Guest ozzie Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Don't be daunted by the length, worth the read. nuff to make one cry. Final line is that it could be fixed inside 12 months. I recon i could fix it with three words ready,aim, FIRE!! useless idiots. Aircraft for Sale, Plane Sales, Planes for Sale – Aviation Advertiser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AerospaceTechnology Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 ? ............... Legacy of Bob Hawke ……. destroy Australian GA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultralights Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Lawyers, the first to be up against the wall and shot come the revolution.. same goes for the lack of adventure thread.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 ? ............... Legacy of Bob Hawke ……. destroy Australian GA this was Howard's mess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 accept darky....;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HEON Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 I do not understand why people are getting upset about CASA. They are just a bit earlier onto the "nanny state" band wagon which has occured, and is occuring, at every level of Australian society. Overall the vast majority of people are incapable of having a logical reasioned thought, accept responsibility for their own action (or inaction), and stand on their own two feet without the Government supporting them with undeserved funds from "us" (the reducing number of people who pay more than they receive). Their are a multitude of people who can manage "us" better than ourselves...anyone for pink bats, NT child intervention, Qld wild rivers, mining tax, school building program, etc, etc, etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSarcasm Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 except darky....;) phew!! I was getting worried there for a minute... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Don't you get me going Heon ....... I totally agree ... we are so over regulated that soon there will be anarchy of interesting proportions and I will be with them.David David,I Don`t think anyone of us realy want to see anarchy but boy am I angry about the over regulation, it has occured in every area of our lives and I`m also frustrated that all I can realy do, is complain about it then do what I`m told or face the consequences. I`ve come to the conclusion that Australia has become, what I call, " A decomratic dictatorship ". Frank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thx1137 Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Frank, I used exactly the same term awhile ago after some news report or other so I cant agree more. I wrote a lot of other stuff but deleted it. Too depressing. Since I was a kid I thought greed would be the end of us, it is um, interesting to see the changes over the last 30 years. 9/11 gave the greedy a great way to whip the populations in line mostly for the sake of profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wolf Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Could someone paraphrase the article or something. I may be a bit thick, but i dont quite "get" what the article is trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 description. We have a highly punitive system which we have to pay for and have no real say in how it is run, which is getting worse as time goes on. It is particularly ineffective in writing clear concise rules, that can be understood by anybody, and becoming more costly. Enough to make a sensible person quit aviation. ( Maybe they all have). Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 paraphrase> more than $240million has been wasted over 21 years by the Depts lawyers on reform of regulations of the 'system'. And it still has several more years before it even looks like being completed. At the current cost expenditure it will top out at over 300million. It will probably take several more CEO's to complete as well if one looks at how many have been beaten out of the job previously. The internal problems that haunt CASA will not go away with the way the show is being run. It is going to take a real stand up Polly in Canberra to sort this out. Quite frankly i am surprised that someone who has been screwed over by CASA has not totally lost it and taken to them with a shotgun. 21 years and 300million. i'll repeat that "21 years and 300million" dosen't anyone have a concept of what this is done to the country and the aviation industry! For God's sake kick this lot out toss every thing in the bin and bring the FAA's Randy Babbitt over to set up the aviation regulatory system. it is our only hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaz3g Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Ouch!!! That hurt... Lawyers, the first to be up against the wall and shot come the revolution.. same goes for the lack of adventure thread.. Gee, thanks... I bet nearly the first person you turn to for help if you or one of you kids is caught over 05, is involved in divorce proceedings, or experiences some other such brush with the law will be a lawyer. I work for a community legal centre, I do around 50 hours per week involving very damaged clients in a highly stressful court environment. And I do it for less than 60 grand per year rather than collect the old age pension I qualified for 4 years ago. It's not the collective lawyers' fault that things are crook in aviation. The responsibility starts with the voters and finishes with the government they elect. The government controls (or ought to control) the bureaucracy and appoints the people who occupy positions of power within it. If the appointed people can't fix the problem then an effective government would replace them. The last Government had 10 years to do this and failed (who sold off the arports and everything else?) and the present one needs a bloody good hurry-up if it is to do any better. Keep changing them until they get it right and leave the bloody lawyers alone! kaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 What I Have Learnt. Though we do need some rules,rules and regulations are only for those who chose to abide by them. Those who truely choose to do something,will do so regardless,therefore,ever more rules and regulations on their own will not improve anything. Frank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Escadrille Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 If anyone has worked in, for or around the Military will instantly recognise the management "style"..highly Bureacratic and lethargic... symptoms?..e.g,lazy staff -they call it delegating..,stonewalling..blame gameing, no one is responsible, vindictive, the rules appy to others...etcetera....Checked the media lately regarding the treatment of soldiers??..very shameful and CASA appears to have no consience either. I have been watching CASA (DCA, CAA) since a boy and to be fair we have made some progress( hence AUF RAA) ..but after watching them for 45 years...generally the CASA organisations suck SO get rid of all the ex military wallahs and other bureaucratic types and we might get some where.. But I could be wrong..so convince me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSarcasm Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Lawyers, the first to be up against the wall and shot come the revolution Why? Because parliament makes crappy laws? Because they conduct legal actions on behalf of their clients who employ them to do so? I tend to stay away from arguments about 'lawyers are evil' but they do often seem to get a bad rep for things that aren't their fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Why? Because they conduct legal actions on behalf of their clients who employ them to do so? Is it realy that lawers only act on behalf of the clients who employ them and not their own self interests,or are they part of a system that benefits and promotes an ever increasing litigious society, which ultimately disadvantages the majority of us? I don`t have a problem with lawyers as such,I`ve lived this long without having to use the services of any and I hope never to have to in the future. Frank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultralights Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Gee, thanks... I bet nearly the first person you turn to for help if you or one of you kids is caught over 05, is involved in divorce proceedings, or experiences some other such brush with the law will be a lawyer. Because they conduct legal actions on behalf of their clients who employ them to do so sadly i have 75,000 reasons, and no longer have a house thanks to a lawyer who convinced a magistrate that i should have closed the road before backing out of a driveway dispite somone driving the wrong way down a drivway, and not even remembering having an accident, and not one scrap of paperwork stating an accident even happened, which created a dent no bigger than your hand yet still requiring the entire other side of the car to be rebuilt. its almost as if they pulled my name from the white pages and sued me for an accident that was completely made up.. and in the face of overwhelming evidence that i was not at fault , the magistrate in my case declared everyone should close the road in both directions before exiting a driveway.... and because i didnt, i lost... so, i dont mean my comments as a personal attack, and lawyers do have their place in society, but in many cases, and in all my experiences with them , including my parents divorce (who the only winners were the legal team), they must be certainly living on another planet in a totally different solar system..... sorry, end rant.... now back to the usual programming, im going flying.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 This is not about 'mainstream' lawyers. It is about those lawyers and staff employed or contracted to CASA, who are maintaining an internal rift to prevent these reforms from going thru. Regardless of how i or you feel about these jack boot reforms is irrevelant. Fact remains it has taken all this time and money and the process is still ongoing. What no one has mentioned is why there is a strong resistance within CASA. Could it be that some of these servants of the crown see an easy well paid career with a fat kissoff cheque after a few years? Or maybe others see the job as a stepping stone in either the political or or big wheels scenes. It is most unfortunate that these reforms as they stand and whatever else they need to introduce to complete the package has and will continue to greatly affect every area of aviation in this country. I notice in this months RAAus mag in Eugene's page that they looking for the reasons people are not renewing, well here's a good one. the intimiating way regulation is administed buy CASA and some controlling bodies. Seems everyone is eager to remind you that two years in the pokie comes with your certificates to indulge. Ah well a poke in the eye is as good as a salute. Ozzie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yenn Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 I havn't found the time to read it all but the general gist is clear. cASA is charged with the safety of aviation. What is the best way to make aviation safe? Stop as much flying as you can, but I don;t think that is CASA's intention. If they stopped all GA flying and recreational flying, they realise that they would have only the airlines to contend with and the airlines have alot more clout, especially those that drag the pollies in and out of Canberra. The CASA beaurocrats have worked it out that the way to kep their well paid jobs for life is to be always busy fiddling with "safety" legislation. Never mind that they could just lift the FAA's regs and use them quite easily. Tha politicians have been muzzled, any time they try to haul CASA into line they are accused of lowering safety standards. What I can't understand is how no other government body has cottoned on to the scam. Just think how they could go if motorists were treated the same way. Just imagine having to have a current set of the traffic act in your car, available from government for big dollars. Have to have your car maintenance performed by a licenced mechanic with miles of paperwork and traceability of spares. Buy a quarterly map of the country with all the traffic lights and one way streets for more big dollars. Maybe I should stop before a beaurocrat or politician gets wind of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 If the appointed people can't fix the problem then an effective government would replace them. The last Government had 10 years to do this and failed (who sold off the arports and everything else?) and the present one needs a bloody good hurry-up if it is to do any better. What happened to Schofields Aerodrome in north-western Sydney? I don't think it has been sold off, it has just fallen into disuse due to government closure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaz3g Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Dear Rob Lawyers are like the rest of society... there are the good, the bad and the ugly. I hope I'll be judged in the first tranch and I'm sorry you had such bad experiences. In my view, the management of aviation policies in this country has gone sadly and badly astray and successive governments are squarely to blame. Yes, CASA has underwhelmed us with its many volumes of largely indecipherable legislation. Yes, it has acted more as a vigororous and relentless enforcer than an educator and leader in the ways of safe aviating. And yes, it continues to follow the same path under the new leadership -- some might say it has returned to its former path since Byron's departure. Certainly, the latest report from AOPA does little to instill confidence that Government is in charge and CASA is pursuing a more consultative approach to its duties. According to AOPA Vice President Andrew Anderson, CASA spent the best part of the last year preparing a report for government on potential (user pays) new services and radar coverage. Although both Government and CASA had access to the entire industry's expertise in one place - ASTRA - they both chose to ignore it. This while ink on the much heralded White Paper was still wet. Remember how "The Government welcomes the establishment earlier this year of an independent industry chair and new charter for ASTRA and encourages senior industry representation in the performance of its activities. Industry through ASTRA is now well placed to work cooperatively with aviation agencies to identify ways to improve systems or take advantage of new technologies and in coordinating planning for their implementation." Now we have to wait and see just how badly they muck up the introduction of whatever version of ADS-B they hit on and hope that the world's avionics manufacturers are prepared to supply equipment at something less than the Airbus price. Peace kaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 I work for a community legal centre, I do around 50 hours per week involving very damaged clients in a highly stressful court environment. And I do it for less than 60 grand per year rather than collect the old age pension I qualified for 4 years ago. Good on you kaz,you must be needed and doing good work. All the best, Frank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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