Johann Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 [medio=full]210[/medio] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johann Posted July 13, 2012 Author Share Posted July 13, 2012 Just bragging at an airshow in Reykjavik, Iceland. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Studentbiggles Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 Johann....................thats not showing off .............very impressive...............is your pride and joys hangar name "Monkey"? cos she sure as hell climbs like one ..............enjoy our forum and tell us more about yourself Fly and Keep safe...................Alley 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyerme Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 wow,, incredible...now thats power.. you almost hanging off the prop...love it:beg: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Yes, impressive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 You can all go and copy it now and if the engine coughs you will look silly, for sure. It really doesn't require much skill.. Nev 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gundy Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 I agree Facthunter. I've gotten off the ground in less distance than this video but I always build speed in ground effect then climb. This video shows how some people juggle RISK in different ways. One splutter and it will be flying backwards tail low and into the ground. Gundy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinsm Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 There was a Savannah? at Natfly doing short take offs that make this look like a long take off. The natfly one was sensible in that he gained speed in ground effect before climbing. The natfly guy was Bl....dy impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 :yikes:That Zenith pilot would have to be careful to avoid this also: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballpoint 246niner Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Good STOL always respects the Attitude/Power envelope. You can only use one without the other for so long, play on one end of the see-saw at your peril, as any two year old knows, swing off one end of the see-saw and you will hit the ground, and get a sore butt! Best angle climb, like credit card debt, is not sustainable -borrow but you eventually have to pay it back.... Just some STOL philosophy for those who care. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Impressive, but I doubt he is carrying much fuel, luggage, etc. - or a passenger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Copiers may not be so disposed.. There's no shortage of would-be "aces". Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skyfox1 Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Just bragging at an airshow in Reykjavik, Iceland. Hi Johann and welcome l am doing a rebuild on a 701 l have a 912 ul what prop do you use . cheers Geoff.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nunans Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Best angle climb, like credit card debt, is not sustainable -borrow but you eventually have to pay it back.... Just some STOL philosophy for those who care. G'day, I'm someone who cares and is interested but I don't understand yet. Best angle climb, if that's the climb at speed Vx, why is it not sustainable? I think a plane can climb steeper than the best angle climb where it uses some inertia from fast level flight or a dive then pulls up very steeply and as the speed washes off levels out before reaching the stall speed or goes right over the top I guess, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nunans Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Best angle climb, like credit card debt, is not sustainable -borrow but you eventually have to pay it back.... Just some STOL philosophy for those who care. Why isn't best angle climb sustainable? or are you talking about climbing steep enough so that the plane can't maintain airspeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballpoint 246niner Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Best angle will give max height for a given distance, perfect for clearing obstacles etc but while lift is greater- so is drag so we now have a situation where thrust is losing the battle over drag therefore airspeed is now declining. Starting to make sense?, get your CFI to explain with pics, if necessary of lift/ drag curves and where the polar curves intersect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 I'm not suggesting that it isn't so I'm not really commenting on that. The considerations are, not much cooling air over the engine at highpower, controls are not as effective as at more normal speeds . The margin above stall is reduced to a minimum. Assuming you can rotate forward when the engine fails you will not stall as the aeroplane will be at less than one "G" but it will get a high sink rate initially till it builds up enough speed to unstall and later arrest the ROD and be able to flare. It's a high drag low weight ( inertia) situation and till a certain height is attained would likely have a heavy arrival. There is also the situation of lack of "margin" if there was any gusts etc. Unless your aim is to impress the spectators I consider it poor airmanship to not hedge your bets by having a litlte bit of speed up your sleeve in the early climb stage to cover your self in the event of an engine failure. I have had several of my friends have extensive spinal damage in this situation. It was a while back when you had more of an excuse for not knowing , but today it's supposed to be part of your training. Once you have some height it is not so critical but the "show off" effect is better near the ground Nev 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballpoint 246niner Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 I'm not suggesting that it isn't so I'm not really commenting on Unless your aim is to impress the spectators I consider it poor airmanship to not hedge your bets by having a litlte bit of speed up your sleeve in the early climb stage to cover your self in the event of an engine failure. I have had several of my friends have extensive spinal damage in this situation. It was a while back when you had more of an excuse for not knowing , but today it's supposed to be part of your training. Once you have some height it is not so critical but the "show off" effect is better near the ground Nev Nev you are spot on with this post and unfortunately too many pilots are influenced by images like this but have very little understanding of the risks involved- hence my credit card analogy. What I see in all this is a lack of developed understanding perhaps in the theory of flight, which can only have severe consequences due to ignorance. "Borrow for best angle- rely on best rate"- have the wisdom to know the difference! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryc Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 My understanding of this type of take off in a 701 is that if you have a problem like lose thrust below 100 feet you die. The savannah is the same but not as critical because of it's longer wing. some 701s have longer wings also, but all the same I don't think I would be in either at that aoa at that speed. The last flight I had in a savannah we did climb at a very steep angle but only after picking up speed and then continued picking up speed as we climbed. Having said that I love the 701 and the savannah. I'm not one of these people that try to compare the two and pick one over the other, their both great for what they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpacro Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 best angle of climb is a steady state condition therefore sustainable (until the ceiling is reached) but in many airplanes not a good place to be at low altitude with engine problems 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza 38 Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Flying like that all comes down to risk.All people take risks in life.Some calulated, some not.I agree, if the engine fails.It is going to end in tears.What are the chances of the engine failing at that crucial moment? a thousand to one, a million to one? (depends on who makes it and maintains it as well I guess)I dont know myself and I would not do that.I am am a member of the live cowards club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Not quite as steep but still clearly showing the capability of STOL Zenair aircraft: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 And another in "looping action" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 No not really looping there, more like an agressive wing-over type turn. But gee, from that in-cockpit footage you can clearly see where the Savannah came from !.... Johann, I'd imagine you'd be climbing into a pretty stiff breeze there, but still not a bad performance.............................Maj... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howard Hughes Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 The considerations are, not much cooling air over the engine at highpower, controls are not as effective as at more normal speeds . The margin above stall is reduced to a minimum. Assuming you can rotate forward when the engine fails you will not stall as the aeroplane will be at less than one "G" but it will get a high sink rate initially till it builds up enough speed to unstall and later arrest the ROD and be able to flare. It's a high drag low weight ( inertia) situation and till a certain height is attained would likely have a heavy arrival. There is also the situation of lack of "margin" if there was any gusts etc. In case people weren't already impressed enough with our flying skills, let's try a turn back to the field from this position! Sorry I should have put up a 'thread drift alert'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now