Guest mark gray Posted July 26, 2011 Share Posted July 26, 2011 Mark, your slip indicator has arrived Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted July 31, 2011 Author Share Posted July 31, 2011 Hi Everyone Time for another update its been 2 weeks since my last confession I have reached the point now where I can work on the plane for hours and not see what I have done. At least I suppose it means I am in the home stretch now but probably still about 70 hrs to go at least. I have been wiring up the dash and sorting out other wiring and the way to do it. I haven't used any of the supplied wiring as it is all auto cable although its a nice job seeing mine will be wired pretty much different I am using all proper tefzel wire to do all the wiring. I got both 4 and 2 gauge wire for the battery positive to see which one would be best for weight and size the 4 gauge will be fine and I will use the supplied positive as a earth wire from the battery. There has been some discussion about corrosion in the new factory Savs and I think a lot may have to do with only relying on the earth for the plane being at the battery and relying on the frame to take the negative return. This is a big issue in metal boats too so mine will be at the battery to the frame as well but my extra earth comes from the battery up to a earthing bar behind and attached to my dash then off the other side of the earth bar it goes out the firewall and onto the underneath of the mounting base of the solenoid then onto the starter this should ensure no earth returns through the frame of the aircraft. As you know I have fitted a Jabiru static port to the fin and also want to have a anti collison red flasher on the top of the fin so thought I had better pre wire this as well so I now have a 8mm air tube and also a positive and negative going up into the fin so where they come out the metal is sharp so I used a 32mm conduit bush in the hole picture attached here for the exit and I am happy with the way it came out. The 32mm bush also is used in the rear main floor spar for the cables to head forward to behind the dash the black conduit carrys the trim control and indicator cable and also the tail light cables. I have changed the plugs on the trim cable to something much better and sealed I have used these plugs for years they are standard equipment in caterpillar mining equipment. I installed two ways and sat phones etc for many many years for Hastings Deering and had to have all the right connectors so have heaps left over they are really well sealed they are called Deutch connectors if anyone is interested not cheap but excellent connectors The fin if it comes off also the tailplane you need to be able to disconnect the cables so I used a couple of 12mm sealed cable exit glands and added a small strengthener plate under the skin at the rear top hole. I have seen a lot of Savs where the cables just go through the large hole but I think they could foul the elevator cable so mine are at the side and fitted so they can't foul also I used 20mm conduit bushes in the frames of the fuselage so no chaffing occurs and where the cables go past the frames that are basically skin tensioners they can chaf the cables so will silicone some plastic strip over these sharp edges that way it can't move and will afford protection against any rubbing. I hope to do some masking off this week and spray the etch on the front cockpit floor and inside the front then paint the colour there as well I wasn't planning on putting any carpet in the front area so thats why I am painting it but if I do at a later date decide to carpet it certainly won't hurt to have the floor painted. ordered my engine a couple of weeks ago so hope to have the plane mainly finished and painted all over by the time it arrives then just to fit and paint the cowl. Still a lot of work to do but it is still the best project I have ever started and probably the most enjoyable I have ever done Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av8vfr Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Hi Mark, May I suggest supporting the tube where it passes across the mid-bracing or sharp edges. Or rub strip along the sharp edge. In flight these will move around and rub. And a split in the pitot tube will see your airspeed inaccurate. Unfortunately all of those nice glands etc. will have a knock on with over-all weight. Sometimes a fine line between a safe install and over-engineering! Just my 2cents! You are probably all over it anyway. Looks the goods. Not long now I imagine! Cheers, Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted July 31, 2011 Author Share Posted July 31, 2011 Hi Matt I said in the post I have some cable sheath that is split and thin so it will fit neatly over the sharp edges on the skin tensioners on the sides also where it goes through the battery holder etc but I will put some silicone on the inside of the sheath before putting it there so when it drys it will never move. Also where the cables go through the conduit bushes they will be cable tied as well. The extra weight for the connectors,bushes and glands and sheathing may add about .5kg absolute max I have saved a lot of weight in the instrument package about 5kg and I am also not putting in the carpet at this stage will save around another at least 6kg when you take into account the glue as well. I am very aware of the weight issues because I am no small unit and neither is the Mrs so got to be frugal where I can with the weight so at least I can take off with some fuel . I hope to have the Sav ready to go at 290 to 295kg Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av8vfr Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Hi Mark, No criticism intended. Looks like you are all over it. There is some "railway track" type strip that I have seen used on edges.. Also I find clear heatshrink excellent for troubleshooting.. As a side note, did you work as an instructor at the old SEQEB rocklea school in the 80's?....your name is a little familiar to me..... Cheers, Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted July 31, 2011 Author Share Posted July 31, 2011 Hi Matt Any ideas are always taken on board and I don't take it as criticism so no drama. Yes I did..infact last Monday I had lunch with some of the "old crew" this included my instructor at the apprentice truing school in those days at Banyo depot when I was an apprentice and many many years after became my boss at Rocklea Dave Hopkins. We get together with a few other ex employees every 3 months or so for morning tea and a lunch... I never miss it its such a great day. I left there in 1988 to start my own business which I still do today. Did you come through as apprentice or were you a liney Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av8vfr Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Hi Mark, I was an apprentice... started in SEQEB in 1988 thru to 1991.. Got unemployed sooner cause I excelled TAFE so the reward was a lesser apprenticeship.(ie: better scores meant less apprenticeship) I am around YCAB so if I see you're work logo I will give you a shout.. Cheers, Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Unfortunately all of those nice glands etc. will have a knock on with over-all weight. Sometimes a fine line between a safe install and over-engineering! Just my 2cents! This sounds a bit like "If it looks strong enough it is already too heavy" as a bloke I know often says of his aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 There has been some discussion about corrosion in the new factory Savs and I think a lot may have to do with only relying on the earth for the plane being at the battery and relying on the frame to take the negative return. This is a big issue in metal boats too so mine will be at the battery to the frame as well but my extra earth comes from the battery up to an earthing bar behind and attached to my dash then off the other side of the earth bar it goes out the firewall and onto the underneath of the mounting base of the solenoid then onto the starter this should ensure no earth returns through the frame of the aircraft. I used to work with installing marine two-way radios in a marine environment -Sydney Harbour- and I have seen some really bad examples of corrosion in aluminium boats because boat manufacturers did not want to spend a little bit extra on good high current cabling; instead they relied on the aluminium boat for the earth return. What you have installed in your Savannah, as described, will almost certainly reduce corrosion down to zero as all the “big currents” will be along the cables rather than the aircraft frame. Still a lot of work to do but it is still the best project I have ever started and probably the most enjoyable I have ever done Mark This is the most enjoyable build project I have followed …anywhere. I cannot wait until I have the means to get started on a project of my own. The extra weight for the connectors,bushes and glands and sheathing may add about .5kg absolute max I have saved a lot of weight in the instrument package about 5kg and I am also not putting in the carpet at this stage will save around another at least 6kg when you take into account the glue as well. I am very aware of the weight issues because I am no small unit and neither is the Mrs so got to be frugal where I can with the weight so at least I can take off with some fuel . I hope to have the Sav ready to go at 290 to 295kg Also, by not having to run a heavy cable to a battery located at the rear of the fuselage should have saved you kilos of weight. (I would be interested in how much weight was actually saved) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted August 28, 2011 Author Share Posted August 28, 2011 Hi All Had a few weeks here were I was too busy to do any real work on the Sav. But this week I have been hard at work scotch briting all the outside and inside the forward cabin area and cleaning it down. What a job...it may be winter but it certainly makes you break into a good sweat and the old hands were sore as well. But I wanted to get the etch prime on most of it asap otherwise all the hard sweat would be for nothing. I can now do smaller parts and a few other things also got to do the stab and elevator and also the fin and rudder. I will probably get all those done then primed then painted before I bring the wings over here to my place as I have a little work to finish them off and then the scotch briting and etching etc to get them done. Looks like I will probably have the Sav mostly finished before the engine arrives. The European economy as most know is in trouble and Italy is suffering a lot of labour strikes there due to the hash measures put in place there by the government. My engine should have been on the water now but I am told it and other engines for kits almost completed and another 2 factory builds are all held up because they can't be loaded due to strikes there. Hopefully they will get on the boat early next month so hopefully the engine will arrive late October or mid November. I should have everything done by then provided we don't get too much rain ,,,,can't paint when its raining :(. When I fit the engine then I can fit the cowl and paint it all then it should be pretty much finished ready to fly. All things going well she will fly in late Nov or December this year. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 Hi Mark, Rotax engines are made in Austria. Do they ship them via Italy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted August 29, 2011 Author Share Posted August 29, 2011 Hi 80K. ICP order the engines direct from Rotax and when you want your engine it is assigned to the serial number of your kit so basically its a OEM supply...which means the cost to the end user is cheaper :). The engines are then shipped direct from ICP to Outback aircraft which is who we get everything through. Outback supply the prop extension and prop you want so you get the lot from Outback at a much reduced cost because it is assigned to a kit. The std supplied prop is the Bolly 68 inch I am getting the Bolly 72 inch Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 Thanks for the info, KyleComms. About the 72 inch prop: it the performance much better and does this cost a lot more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted August 29, 2011 Author Share Posted August 29, 2011 Yes its about $250 more for the 72 inch prop...I flew Bills with the 72 prop and it makes a big difference on takeoff with 2 up and when coming in if you need a bit of power it really doesn't take much to adjust the slope also with taxing its super easy you don't have to rev the engine very far at all to get moving and then it keeps moving very easily. Bill wasn't happy with the 68 prop initially on his factory built and he got the 72 and said it was like chalk and cheese the difference I didn't fly it with the 68 only the 72 Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted September 5, 2011 Author Share Posted September 5, 2011 Hi All been a busy little beaver this past week and weekend. got the fin,rudder,stab and elevator scotchbrited and cleaned then etch primed. I took advantage of the good weather on saturday and pushed the fuselage out for some sun then the worst part to prime and paint is the underside of the fuse so I tried the primer for the first time on this area as it is easily hidden and if I made any mistakes its easily fixed and hardly seen. The wattyl primer is extremely thick almost like mud once you put the hardener in it gets a little better but you need quite a bit of thinner to get it so it will actually come out of the gun. It went on very nicely I must say and gives quite a nice finish even for primer. I setup the tail feathers on a overhead gantry with some steel tube so I could hang them to make it easy to paint them as well. I primed all of them this afternoon and they came up pretty good as well so really they all only need a light scuff with wet and dry and they will be ready for the top coat. I will leave the fuselage as it is because I have a few things still to do and have to etch the inside of the baggage area then I will prime the rest of the fuselage and get ready to do the top coat on it. When all this is done I will bring the wings over and scotchbrite them up and do the etch and primer after I finish a few things off on them. I am hoping to have all the painting and everything almost finished by the time the motor arrives Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pudestcon Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 You missed priming the screen, 2nd photo centre top!!! Pud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 You missed priming the screen, 2nd photo centre top!!!Pud I think that photo belongs to the other thread, the one that has been viewed about 8,000 times and has about 500 posts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted September 5, 2011 Author Share Posted September 5, 2011 now that is funny Pud. I had the TV on Ch10 news which is on at 5pm here...I didn't even notice that picture within my picture....probably because I have blocked her in my mind !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmick Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 the Plane is going to have red on it, you must have a soft spot for Ranga's :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted September 25, 2011 Author Share Posted September 25, 2011 Hi Everyone Well the saga continues. I have got undercoat on the whole fuselage and also the tail feathers masked up the doors...thats a bugger of a job too to make sure its right. I wet sanded the undercoat on the tail feathers and then prepsoled them and painted them the base white topcoat. I am reasonably happy with the finish on them because I was blind spraying I didn't have enough light on them as I had them hanging on a frame I made inside the garage but they turned out ok not perfect but passable. The Wattyl PR250 undercoat is a two pack and wow is it hard when it sets it really takes some sanding but the finish when its done it fantastic. I have spent the last 3 days rubbing back the fuselage my hands are about to fall off not to mention the almost blisters I have on my hands. I hope to get the base white on the fuselage this week so long as it doesn't rain and the humidity stays down. Then I need to get some undercut on the doors and get them painted. I have etched all the other parts and they won't be undercoated as they are pretty much out of sight behind the engine cowl or in the roof and the white covers it really well. The Wattyl super etch can be used a primer for the paint anyway I used it for the engine side of the firewall and also the inside front section of the cockpit so for these parts its not a problem and also less work. I finally got my glove box finished its raked down at a angle so on climb nothing falls out of the glovebox. So now I can etch the dash and paint it then fit all my instruments back in and rehook up all the wiring ready to install it after the final painting of the fuselage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pudestcon Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 That wouldn't be you sleepin' on the job would it? Pud PS. It's coming up a treat mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted September 26, 2011 Author Share Posted September 26, 2011 Hi All I have been trying to find fuel selector valves that I could live with as I want to be able to control all 4 tanks individually or paired etc. Aircraft spruce have some nice valves but they are very expensive. They have Andair which are great but by the time they get here they will be about 300 bucks each and I want 2 of them. They also have a cheaper one newton I think it is and by the time you buy the fittings to suit your pipe to the tanks they will be about 200 plus each. Steve Donald was over on the weekend to drill out the axel for the nose wheel on my lathe so you can fit the bolt through which is a AD that must be done. He mentioned he had a fuel selector for his Aeropup he got from Enzed I went there today but the only 3 way valve they have is way too big and heavy so after chatting and doing some drawings for the guys there they came up with this solution and it is just perfect for what I want. I want all my fuel selection behind the passenger so I can reach it easily. Most seem to have one set behind the pax and the other behind the pilot. Well I can't reach behind me in the Sav very easily. Peter Elliot had all of his over on the pax side and it makes more sense to me to be there it also makes all the fuel hose much easier. The RH wing hoses come straight in and I will bring the LH wing hoses across the top of the beam behind my and the pax head they can be anchored there they are also out of the way as well this will bring them straight into the 4 way selector switch then all 4 go out to 1 outlet which then goes into the fuel reserve tank. This then leaves the second input to the reserve free so it will then come up and connect to the top of the main tank on the pax side to act as the breather. This way when the fuel warning light comes on when I switch the taps over because there is no vapour lock in the tank it will fill back up and the light will go off this confirms I have fuel flow again...if it doesn't go off then I got to find somewhere to land in a hurry. Attached are the pics so you can see the size and how it will operate its easy to see what tank is on or off at a glance and easy to operate. The 4 port manifold the 4 switches and 5 hose barbs and the 2 end plugs for the manifold was a total of $106.00 inc gst which I thought was very reasonable. All I need to do is make a small bracket to mount the unit on and I will drill and tap into the back solid metal of the manifold so it can be attached to the mount I make Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 I have etched all the other parts and they won't be undercoated as they are pretty much out of sight behind the engine cowl or in the roof and the white covers it really well. The Wattyl super etch can be used a primer for the paint anyway I was wondering why you would undercoat at all if the Watyll etch primer does such a good job ...and the paint goes on OK? (It would save weight too, I suspect) I finally got my glove box finished its raked down at a angle so on climb nothing falls out of the glovebox. Knowing how steeply the Savannahs can climb, the glove box must angle down quite a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted September 28, 2011 Author Share Posted September 28, 2011 Hi 80k I am undercoating the outside components only the main reason is to get a good base and finish. I have not been heavy handed with the undercoat at all. You could use the super etch as a primer/undercoat but it is very dark and would take more paint coats to cover properly so at least 1 extra coat of topcoat for the coverage. Its a issue that in the end won't really make much difference in the weight factor when you look at it. For the etch prime to be used as a primer/undercoat it must be coated on thickly so 2 coats at least then 3 coats of top coats to cover. I have a light coat of etch prime then a light/medium coat of undercoat then 2 coats of top coat so in the scheme of things it ends up the same The glove box I made is hopefully angled enough but if it isn't I can soon make another at a greater angle as it has nutserts (rivnuts) in the lip of the box so the box screws in from the front panel. The reason is to get the dash out the glove box needs to come out first as I have left the majority of the rear dash frame in the aircraft. The box isn't finished yet I have to tig the top and bottom on it yet but you will get the idea Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted September 28, 2011 Share Posted September 28, 2011 Hi 80kI am undercoating the outside components only the main reason is to get a good base and finish. I have not been heavy handed with the undercoat at all. You could use the super etch as a primer/undercoat but it is very dark and would take more paint coats to cover properly so at least 1 extra coat of topcoat for the coverage. Its a issue that in the end won't really make much difference in the weight factor when you look at it. For the etch prime to be used as a primer/undercoat it must be coated on thickly so 2 coats at least then 3 coats of top coats to cover. I have a light coat of etch prime then a light/medium coat of undercoat then 2 coats of top coat so in the scheme of things it ends up the same The glove box I made is hopefully angled enough but if it isn't I can soon make another at a greater angle as it has nutserts (rivnuts) in the lip of the box so the box screws in from the front panel. The reason is to get the dash out the glove box needs to come out first as I have left the majority of the rear dash frame in the aircraft. The box isn't finished yet I have to tig the top and bottom on it yet but you will get the idea Mark That's a great angle, Mark . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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