Downunder Posted November 21, 2013 Share Posted November 21, 2013 Looks too fast to me at the end with no flare? Just ploughing it down.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvlautZltRA 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted November 21, 2013 Share Posted November 21, 2013 Walked away from it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted November 21, 2013 Share Posted November 21, 2013 Looked like a big panic job to me, a classic case for practising glide approaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Carrier landing without the carrier. Walked away alive to fly another day, can't really criticized the chap as a bent plane is better than a bent person, yeah could have been done better but we weren't in his situation. Good job overall mate, your alive and that's all that matters to your family and friends and the rest of the flying fraternity. Alf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 just looked like a rough patch of ground and bent the nose gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 I've looked at it a couple of times and can't see anything other than that. He didn't look too stressed out, to me . Surprisingly little forward stick to counteract power loss. You can calculate the sink rate if the height stated is correct. All seems about right. Nev 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Xair.....least he found a clear area and headed for it. Seems like he kept control of the aircraft....a little fast at the end though .......any landing you walk away from, and he did walk away !....................Maj..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Good job. Dam she stopped quick aye? No spluttering or surging. No probs at all with the landing, unlucky with the paddock is all.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Typical TWO stroke stoppage symptoms. By the time any noises start, it's pretty much all over. I'm not anti two stroke in saying this. They have their place. Good power to weight ratio. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 yea. Ive stopped them before with the fuel cock and they tend to splutter and surge for a moment. Well, under those conditions they do. This one clearly stopped well before the prop stopped rotating. You can deffinately hear the prop windmilling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 I don't recommend shutting a two stroke down with fuel tap. They will lean right out . Switches off won't do it properly either as they will often continue running (badly) without ignition, if on high power. You can do it after idle. ( normal) Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 I don't recommend shutting a two stroke down with fuel tap. ( normal) Nev Thats good advice. We have had to do it during maintenance when doing other stuff. I dont stop 2 strokes in flight. Ive always been suss on them, I reckon if they are going, keep em that way!!! 4 strokes are a different matter:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Evans Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 i disagree my two stroke are as reliable as any four banger ' i had three with out a problem 'over 17 years never an engine fail comes back to maintains and proper engine management works for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 IF there's a fire you would do it but it's hard on the motor, when it's been running at high power. Maintenance wise you have to prove the fuel TAP? does it's job from time to time. Generally with four 4 strokes I prefer to run them dry with a fast idle and cut the ignition as they run out of fuel. The 912 is a special case as the thing clunks in the drive and is better idled as slow as possible before cutting the ignition. Some even run it on one mag to slow it down a bit more. With the two strokes, if you are using premix and don't drain the carb bowl(s) the congealed oil , when the petrol evaporates, could give you real trouble if the plane is not flown regularly. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 i disagree my two stroke are as reliable as any four banger ' i had three with out a problem 'over 17 years never an engine fail comes back to maintains and proper engine management works for me No engines should be stopped in flight, unless under certain conditions and with a Chief. I know the late ones are very reliable. Its just they can be tricky to start, and ive never really felt comfortable stopping one in flight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 True. I recall an airtest that had to have each engine feathered and restarted as part of the whole schedule. The first engine would not come out of feather, so no other done at that time. Engine was fine, but there are always other factors that come into it. In the PPL course long ago there was an engine stop and airstart exercise without started motor being used. Needed vertical dive to do it in the DHC-1.. I don't know if it had any practical purpose, except experience of the event. You will hit VNE easily, so it's a bit impractical. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 What engine was that nev? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 P &W R-2000. (Hamilton Standard Hydromatic Prop). Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaz3g Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 You can air start a C172 by diving and then pulling out fairly strongly. It's harder to stop the windmilling prop than it is to get it going around again. Kaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 No engines should be stopped in flight, unless under certain conditions and with a Chief. I know the late ones are very reliable. Its just they can be tricky to start, and ive never really felt comfortable stopping one in flight. Motz, I have shut down 582s many times in flight, and performed restarts afterwards with no problems. (Key start) After shutting an engine down you straight away set it up for a restart (ign back on, choke on, prime if you have one). Never had one fail to start right up again. Or just fly it right to the strip dead stick, which is great practise for that time when the real thing happens. In my experience most aircraft fly better without the prop spinning, as you don't have dirty air going all over the fuselage or tail surfaces. Golden rule !!...I have never shut down without being over the top of a large airport, often with multiple runways, or well within shooting distance of a good suitable landing site. I haven't never shut the Lightwing down, but that's not to say I would have a problem doing it, if the proper opportunity arose. To know how to fly your aircraft well with the prop stopped helps your chances if it stops unexpectedly. It is also a great exercise in judgement, constantly adjusting your approach and descent, to keep within the 'survival cone' with never any doubt that you will end up where you have chosen........Maj..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Evans Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 No engines should be stopped in flight, unless under certain conditions and with a Chief. I know the late ones are very reliable. Its just they can be tricky to start, and ive never really felt comfortable stopping one in flight. i have never shut down in flight never need two Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 It is harder to stop a Gypsy or Continental/ Lyc because as Kaz says they just keep turning over (windmilling) and often the pilot needs to do an entry to spin type manoeuver in the correct direction relative to the prop rotation. If you have a 'soft' motor compression wise it will gradually "leak" over anyhow and once she has started rotating slightly you have got it usually. Starting on the starter is easy. Note I don't think you would ever airstart a 912 without the starter.. The prop is effectively geared UP to the engine and they usually have plenty of compression. This exercise might have had some validity when low compression non starter equipped motors were around and you might run a tank dry accidently, but today I think it is a bit academic. Shutting an engine down completely exposes the engine to a fair bit of shock cooling. Where cooling shutters are fitted you should close them straight away.. Doug I never do it either and it is supposed to be with the CFI, if it is practiced. I believe. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvairkr Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 This bloke has done extremely well. I have been told he is a 30hr student pilot on his second solo. He had to put it in early or he would have cleaned up a heard of cattle and if he had tried to go over the cattle he would of been under power lines.....well done mate:thumb up: jason 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvairkr Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 found a link...http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2510474/Microlight-crashes-Somerton-fields-engine-cut-out.html jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvairkr Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Typical TWO stroke stoppage symptoms. By the time any noises start, it's pretty much all over. I'm not anti two stroke in saying this. They have their place. Good power to weight ratio. Nev Hmmm Nev, i thought it sounded like a four stroke it certainly looked like one through the windscreen:scratching head: jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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