JabSP6

Jab 2200 is around $14000 aus and the Jab 3300 is around the $18500 aus I believe the 912 rotax is around the $26000 aus but i could be wrong.

When the OP said that at 750hrs it needed reboring and oversize pistons, I thought that must have been a badly treated engine. Gentreau Some of the problems that are reported on these jabiru engines are simply caused by people maintaining them that are not following manufacturers specifications. I had a look at a motor that was sent back to jabiru on the weekend after the owner decided to rebuild it himself. He is supposedly a mechanic but after he couldn't get it to run he decided to ask jabiru to check the timing for him. When questioned about how he had checked some of the clearances for bearings and which loctites where used etc he went quiet. Oil was leaking out of it just sitting in the bench. On closer inspection the front crankshaft oil seal retainer was fitted up side down and hex headed bolts with big washers were fitted instead of the correct socket head cap screws. The engine thru bolts had not been replaced. The thread of the bolt was protruding by 8 threads on one side and was inside the nut by 3 threads on the other. Engine thru bolts must be replaced for every overhaul. This statement above also proves this point. The Barrels on these motors are not to be rebored. You can't fit oversize pistons. This is just asking for trouble and goes against the manufactures recomendations. Yes Jabiru motors do have some issues from time to time but what engine doesn't. If you have them built by the book and all the steps followed to the T generally you won't have any issue as many people out there flying Jabiru's never have. You only hear of the minority that have problems and i would be interested to know what the percentage of these where from factory built motors that have proper engine monitoring. Now sometimes parts fail and that can't be avoided. We have seen this with some Valve Springs to name one. But incorrect maintenance practices can be. Compulsion If you haven't already done so i would recomend you have some form of engine monitoring fitted to your J170 to firstly check cylinder head temps on all cylinders and secondly the Exhaust gas temps. This will give you a good idea of how the setup in your plane is working. I have been in some factory built planes that when checked actually have one or more cylinders running on the hot side and if left undetected would most certainly lead to an early overhaul due to loss of compression from either rings stuck in ring grooves or cylinders worn out of round. The one cylinder temp being monitored was showing in the green and the operator would fly acordingly but when the other cylinders were checked in the same conditions the cht's on other cylinders were too high. The best thing you can do is learn more about your aircraft which in turn will make you a better pilot. As many others here have said don't be afraid of an engine out. Continually practice forced landings and get into the habit of always having an option to land for your particular altitude. You will have many hours of enjoyable flying ahead of you with your Jabiru 170. They are a great aircraft. Safe Flying JabSP6

Dazza I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to use this concept to make a smaller version out of Alluminium to suit this application.

I have noticed that Jabiru have updated their Service Bulletins today with the Aircraft Control Cable Bulletin released last month by CASA . http://www.casa.gov.au/wcmswr/_assets/main/airworth/awb/27/001.pdf It is also on the RAA website SB-002-15-08-2012-All-Aircraft-Control-Cables. This affects all GA and RAA aircraft It clearly states that "An inspection is to be performed before next flight on all aircraft fitted with these types of cables to determine their current condition. Cables that have a life of more than 15 years MUST BE REPLACED BEFORE NEXT FLIGHT" I think this would have a significant affect on all RAA and GA aircraft especially with the fly ins coming up this weekend. Jabiru atates that they don't use the exact fittings mentioned in the Bulletin but uses the same materials in a similar manner therfore it is applicable to Jabirus. Make sure you have this carried out before your next flight. Safe Flying JabSP6

Thirsty I believe John Gordon (CFI at Emerald qld) runs his flying school as his main income. Also there are a quople of schools in Bundaberg where the CFI's are RAA only and do the same. Safe Flying JJabSP6

Ian This concept reminds me of the stand i use for my motorcross bike. You slide it under the bike then stand on an arm that jacks the bike up. The linkages go over centre so it stays up. Maybe this could be incorporated into you design so you can do this on your own if the situation came up. Also to keep the weight down aluminium could be an alternative. Great idea Ian. Safe Flying JabSP6

Rosita You can start a new thread documenting your experience and post pictures with it. This will most certainly help you in overcoming your blues. The more you talk about it the better. Sorry to here you received facial injuries but like Wayne says the positive thing is that you are both still here. All the best with your recovery and hope to here you are back in the right hand front seat of an aircraft again soon. Look forward to reading all about your experience and would be good to here if David can also determine the cause of the fuel starvation. I think this info will help everyone. Safe Flying JabSP6

Look forward to seeing you over there Kyle.

Hongie I will also be attending Monto but not sure which days yet as it is only a 1/2 hour flight from Bundy so maybe 1 or 2 day trips. I use my nokia phone charger in the cig lighter socket in the plane. If Maj has one in his plane it would be a good excuse to go for a local flight each day to charge them up otherwise you can charge them up in mine. Do you have a cig lighter charger? I would be keen to catch up for a chat with you all over there. Safe Flying JabSP6

Kyle I am keen to look at this presentation and i will also be going to Monto. Do you know what time and day they will be having this presentation. PS. I hope you got your proxy sorted mate. I used the Chairman as my first and then Andy as my secondary after discussing it with him. Safe Flying JabSP6

Proxy faxed today. Thanks Andy for helping to explain the 4 motions being voted on. Hopefully they will all get thru. Safe Flying JabSP6

Wig-Wag or alternately flashing lights are when the lights flash on and off so that only one light is on at a time. They may be on for 1 or 2 seconds at a time then alternate similar to the police, fire and ambulance headlights during the daylight hours of an emergency If you google wigwag you will see a control unit on ebay for about $16.50 so not expensive to hook up to the plane on a 3 way toggle switch, as well as having them both on if using low amp LED lights.

JWW For ease of fittment the Standard Jabiru light would be the easiest and 1 can be fitted to each strut as they are certified by Jabiru so no problem with structual integrity. To improve the lighting and reduce the current draw you can now buy a huge range of LED spotlights. Rather than the down lights Frank fitted i would suggest an LED spotlight be fitted to the strut mounted casing. You can then have the best of both worlds. Good lighting, low current draw and if you wanted you could have the lights on a 3 way switch. One position for off, one position for a wig-wag system, and one position for both lights on for those unfavourable situations or even taxing to the fuel bouser at night? It really wouldn't be that hard to hook up for someone with electronics knowledge. Have a chat with your local Auto electrician to find out what is available in the way of LED spotlights. Hope this helps. Safe Flying JabSP6

JWW I don't have access to U tube to look at the links but i know that Jabiru do fit Landing Lights to some of the J230 and 430 versions that are night rated. The light clamps to the top of the wing strut just under the wing and wraps around the strut. Not sure of the quality but i have seen a few of them fitted. A quick call to them would clear up the questions. On the Jabiru website there is a picture of a J230 showing this light on in the Factory Built Aircraft section under the J230. Scroll down the page and you will see the light under the wing at the top of the strut. Hope this helps. Safe Flying JabSP6

Mr Mal I have a Rob Patroney 3 Blade ground adjustable prop on my 3300 SP6. It has now done over 650 hours and is performing well. Rob also makes a 2 Blade ground adjustable prop for the 3300 so you do have a choice. I also live in Bundy and have been to see Rob several times to montior the prop's condition. I have nothing but high praise for Rob and his props. Safe Flying Andrew (JabSP6)

Thirsty. Firstly well done to land it safely and i'm sure that will be one of the best lesson your student could have. Like jetjr, i am curious if your plane has EGT and CHT monitors. I had an exhaust valve failure and my CHT on no 6 was always showing good temps. Turns out no 2 cyl was running quite hot and also with the setup in my plane the EGT's were way too high (lean). I was not aware of the issues until after it failed. Once i rebuilt the motor and fitted monitoring equipment i sorted the issues and all is good now. It would also be interesting to see what the condition of the valve guides are like. At 500 and 900 hrs there is a fair chance that these guides could be quite badly worn if they are still original. I have fitted K liner inserts in my guides and on inspection at 350 hrs all is good and within specs where as previously at 100 hrs standard guides were quite worn. No valve will last if the guides are worn. Can you keep us informed on the results of the engine strip down. Safe Flying JabSP6

Jetjr For now the standard alternator setup with regulator will be fitted along with the bing carby. Depending on the finances i have suggested fitting the 35amp alternator upgrade in place of the original system with the intent of suggesting fitting the S.A FADEC when it eventually gets released to the public. I agree that with the mechanical upgrades combined with the FADEC it should be a very strong reliable motor for many years to come. Looking forward to seeing the results. Safe Flying JabSP6

Jetjr I contacted Paul (rotec) ealier this week. I can confirm that they have moved out of the old shed and into a temporary factory while they wait for their new 700 square m factory to be built at the Tyabb Airfield. It is buisness as usual for him and his team. The motor i have to work with is serial no 81 and was surprisingly clean internally (rust free) for having never been run from the time it left the factory in February 2000. This motor is going into a 19 build aircraft so part of the upgrade from the old heads was to use the LC heads. Looking at the cost of replacing old heads with the fine finned heads worked about the same as the LC heads. There will be several things done to this motor to improve its reliability and it will remain a solid lifter motor. I will be using the 7/16" through bolts for those of you interested. It will be run on a dyno prior to being installed to the airframe. Should be a great motor when the project is complete. Safe Flying JabSP6

Jetjr Just curious why you mention the LC heads may not be available anymore. I recently purchased a set (a month ago) for a 3300 that is receiving a complete strip down and full rebuild. Very old motor that had never been run for 12 years. Safe Flying JabSP6

Hendonguy To keep things clear i will number the coils. Right hand position is coil no 1 and it works. Left hand position is coil no 2 and it doesn't work. What you have done so far is try the working coil no 1 in the Left hand position but it didn't give you spark at the plugs. Technically if it works on the RHS and you put it on the LHS with the correct gap and the earth wire disconnected from the coil then you should get spark from the lead of the coil. What i would do next is try no 2 coil, that didn't work on the LHS, and fit it to the RHS. Again check for spark at the coil lead. Do not connect either lead to the distributor when winding over. Make sure you use a jumper battery so you don't drain your battery. Be very carefull around the PROP when testing. Location on the engine of the coils is irrelevant as long as you have the coil gaps set correctly on both. If you don't get spark from one of the coils doing this test then i would suggest you replace the coil. If you do get spark when testing this way from both coils then you can start to narrow your search to the LH Distributor components. Hope this helps Safe Flying JabSP6

First thing to do is to check to see if the coil is producing spark. Disregard the Distributors all together. Pull both the coil leads out of the distributors and secure them to the motor so that there is a gap from the lead end to the earth on the motor of about 5 mm. Standing well clear of the prop turn the ignition on, Both Mag switches on and press the starter button. As the motor winds over you should see spark at both coil leads. If not Disconnect the earth wires to the coils as Brian suggested to be sure you don't have a short in this earth wire.. Test for spark again. If you now have spark, replace your earth leads to the mag switches. Still no spark then you need to check your coil gap to the flywheel. Should be around 10 thou. If you still have no spark replace your coil. Make sure you refit fibre washers between the coil and the coil mount. This helps reduce the temp of the coils. From what you say you have swapped the coil from left to right at the spider and only one coil works. I am a bit unclear from your description if the good coil worked in the both positions or if both coils worked in the one position. If both coils only give spark from one position it has to be a short to ground in the wire going to your mag switch of the bad position Remove the earth wire completely and give it a very good inspection. If one coil only fires but in both positions i would replace the bad coil. Keep it simple. Forget about the distributors. In this situation they only distribute the spark to each cylinder. The spark is generated from the magnets in the flywheel passing closely to the coils (10 thou) as long as the starter motor is winding the motor over fast enough and the earth leads are not earthed. Must be a minimum of 300 rpm. Make sure you keep everyone clear of the spinning prop while in test mode and be sure to remove the keys from the ignition each time you work on the motor just in case. The only other thing to check is that you have both the distributors fitted in the correct position for your timing and you have the leads on the correct plugs. sound simple but i have seen them fitted incorrectly. One way to check if you inlet manifold and tubes are leaking is to pressurise the carby by removing the supply tube and blowing in the carby with something like a vacuum cleaner on reverse cycle and spray soapy water on the manifold and pipes. I have never tried it but apparantly it works. Let me know how you get on. Safe Flying JabSP6

Eric If your motor did not have the heads on one side removed as part of the AD JSB- 013 then all that would have been done is the 12 point (ARP) nuts fitted to the standard 3/8" (Short thread) through bolts. You can easily identify this when you look at the Nuts on the through bolts as there will be no thread protruding past the end of the Nut. In fact you will see a couple of threads of the Nut. If the Heads were removed then it is possible that the 3/8" (Longer thread) through bolts were fitted and you can see this by a few threads protruding past the end of the 12 point nuts. The only way you can upgrade to the 7/16" through bolts is to strip the entire motor and split the cases. The dowels that fit between the 2 cases are replaced with a thinner walled Dowel which then allows the Bigger threaded bolt to pass through the engine. You will also need to open up slightly the holes in the barrel to allow for the 7/16" thread. If you have had the SB done and only have reasonably low hours on the motor i would not strip the motor just to replace these bolts. If you are close to needing a full rebuild on your motor then it would be advantageous while the motor is apart to upgrade to the 7/16" bolts. I believe that all motors coming out of the factory now have the 7/16" through bolts. I have not heard of any 7/16" through bolts breaking. Safe Flying JabSP6

Guys I have had all the aluminium inserts either replaced or reflocked back into position as well as the fitted bolts replaced in my SP6 2001 between 900 and 1000hrs TT. There were several things found here on my plane. Firstly 2 of the Aluminium Inserts had come loose and needed to be reflocked back into position. Another 1 of the Aluminium inserts was slightly worn but still tight in the wing root. Jabiru put an oversize fitted bolt in this one. They have them on the shelf and apparantly this is common. In one of the other posistions ( Strut mount at wing ) the bolt was worn. Simply replaced the fitted bolt here. This was picked up as movement during the 900hr service and repaired and then some of the others showed movement at the 1000hr service. All are now nice and tight again and free of any movement at 1085hrs TT picked up on your morning inspections by lifting the end of the wing up and down gently. Once you feel this you will know how much to move it up and down.

Diesleten Sorry to hear you are still having issues with your motor. Great work spotting this one early. Only 140 odd hours on it this time. Thanks for sharing your experience with us here. This is exactly why i joined this forum in the first place. I am just curious if this motor came back from Jabiru with the Bigger 7/16" throughbolts or just had the longer 3/8" throughbolts fitted and the ARP nuts glued on with Loctite 620? As i said befor thanks for the heads up on this situation. Safe Flying Andrew

ReD No avgas at Thangool (Bilo) Bundaberg has a Shell (self serve) Bouser (avgas) that has recently been upgraded to take all credit cards. Until about 2 weeks ago some cards (ANZ) wouldn't work. On the google map there are tie down areas (Green Boxes) between the 2 rows of the southern most hangers. If you let me know when you are passing through i can meet you up there to spread the Bundy Welcome. I am home most weekends. Andrew (JabSP6)