Aero Clubs Survival against Commercial Aviation Schools

[John Werner]

Currently CASA lists 428 certified flight training operators in Australia of which only 22 are described as "Aero Clubs" on their certificates.  Recent developments with the Rockhampton Aero Club highlight this trend to commercial operators in flight training away from aero clubs.  Rocky Aero Club had a distiguished aviation history at YBRK being founded on 16th January, 1923 and operating a flight training function for 93 years until 2023 when it was ceased because of competition for flying instructors.  I recall certain activities at that aero club as a boy because one of my schoolmates was the son of a flying instructor there.  On one memorable occasion, the club held a flour-bombing competition with Tiger Moths (DH 82A with their open tandem cockpits and tubular comms) and an Auster Autocar dropping flour bombs on a canvas target next to the main runway with commercial flights of ANA and TAA arriving and departing at the same time.  I also remember a great variety of recreational and general aviation aircraft passing through YBRK at the time (early 1950s) including Avro Anson, Percival Gull, DH.89 Dragon Rapide (with their twin inverted Gipsy Six engines looking like two Tiger Moth Gipsy Major engines bilaterally on the same aircraft), DH88 Comet and the arrival of a shiny new Cessna 172 with revolutionary tricycle undercarriage for a light aircraft.  We will never see such dangerous activities again and not because we have run out of plain flour.

[440032]

I can speak with great experience to this topic.

I have been in a local aero club 25 years or thereabouts. In that time it has become very clear that CASA do not want traditional Aero Clubs involved in flight training.

Years ago, every small town with an airfield had an aero club, a 172 and an instructor (sole operator) but the aero club held the AOC. I gather that getting an AOC for that was not too difficult.

My club had such a structure since the sixties. Our operations manual came from a mob who did that sort of thing. Then following a CASA audit, our approved manual was suddenly no longer approved and we had to change things.

The manual mob though still existing then (and today) totally blew us off with radio silence. So I stepped up to fix things, the club had no other viable plan.

CASA requirements were becoming far beyond the capabilities of the people of a small town aero club. Many chucked flying training in. Some clubs folded.

 

Along comes Part 141 and all the requirements and it got ten times worse. I can say with great authority that the current requirements for Aero Club people in CASA approved positions and manuals and forms is well beyond the capabilities of ordinary aviators to be involved with, then not to mention the responsibility those positions hold, usually voluntarily (other than paid instructors). It is the Aero Club that holds the 141 Certificate, not the instructors or any other person. Yes there is a CASA standard operations manual draft which we have used, but I can tell you with great certainty that there are many traps in there that could bring you undone at audit. We (I) amended/deleted those traps.

(quick example - our manual said we would use the CASA Maintenance Release for the plane. Then our LAME innocently used the other RACWA one. drum roll ....... PING!)

 

Our current approved manuals are only good to the next CASA audit, where overnight they could suddenly now become not acceptable. We (I) do manage to do updates to match regulation changes. Oh, then WE have to PAY to get those changes approved. Let me repeat that one, WE HAVE TO PAY TO GET OUR MANUALS RE-APPROVED AFTER CASA CHANGES REGULATIONS.

We've had audits claiming faults and when investigated, some were totally shot down by their own regulations. The auditors were BSing. Some even claimed fault against regulations that did not even exist.

All these audit findings were to do with paperwork, nothing to do with flying an aeroplane. Sad, that's what it's all come to.

 

I had a friend in the trucking industry. He once told me the industry was now only about compliance, and if there was any time left over they might do a few deliveries.

 

I believe there will come the day soon (inside 5 years) when our flight training via the aero club cannot survive the paperwork.

We could transition to the Part 141 sole operator approval thing that does suit an owner/operator of a 172 trainer. They are the master/mistress of their domain totally, they wear all the responsibility.  But that can have problems also if trying to exist in an aero club environment. Perhaps not so if they had their own premises (hangar/classroom) to operate out of.

 

Well that's my take on the Aero Club vs Part 141 GA flying training scene. It's a race to the finish line. Current VH plane utilisation is good, worthwhile holding on to. While we can.

Oh also, my club also got an RAAus plane and instructor and that is going really well for us. The club owns the plane. I play NO PART in the paperwork for that part of our operation! As far as I can tell, the operation follows the RAAUs standard manuals, there are no surprises, no variations, no specifics for us. IT WORKS. The RAAus operation HAS attracted many new young members and their family members to the club.

[John Werner]

Quote:- "I believe there will come the day soon (inside 5 years) when our flight training via the aero club cannot survive the paperwork".  That is the nub of my post along with the competition for flight instructors from commercial FT operators and why I share your concern for the survival of traditional Australian aero clubs.

[turboplanner]

For those in Victoria, take a look at the process used by an authorised Roadworthy Authority. Not only is every roadworthy checks and assessed against the standard but it gets a photo to show there is no bias.

 

GA works to a higher standard, so its good to see RA is easier to work with. 

GA is also financially responsible for "mistakes" if someone is injured or killed, so they have to ensure that you are doing PRECISELY what you are supposed to be doing.

 

Aside from the crossover of liability over the past 40 years, we've had the crossover of computers where much of the frustration you're talking about is probably occurring, particularly the repetitive work. By that should be automated. In one case I've seen a reduction of one week, plus involving an engineer plus a draftsman to do the same job with small variants over and over again. Today I do them in under 15 minutes and can save or print all the calculations.

[440032]

7 hours ago, John Werner said:

Quote:- "I believe there will come the day soon (inside 5 years) when our flight training via the aero club cannot survive the paperwork".  That is the nub of my post along with the competition for flight instructors from commercial FT operators and why I share your concern for the survival of traditional Australian aero clubs.

Well good to know John that I'm not the only one seeing the finish line - for aero clubs doing GA training. My aero club is going great at present. If we were to lose the 141 operation it will leave a big hole. We are almost "last club standing" doing 141 training in hundreds of km.

 

And turbs - roadies.....  I worked in a RWC shop until not so long ago (just a helper, not a mechanic). Owner had the apprentices do the roadies, a total NO NO - he was never out on the shop floor. Even wanted me to check some basics, I said NUP, nothing to do with me DH. Yes, each fault had to have a photo taken and uploaded to Vicroads. Even photos of INOP horns! Then another photo of the horn working again when resolved! Hilarious.

[facthunter]

Working for an AERO club is VERY political. You are working for a large committee There's no room for that BS with a business .. A Flying Club is inevitably run by a PART-TIME Committee of Competing EGOS and Biases and as it's said "a Camel is a Horse designed by a committee". Most of us are aware of a Club being taken over by some group of  Zealots who want to take in in one direction or another often as the result of some hidden benefit (Kickback). Many FAIL due internal conflict and inept management and getting behind with some requirements with the "Oh I THOUGHT YOU were handling THAT.. THEY follow a similar path as many Co- Ops and SHARED Aircraft arrangements. They can work but it has to be a tight ship and meet the  deadlines.  Nev

[turboplanner]

1 hour ago, 440032 said:

Well good to know John that I'm not the only one seeing the finish line - for aero clubs doing GA training. My aero club is going great at present. If we were to lose the 141 operation it will leave a big hole. We are almost "last club standing" doing 141 training in hundreds of km.

 

And turbs - roadies.....  I worked in a RWC shop until not so long ago (just a helper, not a mechanic). Owner had the apprentices do the roadies, a total NO NO - he was never out on the shop floor. Even wanted me to check some basics, I said NUP, nothing to do with me DH. Yes, each fault had to have a photo taken and uploaded to Vicroads. Even photos of INOP horns! Then another photo of the horn working again when resolved! Hilarious.

I guess you could switch the phone to video and attach it to an email if the online form won't take it. 

The point is the world has  moved on - it's 40 years since the mid 1980's and its not going back.