Jabiru comparison with others

[Headwind]

Sometime in the (hopefully) near future I’ll be looking at aircraft ownership again. Recently I have been flying mostly Foxbat’s and Vixxen’s after moving on from GA. Would love to hear some experienced views on Jab comparisons with other RAAus types; high or low wing. I haven’t flown a Jab but I’m baffled by how you operate the brakes and yoke in crosswind. 
I hope to be able to support Australian manufacturers. Ta!

[JabiruWeekendWarrior]

Hi Headwind, I have a J160 and find its easy to operate the brakes and yoke, most Jabirus have a centre of cabin U shape yoke and when needed you put your hand through the U shape and operate the brakes and just angle your elbow slighly to push the yoke left or right as needed. Strange as it looks

If you try it you will find its quite easy, its all a one hand operation leaving your left hand free.

[Earl Pike]

Hello Headwind…

Operating the brake and yoke are the least of your flying worries…

I fly a Jabiru 230 D…If you actually want to get some where, the 230 has the range and speed of a lot of GA aircraft, with a very generous weight limit..

I recently undertook a trip with a friend who flys a Diamond..He said “ I cruise at 120knts’, I replied, so do I. He had to stop to refuel, I could have reached our destination, without stopping..

I really like my aeroplane..

[Keith W]

I agree with Earl my 230 is a great plane to fly, good cruise speed and economical, my 160 was a good plane to fly as well but I prefer the 230.

[skippydiesel]

Jabs are great and a big bang for the cost compared with most others.

 

If you want something that has a similar stall to a Foxbat (32 Knots) , can fly  a lot faster than a Jab (100-120 Knots) check out ATEC Faeta 27-135 KN  & Pipistrel Virus SW,  about the same performance.

 

I have never flown a Virus SW however the Faeta and its older slower sibling, the Zephyr are very very nice to fly - far nicer (in my opinion) than either the Jab range or Foxbat.

 

The Rotax powered Faeta  & Virus SW will econamy cruise at about 120 knots for a fuel burn of around 13-14L/hr ULP.

 

Both Faeta & Virus have about 300 kg empty weight -  Faeta 600 kg TO Virus SW 472.5 kg and can carry 100L ULP.

 

The principal of ATEC recently died, so I don't know if new aircraft are available - if not check out the preloved market (Europe nearly always has a few for sale  - don't forget to add the cost of shipping/import). Note : EU Faeta may have smaller fuel capacity & lower TO weight.

 

Pipistrel was bought out by Textron (American) and suddenly (without apparent engine/aerodynamic changes ) the Virus SW went from a 27 Knot stall  - High speed cruise of 135 knots  (NASA CAFE Competition figures) to Stall not given - High speed cruise  of 160 Knots???? If you drill down a bit the Cruise comes back to a slightly more be believable 147 Knots (still a tad on the high side).

 

The Faeta was always much cheapener to purchase than the Virus SW.

 

😈

 

[facthunter]

Be better it's name didn't sound like some kind of food and Virus's are not good.  Nev

[BrendAn]

6 hours ago, skippydiesel said:

Jabs are great and a big bang for the cost compared with most others.

 

If you want something that has a similar stall to a Foxbat (32 Knots) , can fly  a lot faster than a Jab (100-120 Knots) check out ATEC Faeta 27-135 KN  & Pipistrel Virus SW,  about the same performance.

 

I have never flown a Virus SW however the Faeta and its older slower sibling, the Zephyr are very very nice to fly - far nicer (in my opinion) than either the Jab range or Foxbat.

 

The Rotax powered Faeta  & Virus SW will econamy cruise at about 120 knots for a fuel burn of around 13-14L/hr ULP.

 

Both Faeta & Virus have about 300 kg empty weight -  Faeta 600 kg TO Virus SW 472.5 kg and can carry 100L ULP.

 

The principal of ATEC recently died, so I don't know if new aircraft are available - if not check out the preloved market (Europe nearly always has a few for sale  - don't forget to add the cost of shipping/import). Note : EU Faeta may have smaller fuel capacity & lower TO weight.

 

Pipistrel was bought out by Textron (American) and suddenly (without apparent engine/aerodynamic changes ) the Virus SW went from a 27 Knot stall  - High speed cruise of 135 knots  (NASA CAFE Competition figures) to Stall not given - High speed cruise  of 160 Knots???? If you drill down a bit the Cruise comes back to a slightly more be believable 147 Knots (still a tad on the high side).

 

The Faeta was always much cheapener to purchase than the Virus SW.

 

😈

 

he wants to support an aussie company.  jabs are a good aircraft and cheap to own. parts can be delivered overnight.

you keep praising atec but you sold yours and bought a sonex

[skippydiesel]

25 minutes ago, BrendAn said:

he wants to support an aussie company.  jabs are a good aircraft and cheap to own. parts can be delivered overnight.

you keep praising atec but you sold yours and bought a sonex

I think I did support Jab - nothing to do with being Australian, its just a good solid aircraft. That does not mean that, in my experince, there are aircraft that are better handling, faster & slower & more fuel efficient, all at the same time.

 

I crashed my Zephyr and was unwilling to go through an extended repair period - flying being much more to my liking than building. The new owner has put her back in the air.

 

I tried to purchase a Faeta in Australia. I even bid on an overseas one. Cost and circumstance were against me - much to my regret.

 

I then spent about 2 years pursuing Europa XS aircraft, without luck. I even modified a caravan into an aircraft carrier, in anticipation of the Europa purchase.

 

I wasn't  looking at Sonex, when the one I have now came up - price & performance pretty much as I wanted. I had to compromise on the detachable wings, the devils measurement system and  the construction material (metal) having a strong preference for composite.

 

My Sonex:

• Can cruise considerably faster than both the Faeta or Virus SW, for similar fuel econamy.
• Its stall is also faster (similar to a Jab) so I have lost that incredible short field landing of the ATEC.
• It noisier inside, than a composite aircraft. For the first time I am routinely using an ANC headset.
• Handling is terrific, thats if you like supersensitive. Being neutrally stable/designed for aerobatics, its not what I would call a benign platform - departures from straight & level flight develops quickly.
• Unlike the Zephyr/Faeta,  which have glide performance much like a glider, the Sonex with short stubby wings has comparatively poor glide performance - something that has taken me quite a long time to be comfortable with in my approach to landings.
• With 97L of usable fuel, my Sonex has a similar (3 L less) duration, at  the same power setting as both ATEC & Virus SW.
• Has less payload than the ATEC, similar to the Virus SW & space is at a premium. Its okay though- I packed it to go to Frogs Hollow Fly IN - got everything  stowed  for two nights camping, within W&B - VR failed so I could get there.
• Has a 4in (100mm) tail wheel - it doesn't like soft surfaces and I lack the confidence, at this time, to use full power to lift the tail, when things get a bit bogged down.

In short, I am happy with my Sonex Legacy/Rotax 912ULS/Airmaster CS. No aircraft is perfect, its what you are content with.😈

[BrendAn]

27 minutes ago, skippydiesel said:

I think I did support Jab - nothing to do with being Australian, its just a good solid aircraft. That does not mean that, in my experince, there are aircraft that are better handling, faster & slower & more fuel efficient, all at the same time.

 

I crashed my Zephyr and was unwilling to go through an extended repair period - flying being much more to my liking than building. The new owner has put her back in the air.

 

I tried to purchase a Faeta in Australia. I even bid on an overseas one. Cost and circumstance were against me - much to my regret.

 

I then spent about 2 years pursuing Europa XS aircraft, without luck. I even modified a caravan into an aircraft carrier, in anticipation of the Europa purchase.

 

I wasn't  looking at Sonex, when the one I have now came up - price & performance pretty much as I wanted. I had to compromise on the detachable wings, the devils measurement system and  the construction material (metal) having a strong preference for composite.

 

My Sonex:

• Can cruise considerably faster than both the Faeta or Virus SW, for similar fuel econamy.
• Its stall is also faster (similar to a Jab) so I have lost that incredible short field landing of the ATEC.
• It noisier inside, than a composite aircraft. For the first time I am routinely using an ANC headset.
• Handling is terrific, thats if you like supersensitive. Being neutrally stable/designed for aerobatics, its not what I would call a benign platform - departures from straight & level flight develops quickly.
• Unlike the Zephyr/Faeta,  which have glide performance much like a glider, the Sonex with short stubby wings has comparatively poor glide performance - something that has taken me quite a long time to be comfortable with in my approach to landings.
• With 97L of usable fuel, my Sonex has a similar (3 L less) duration, at  the same power setting as both ATEC & Virus SW.
• Has less payload than the ATEC, similar to the Virus SW & space is at a premium. Its okay though- I packed it to go to Frogs Hollow Fly IN - got everything  stowed  for two nights camping, within W&B - VR failed so I could get there.
• Has a 4in (100mm) tail wheel - it doesn't like soft surfaces and I lack the confidence, at this time, to use full power to lift the tail, when things get a bit bogged down.

In short, I am happy with my Sonex Legacy/Rotax 912ULS/Airmaster CS. No aircraft is perfect, its what you are content with.😈

The 2 sonex owners I know love them.  Great post

[Blueadventures]

The Vixxen A32 is probably the better aircraft in the 600kg group compared to the Jab 230D in my opinion;  you say you have flown 32's and the 22's; and also worth noting is the 230D empty weight is in the 270 Kg range and the A32 is 320kg so have around a 50kg plus for the crew, fuel and other cargo weight.  (Vixxen A32 is 280kg available and 230D has 230kg available)  The Jab 230D can carry in excess than a MTOW of 600kg and good for the new Class 'G' group.  

Edited yesterday at 12:51 PM by Blueadventures

[skippydiesel]

12 hours ago, BrendAn said:

The 2 sonex owners I know love them.  Great post

FYI - My Sonex Legacy,  not quite completed plans built, came from Leongatha,  Gippsland. The converted caravan/aircraft carrier, came in useful, as was used to transport  the Sonex all the way back to The Oaks, NSW.

 

There seems to be a "flock" of Sonex in Vic / SA.

 

😈