Roscoe

Flew 3h Sun, 3h today.

 

Today- CFI loaded me up with every conceivable engine failure .. My instinct is nose down it seems above all other instincts.

did more glides also. . and if it baloons a tony bit, I dont panic I just let it settle down...... in glides- takes a bit to realise just how fast it goes down like a stone and you can easily end up in the drink.

 

quite important to configure for best glide speed if you have to cover any sort of distance...- it REALLY matters to get that established quick if you are far out, and something like say, straying a bit far from the strip on the downwind (by extending the crosswind) (more reasons not to stray far)

But was enjoyable, LOVE doing stuff like that. Hard work, and unforgiving implications, first couple of glides were I was short was a real lesson !.

 

Doing much more flying by looking out of the plane now. Much more, Got my depth perception sorted out on landings, no more aircraft carrier style landings . Although one of my flapless glides- judging the flare from a steep descent is tricky..

 

I love the lush damp grass cross strip. like landing on a sponge. bit of power helps in the flare, then when established in the round out, cut to idle and let it sink and feel the nose etc. That roundout short float time seems useful for correcting for a bit yaw

 

Had a grin on my face when we finished today- I feel I now have a good toolkit of 'get out of trouble' options.

 

16.3h. still managed to mess up the circuit a bit on the first flight of the day., south TO and less familiar circuit path ..

 

got smacked by a " I dunno what" bit of air at one point. it can be nasty up there in the middle of a warm day. got rolled and yawed about 10 deg a bit and counter aeleron input didnt really fix the roll straight away. then ended up over correcting, yaw the other way, golly. was level and minding my own business.

 

Had lunch with Thruster88 !

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RF Have you been solo yet?

The Jabiru 170's (esp the C & D's) are fantastic aircraft. The longer wings give you a better flare and take off a little sooner. The shorter wing 160's fly great to but I prefer the bigger wing jabs. I have not notice poor x wing performance but because the flare is a little longer you have to be able to manage you technique for a slightly longer period.

Correct. I found that longer flare took some getting used to, but if you have the speed nailed, it lands beautifully!

I read you ONLY get the first issue FREE. The rest you have to pay for ! Nothing yet in QLD.

I havent received the mag yet?

RF, you are overthinking all this with your multiple questions. Trust in the factory as they have signed off on their aircraft.

If you don't relax and enjoy your training you may end up with an aneurism.

Pick ANY of the common brands and enjoy!

Ken

Ken you have said what i am thinking but i cant seem to get my msg through.

I have referred RF to Jabiru. They should be able to answer his specific questions.

It is my nature to understand why decisions were taken.... I'd actually like some comment on my original points a,b,c and d) . please ? :-)

 

Jab are unlikely to change any designs IMO. As for the 230 , yeah agree all round. I have read all available documentation on all Jab ships and maintenance thoroughly.

 

The 80HP needs a turbocharger, and fuel injection ...if there is any thermal headroom available ......

More flying tomorrow. approaches are OK. flare and round out needs work. I wish I could go out every day and work on it. I mean I am chomping at the bit to improve those things.

I say again, just ask Jabiru for your a, b, c and d questions.

They built the Aircraft.

RF, you are overthinking all this with your multiple questions. Trust in the factory as they have signed off on their aircraft.

If you don't relax and enjoy your training you may end up with an aneurism.

Pick ANY of the common brands and enjoy!

Ken

RF, myself and others, have picked up on your many posts which have multiple questions, scenrios and scientific insights.

With utmost respect, I admire your enquiring mind and keeness for knowledge, but am asking myself, is this guy enjoying the journey to his licence?

Tell us about your first solo which really will get the adrenaline pumping, and how much you enjoy flying a stabilised approach to a greaser!

Dont concern yourself with the details of the Lift formula, just accept it, and query it down the track if you dont believe it.

I apologise if i am on the wrong track with my thoughts and dont want to offend you, maybe others can put it better than me.

Just enjoy the thrill of flying!!!

Interesting. I'm in Victoria and fly a J160. A few of us are considering a syndicate for weekends away etc. The J170 and J230 are under active consideration for their additional load potential... ie extra fuel. I'd like to fly a family location about 500km away without stopping, and also allowing for a potential for a headwind. As a low hour pilot I'd like something that handles well. Is the suggestion the J170 or the J230 is better behaved?

The 170D has the 230 Wing and tailplane. The 230 has the great luggage area in the back opened separately.

The 230 has the bigger engine and the perf stats are on the Jab website.

I purchased my 170 new in 2014 and love it. I would like the extra 15-20 knots but happy to live with the 100 kts in the 170.

The loading calcs for the 230 are more critical but fantastic if you only have 2 average size humans and moderate stuff.

I get 14 lph in the 170 with 135 litres capacity so refueling few and far between.

Im summary, i probably would have gone for a 230 when i purchased, but couldnt justify the extra cost at that time.

My 170 does all i need for my relatively short trips, very economically.

As i said, the Jab website will give you a good comparison.

Hope this helps

Settle down RF, I flew the J160 in Victoria and was very happy with it. Then we got a J170. The theory we were told, was that the J160 didn't have enough lift of hot days in the northern part of Australia with its high temperature atmosphere. From all reports the big wing worked well in Northern Australia, but in the much lower ambient temperatures of coastal Victoria the lift was much greater (do some calcs on density altitudes for north and south and you'll see the difference), Now in this more compressed air the new wings stuck out a lot more so gusts from one side required a lot more stick concentration. On top of this the fuselage length was very short coupled from CG point to rudder in the J160, so if you copped a quartering wind and were coming in on crossed controls (as we were all told to do) we were often doing it on maximu rudder authority. If we then copped a sudden gust just as we rounded out, the upwind wing would be shoved back, we had no more rudder authority and the aircraft would start to rotate in the upwind direction. Naturally we were told it was the pilot's failt and I spent a lot of time and money learning how to round out and land with the nose wheel about 150 mm above the ground, so it was possible to handle the gusts. A few months later an AD came out and the aircraft received a strake and from memory bigger rudder, and you neven hear and bad reports today. If you want to redesign the aircraft for Jabiru, the J230 would be the one I'd use as a starting point, but I think they have it about right now.

I agree with Turbs on this one.

I fly the 170D and dont see any need to refine the design any further.

RF If you have concerns, or queries, the team at Jabiru will be very happy to discuss why they did what they did.

There is a very comprehensive write up of the J170D story on the Jab website which in my opinion, tells me all i need to know.

Roscoe, how many of the problems do you believe with that Gen engine were due to (simply) inadvertent overheating of engines (during climbs, ground running etc) , even momentarily ?

Engine mismanagement certainly an issue but i dont have specific details. As you said, The Jab Engine matter of 2014 has been discussed and debated at length and no need to continue that dialog now.

Lets get back to topic about purchasing an airplane!

mmm alright. there are "a broad range of views" on this... that's the best way to describe it.

Be careful about making statements like that without factual data. Vague assumptions and heresay doesnt cut it with me

Foxbats yes. Lots of good stuff is written about them. A Foxbat is one of the planes on my short list. I can get a reasonably priced used A22 these days, also. A used J170D would be a reasonable option but my opinion is people want too much for them used with Gen3 engines (which I would remove and fit a Gen4) . I can always make offers I guess.

Why would you remove a perfectly good gen3 engine that has been maintained in accordance with the Manufacturers guidelines?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with these Engines if maintained correctly.

I know, I have one, and so do others i know.

I recently bought my first plane, a Tomahawk, and ended up with what equates to the 80% I guess. A deciding factor was that it is a plane I'd had some lessons in and liked flying, another factor was that my better half wasn't comfortable with the budget I had in mind for the 100% option. Seeing as she'll never come up with me and my touring dreams will probably be done solo it seems like a good thing, at least for a couple of years. I've also cross-hired it to the school where I've been flying which I think (maybe incorrectly) is kind of easing me into the whole ownership thing. At least much more experienced people than myself are flying it regularly and keeping an eye on maintenance etc and I'm learning through their comments. One day I hope to be able to tour with friends or family, just not the Ms, then I can either hire or trade-up to my 100% plane hopefully. I do like the idea of a Jab 230, definitely a plane on my short list.

Good comments but be careful with the cross hire arrangement.

I know from past experience that the maintenance costs will far outweigh the income generated.

I realise it all depends on the School and Instructors and you dont want any surprises from that unreported heavy landing that a Student was too embarrassed to report.

Just my opinion

All good and correct Nev. Just making a point to Stuart regarding perceived mistrust of the Manufacturers book figures.

And i appreciate the need for a re weigh if items are added/removed since original weigh

The Basic Wt and index for any plane( Type) is pretty variable as mass and location of individual items, aren't always the same . Also it was permitted to alter thing s if the new figures could be established from the Original Condition OR last WEIGH and the calculated effect of the changes just carried out at the time it was done.. and appropriately documented and used. This process means that an error will/can be perpetuated till a reweigh is done. Reweigh means a "new" Basic Wt AND INDEX will be established together. You need both items to have the necessary information. to load your plane within specified limits. Weight and Balance. Balance ensures control is available normally. in the pitching plane.

Max wt based on PERFORMANCE criteria existing at the time ie. Density height , runway length, surface condition and slope and obstacles affecting the aircraft's take off path just determine a WEIGHT,(Mass) LIMIT and assume that the balance is taken care of in the normal LOAD sheet provisions. Rearward Cof G's (within the limit) will give better climb rates , cruise speed and ceiling results if you can do that. Nev

All good and correct Nev. Just making a point to Stuart regarding perceived mistrust of the Manufacturers book figures.

Safety Thought.. How confident are you that you really do know the actual Empty Weight of your aircraft? Since important calculations and loading decisions originate from this critical weight, its vital to know what it actually is. Is the empty weight in the POH correct? Do you trust that the weight stated at time of CofA must be correct just because it couldn't possibly be wrong, given all the measures in place to prevent any such errors? If you are reading between the lines you may be in for a shock. Trust but Verify.

Not quite sure of the point you are making.

So if i buy a brand new Factory built Aircraft with the stated Empty weight numbers in the POH, that I have to go and re weigh myself to confirm the Manufacturers numbers?

Can you clarify thanks

I think there maybe more value in purchasing an aircraft with what you want already installed.

I can't see the 172 I mentioned gaining anywhere near the 50k that was spent.

Instead of purchasing an average 172 and spending that amount, there would be more value in a newer 172...

I will endorse that!

It will cost a fortune to install the gear you want.

Better off buying an Aircraft already fitted out,

The cost of the equipment plus installation will be more than the value of the aircraft.

Yes but it should have a closed banner on it even though the ad still shows.

People then know not to respond

And if you go through existing classifieds you will see what i mean

See image. This does everything i want and confirms known info

The

I've done that but the ad is still up......

Yes but it should have a closed banner on it even though the ad still shows.

People then know not to respond

Hi, I’m sure this may be covered somewhere else..however. I’m looking to purchase a182 and replace some of the instruments with Garmin products..g3x touch, radio, autopilot etc.

‘yes I know it will be a high cost but I like ‘bells and whistles’ :).

I’m based in Albury so I’m looking for recommendations for a business to do the work... Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane.. doesn’t really matter. If you know someone or from previous experience has been good, professional and not a complete rip off on pricing could you please let me know....

I’m just doing the homework now so when it does happen I can move forward.

Thanks Gary.

There are 2 organisations at Bankstown that i have used.

Pacific Avionics and Eastern States Avionics,

Both have done a good job and are well respected.

You will need to take your Aircraft to them and be prepared to leave it with them for a while.

PM me if you want to discuss further.

My Jabiru was bought as a kit in 1998. I have just done a carby overhaul job and now I am worried about the fuel pump. The factory only replaces the whole unit at a price of $260 which I think is a lot of money and I don't even know if the old fuel pump needs replacing.

One aspect is that there is a backup electric fuel pump, so maybe the best thing to do it wait until the mechanical pump fails.

What have others done?

Bruce, pay the money and have peace of mind.

As you say, you have backup but why rely on that?

I dont think $260 is exhorbitant. I replaced mine a while ago with the Jabiru updated model with no issues since.

Now my question is how do I remove an ad after the item has been sold??

I guess I'm slow but can't find a way to do it.....

You will find a drop down menu and select CLOSED.

BlueAd, that is good advice , They have done this before with many different students. I find the best teachers are ones that can adapt/vary a little to suit the student. I'm not at all concerned about the W&B for the training.... We are not going up there with a toolbox of housebricks..... BUT:

 

Actually the thing I wonder is : will I easily develop the intuition of 3 axis coordination, or will my brain / visual +hand eye acuity just not be up to scratch learning late in my life (49) rather than earlier. I guess I am dazzled by the learning rate of my 5 yo and 7.8 yo , and wonder if humans continued to be able to learn at that rate (at 5 years old) their whole life, what sort of place we'd live in.

 

Thanks for the Mackay offer ! I have a feeling the aircraft I buy where ever will be a long ferry home. Sort of reminds me of driving my first car I bought home some distance, barely held together learning to drive a manual gear shift for the first time doing it..-GLEN

Youre not too old!

My late father started his training at age 55 and despite struggling a bit with the theory, obtained his PPL and gave up Bowls due to his new found passion!

Made new friends and changed his life.

Didnt hear back from the guy.

If anyone else wants the book gratis let me know.