Bernie Knight Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Are there more RV's on the Rec. Aus register now?? RV 12's are going on. I've noticed a number of RV 3 's on Rec Aus registry ( 19 - .... ) They clearly fall under the 600kg MTOW and some are now on Rec Aus 19 - .... The RV 4 has a MTOW of 680 kg (1500 Ibs ) and I'm guessing the rear seat and harness is removed to reduce the MTOW to under 600 kgs. Now a single seat. Whilst I have not seen an RV 4 on the Rec Aus registry, I was wondering if there are any of the RV 4 's on and what have owners done to bring them under 600 kg.? I'm keen to hear about RV 4's on the Rec. Aus register. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRviator Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 There are two RV-9A's on the register, of which one is mine - which is registered as a two seater. HOWEVER, I do not have a two adult seater. I can take (almost) full tanks solo, or one of my young blokes for a two hour local junket, but for my requirements at present, this is a perfectly acceptable compromise at present. To get the weight down, I did nothing special, other than choose a tip up canopy, lightweight Sensenich prop (lightens the bank balance too, it does!) and lithium battery, and I have a basic interior that I sewed myself. I polished the majority of the plane and used vinyl stickers on the fuselage rather than painting. I have an O-340 engine but that was chosen for the performance aspect, irrespective of the weight. My BEW is 981 Lbs, so I have 360Lbs of payload. Retired Racer is the owner of the other RV-9 and I think he has an O-233/235 donk in his, so has a substantial weight advantage over mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRviator Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 That'll teach me for posting in a hurry... My payload is actually 340 lbs, not 360. Can't seem to edit the original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Knight Posted May 10, 2016 Author Share Posted May 10, 2016 Thanks KRviator The RV 4 converted to a single seat seems a great option. In the event Rec. Aus is successful in the submission to lift MTOW to 700 kg or higher the RV 4 could under normal configuration easily omply. Mmm just thinking... 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetiredRacer Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Hi Bernie, There is a red RV4 from Melbourne registered single seat in RAA. Being carefull with the build (weight wise) 3's 4's and 6's could make the weight but they would need to be light to make the required stall speed, where as the 9 has a different wing and has no problem with the stall speed but has to be built ultra light to meet the weight requirment. Bob Dennis 0-235 RV9a (406 kg) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ave8rr Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Bob, is the RV4 registered single seat OR just limited to single seat ops due MTOW restricted to 600kg. Would normally have design MTOW of 680kg. The RV9/9A has a stall of around 43kts and is the best Vans aircraft able to be registered RAAus especially if RAAus get 700/750kg MTOW. MIGHT even change mine over but there are other factors to consider. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Knight Posted May 10, 2016 Author Share Posted May 10, 2016 Thanks Bob - Mike for your thoughts. I'm thinking of jumping on an RV 4 and was considering the option of removing the rear seat, harness etc to comply with sub 600kg. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetiredRacer Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Hi Mike, That RV4 only has the front seat and controls. The back is now used for luggage. With my 9a being so light it stalled at 38 kts clean and 35 kts with flaps (solo). Loaded to 600 kg it was 45 kts clean and 41 kts with flaps. Bob 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ave8rr Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Hi Mike,That RV4 only has the front seat and controls. The back is now used for luggage. With my 9a being so light it stalled at 38 kts clean and 35 kts with flaps (solo). Loaded to 600 kg it was 45 kts clean and 41 kts with flaps. Bob Bob, my RV9A stalls around 43kts at MTOW with flaps. If I am solo and use full flap I need to be back to around 50kts over the fence or she will just float along in ground effect. Not a problem when there is plenty of runway but have to watch it when operating into fields of less than 700m or so. I know of an RV9A that will be on the market in a few months. Will only have basic instruments and radio. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Knight Posted May 10, 2016 Author Share Posted May 10, 2016 Mike, Thanks I'm reading your comments to Bob on the RV 4 and see how it's done now. Great discussion. OK - by removing the seat, harness, controls etc it then is basic storage behind. My guess is that's round 25 kg reduction in component weight along with the 75kg average for the passenger, it falls well under at around 580 kg. As I said I'm considering the RV 4 as a quick option that can be flown by any Rec Aus RAA only pilot. The Rec Aus RAA liability insurance as a Rec Aus. RAA member us a huge plus also. :cheezy grin:Mmmm - then if the MTOW for Rec Aus. RAA does increase it could be re configured with all two seat I'll keep an eye out Bob - RetiredRacer - for that RV 4 on the RAA - Rec Aus register in Melbourne. Someone may chime in here with other RV 4 on Rec Aus. RAA Thanks again guys for keeping the discussion going, its a good insight into options. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yenn Posted May 11, 2016 Share Posted May 11, 2016 I saw an RV4 at Monto a few years ago, from memory it had two seats, but that was in the days when the rules were being flouted by the tech man. I have a four with GA rego which I built. I very much doubt that the extra weight of the second seat, control and harness would be more than 6Kg. The RV3 would be a much better option if you were building for RAAus rego. It would perform abut the same and be cheaper to run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunder Posted May 11, 2016 Share Posted May 11, 2016 Lots of lightweight stuff for GA engines these days it seems. Electronic fuel injection, Full electronic ignition (no mags), lightweight head/cylinder assemblies. Also carbon fibre cowls, plenums, spats and other stuff... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pylon500 Posted May 11, 2016 Share Posted May 11, 2016 There is another RV4 on the register, doesn't do a lot of flying, and the owner was debating whether he wanted to keep it (it's in pretty good nick). Looking at your avatar, it mentions a P96? Maybe the RV owner would do a swap with you? I'll have to give him a call... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted May 11, 2016 Share Posted May 11, 2016 Increased MTOW isnt going to help if stall speed restriction stays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ave8rr Posted May 12, 2016 Share Posted May 12, 2016 Increased MTOW isnt going to help if stall speed restriction stays Shouldnt be an issue with the RV9/A Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Knight Posted May 13, 2016 Author Share Posted May 13, 2016 Tnx guys. I think the RV 4 is ok also with stall speeds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Knight Posted May 13, 2016 Author Share Posted May 13, 2016 I did get a call yesterday alerting me to considering converting an RV 3 or RV 4 to RAA Rec Aus advising the aerobatic capability of RV 3 and 4 and the prohibition on aerobatics once converted to RAA Something I had not worried about but worth being aware of... There are a few RV 3 and RV 4 on the RAA registry which is interesting Lets know if your on RAA with your RV 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetiredRacer Posted May 14, 2016 Share Posted May 14, 2016 I saw an RV4 at Monto a few years ago, from memory it had two seats, but that was in the days when the rules were being flouted by the tech man.I have a four with GA rego which I built. I very much doubt that the extra weight of the second seat, control and harness would be more than 6Kg. The RV3 would be a much better option if you were building for RAAus rego. It would perform abut the same and be cheaper to run. If he was flouting the rules he sure wasn't flouting them with me.!! He told me from the start he would not register my 9a with RAA.!!! I had to fight "hammer and nails" with him for three months and keep presenting him with evidence of it's legality before he had no option but to register it.!!! During this period he sent out a guy from Brisbane to independantly weigh the aircraft ( which proved my weights) but it took a letter from Scott at Vans to bring it to his attention that there were 9's and 9a's registered LSA in the states complying to that MTOW before he would register our 9a with RAA. Bob 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pylon500 Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 Actually if you're looking to build something in the RV3/4 type range, have a look at the Panther; https://flywithspa.com/ Looks like an RV, but built simple like a Sonex. Aerobatic (if VH), they were fairly cheap, don't know about now, and I think a two seat is in the works. Has folding wings. I was looking at one at Oshkosh'13, VERY interested... This is the prototype; 912s, 914, 915?, Corvair, 0-200, 0-233, UL, plenty of choices... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Knight Posted May 22, 2016 Author Share Posted May 22, 2016 Tnx guys for the suggestions. I've had a couple of messages regarding RV4 that are on Rec Aus RAA.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRamsay Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 The RAAus upgrade to 750kg will be with CASA by 30 June 2016. It is quite possible that we could have 750kg this calendar year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Knight Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Don Thanks, yes that sounds like a good proposal and I hope it gets up. Opens up the option to place many aircraft on the RAA Rec Aus register being aware that aerobatics is not permissible. I started a conversation - see your menu Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pylon500 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 And we've just re-invented GA with ALL it's associated rules, regulations and additional costs. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ave8rr Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 The RAAus upgrade to 750kg will be with CASA by 30 June 2016. It is quite possible that we could have 750kg this calendar year. Don, what will be in the weight increase request to CASA re maintenance of aircraft above 600kg? Take an RV4 / 9 for example. Currently these aircraft can be maintained by the builder IF the builder has completed the SAAA maintenance course. If not then the aircraft has to be maintained by a LAME. I can see CASA requiring similar maintenance requirements to those of SAAA across the whole RAAus fleet. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yenn Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 So it looks as if I could transfer my RV4 to RAAus rego. Why would I do that and have to pay annual registration and membership fees? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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