFI's around our large country. Becoming a 'successful' instructor/SI or CFI has a lot less to do with passing Certificate IV or PMI, but more to do with being empathetic and perceptive with students. You also don't have to be Chuck Yeager insofar as aircraft handling is concerned - just steady and safe does the trick. Not meant as criticism btw. happy days,

@poteroo I'm not (yet) interested in instructing just interested to know what people might think is good, bad or otherwise.

Many have said I'm a great mentor, but that doesn't mean I'm cut out for high pressure instruction. If I ever feel confident, maybe as a semi-retirement gig.

Not that I ever plan on redoing my RA and PPL certs all over again, but there are some signs I've identified to pick up early on who's a good/bad instructor. And to throw another variable in, people have different learning styles.

One bad sign I've noted ( and unfortunately you need two different instructors to note the delta ) is those who ask " What did you think was wrong with that?" take partial control, runs verbally through actions vs. " That was wrong, here let me demonstrate" grabs controls, flies like an ace, explains nothing, " There see how it's done!"

Often subtle, but markedly different.

Cheers

Ramjet

Sometimes being a perfectionist can be an obsession and like all obsessions can become a cause in it's own right. No landing is PERFECT If it was it's a fluke to a certain extent. FAQ all the time with good control is better than mostly greasers with the occasional ....What happened there moment?. If you try for greasers above all things you may float too far (approach with extra speed). In the wet you don't aim for a greaser or you might burst a tyre. Set yourself a high standard by all means, but that should be more directed at the decisions you made and how you managed the conduct of the flight with respect to the changing circumstances you encountered.. How accurate was the planning. did you brief your passengers appropriately. Did you have ready alternatives of something went wrong?. There is always room for improvement. Getting some sums right to the 3rd decimal place is no point, if you took the deviation off instead of putting it on, when on a reciprocal track. Nev

On the odd occasion I'm up with pax it's often useful to ask what they thought of the flying (as opposed to the flight experience). Surprisingly I often get quite insightful responses, views on high approach speeds, less than perfect landings, poor pax briefings...etc.

Cheers

Ramjet

A lesson that I have always remembered from 1967. Thank you John!!!

Hi @TBLG

That's a great example of a use of props to deliver a lifelong memorable lesson. Does anyone have any other tales of memorable, or insufferable, lessons that left some imprint?

I had an instructor who left me with 'Flying is the pusuit of perfection' Timing descent into circuit perfectly, fuel planning that pans out to the litre, trimming and leaning in cruise perfectly. Etc etc. Each thing you do should be not just 'good enough' but has it been done with greatest efficiency and outcome. We all know landings are a endless pursuit of perfection.

Cheers

Ramjet

Better do some more homework I think.

RRAus Ops Manual is very clear on requirements for an Instructor, a Senior Instructor and then CFI.

It is certainly niether a simple step nor a short step to become a CFI.

 

Aand if you cant find those requirements yourself, then you probably dont meet the rquirements of an instructor let alone a CFI

Hi @Geoff13

The base requirements to commence instruction as someone who teaches others in GA are prety straighforward. I presume RA is same or similar.

You're pointless personal barbs add nothing to a discussion about the general abilities of people to instruct. I certainly hope you are not one with such a blunt and derogatory attitude. I'd loathe to be a struggling student in your cockpit.

Thanks anyway,

Ramjet

So I have confirmed that Cert IV training and assessment is the minimum requirement for CFI I did this certification with my eyes closed and beers at lunchtime during the course. Not ideal.

Using simple sums I think the requirements suggest 300hrs minimum.

https://www.casa.gov.au/file/161086/download?token=ePQhndV7

Given I am topping out towards 100 hrs I got my Cert IV training maybe 20 yrs ago.....its not too mamy hrs until I can potentially teach all my bad habits to the next sucker. ..hmm. Scary.

Fly safe

Ramjet