Who has "looped" a taildragger

[Dick Gower]

My brother had his initial training, to x-country, with the legendary Beth Garrett at Morrabbin, on Chippies. Even then. Morrabbin was too busy for use of runways to practice taxying, but I seem to recall him mentioning that Beth had him taxying up and down the line of tied down aircraft with the comment that if he hit any, he was up for the repair costs. Apparently, focussed the mind to the task in hand (or feet).That training must have been useful; he owned a J5G for some years, in which he did a lot of tug pilot work (and that involves landing short in any conditions to make even the costs..). I don't ever recall him ever ground-looping it. I still have both hands left after many starts of it

Beth certainly was a legend as were many of the RVAC instructors in that era. We were lucky to have them as examples.

 

 

[naremman]

Can recall some great tales that John O"Halloran would tell of his time at ARDU, when they had a C-47 which was based at Edinburgh to fly support. The RHS was filled from an newly graduated pilot from Pearce who had CT4 and Machi time, and faced the transition to ME and tailwheel concurrently. In the gods were kind a FAC Winjeel could be cycled through ARDU to help the transition, if not straight to the Dakota.

 

In a far from kind gesture the first session of circuits was often scheduled for late on a Friday afternoon once the Mess bar was open, with a critical audience to appraise the new pilot's progress!! John did state that despite the brutal adjustments required to attain proficiency, just about every pilot that survived the experience valued the experience, and usually made good progress through the RAAF.

 

 

[facthunter]

There was an accepted transitional path that you were expected to run through. I think its based on not pranging expensive aircraft so they used stuff like Ansons and Oxfords .Tailwheel from tricycle might be worse than doing tailwheel straight from the start. You would get students solo in a tiger or chipmunk in 8 hours or so if everything slotted in well. No gaps of inactivity and keep the theory ahead of the flying.'

 

Assy in some aircraft would be very critical especially something with a lot of power and not enough rudder, like a mosquito where the Vmc (g) was so fast you would be well airborne before you achieved it. The forces flew DC-3's (C-47's). into the air based on stall speed margins, not at a speed where the rudder could keep the plane straight with one engine out. This technique is not acceptable in civilian ops and is not practiced anywhere as far as I know, now. Nev

 

 

[Yenn]

My first taildragger was the Chippie, at Lovely Banks, near Geelong. i suppose that strip has gone the way of grovedale now.

 

I would love to get in one again now after nearly 50 years.

 

 

[David Isaac]

My first taildragger was the Chippie, at Lovely Banks, near Geelong. i suppose that strip has gone the way of grovedale now.I would love to get in one again now after nearly 50 years.

You old buzzard you ... LOL

 

 

[naremman]

Learning to fly with the Narrogin Flying Club in the first half of the 1970's meant that we had access to both a Tiger and Chippie, with the CFI being ex Army with C180 and Porter experience who, loved his tailwheel endorsements. It was his suggestion that we gain an endorsement initially on the Chippie, and then progress onto the Tiger. Sound advice, and I appreciated the high level of instruction, and despite a few minor instances of directional waywardness managed to not have the tail pass the front end.

 

Not long after gaining my endorsements I dropped into Narrogin to find one of my mates pre flighting the Tiger, and had an invitation to join him in a circuit. After I had strapped myself into the front seat, before he swung the prop the CFI wordlessly reached in and pulled the joystick out. I thought that was a bit unusual seeing that I was an endorsed pilot, but refrained from comment. All went well on the circuit until short final until I started to notice some aggressive rudder work, a delayed flare which then ballooned, more rudder oscillations, a thumping first touchdown followed by a sequence of bounces, thankfully getting smaller, and exploring some of the lateral dimensions of the runway before the Tiger finally came to rest!

 

After shut down I unstrapped myself and thanked my mate for the interesting flight. I was somewhat stunned with his response: "that was quite a good landing, I ground looped the previous two landings'!! I walked away thinking that between my mate and the CFI I had some really good friends. The Airtourer all of a sudden looked far more appealing.

 

In its time at Narrogin VH-CKF had been modified to be fitted with brakes and castoring tailwheel, and with the runway surface being ball bearing gravel runway excursions were quite common. Following its time at Narrogin it become the loved aircraft of Reg and Shirley Adkins, before joining the ranks at the Royal Aero Club of WA, and benefitted from some of Glen Caples's good work. Fittingly a few years ago it was named the "Shirley Adkins", so she had the pleasure of observing her old pristine Tiger on the line at RACWA before she passed away earlier this year.

 

 

[djpacro]

My first taildragger was the Chippie, at Lovely Banks....

I flew the Airtourer and Austers at Lovely Banks, don't recall the Chipmunk. Lovely Banks disappeared very many years ago.

[RickH]

While doing taxi tests I decided to disconnect tailwheel steering just to see what happens. A friend was videoing the tests. I opened the throttle wide and did not go very far before loosing control. And hey presto ground loop. what looked very scary from the cockpit(thoughts like oh shit I've just wrecked my new plane), actually seemed fairly benign on the video. Needless to say I very quickly re-instated the steering controls. The machine was totally uncontrollable without it. I have tried to upload to youtube but the file is to big . I will try to edit it down and perhaps upload latter.

 

 

[Yenn]

What sort of plane Rickh?

 

I have flown planes with no tailwheel steering. To turn you put the rudder hard over and give a blip of throttle. the skill comes in knowing how big a blip for how many degrees of turn. My RV4 disconnects the tailwheel at over about 30 deg of turn. It took a little while before I could get it to line up exactly where I want it. The Corby doesn't disconnect and a groundloop puts enough strain on the tailwheel spring to cause damage.

 

 

[RickH]

This is the link to video of my ground loop experiment(surprise)

 

I managed to edit it down a bit.

[RickH]

What sort of plane Rickh?I have flown planes with no tailwheel steering. To turn you put the rudder hard over and give a blip of throttle. the skill comes in knowing how big a blip for how many degrees of turn. My RV4 disconnects the tailwheel at over about 30 deg of turn. It took a little while before I could get it to line up exactly where I want it. The Corby doesn't disconnect and a groundloop puts enough strain on the tailwheel spring to cause damage.

Yeah Yenn but at that time I had no tailwheel experience whatsoever. but the experience certainly answered my quetions.