HeadInTheClouds Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 So I flew for the first time since January today, and seeing as the Foxbat is no longer available I had my lesson today in a Jabiru LSA 55. It was interesting to say the least. I found it somewhat uncomfortable to sit in and taxiing was stranger with the pedals being less responsive, it also doesn't like being run with the engine right on idle either. The fuel pump was also another thing to worry about, as was carb heat. Takeoff was straight forward enough but a bit different to what I am used to. Today was a bumpy windy day and so flying down the coast to get the feel for it I felt like I was more wrestling the aircraft rather than flying it in order to keep tracking in a somewhat straight line. Letting it try to ride out the bumps put it in all sorts of weird attitudes. Came back for some circuits where it got way more difficult. I found it really hard to nail the approach speed of 65kts when the end of the white arc is only at 70kts but it became easier. Landing was also a hard task and the stick has to more or less be fully back by touchdown which seemed different, the stall warning horn screaming at me also was different. One takeoff was particularly horrendous with a gust of wind and me leaving the nose wheel down a bit too long sending us a bit off course. Overall I found the LSA 55 tough to manage (Not least because I haven't flown for ages) and even more so in the windy conditions. I think I would find it much better on a smooth day. Next time I get the chance to fly RAA will be June, so I think I'll be doing a few GA lessons in a warrior sometime soon. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayavner Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Interesting feedback on the 55, good to know. My school has one as well as the Jab 170. So far I have stuck with the Jab and the Tecnam, and by the sounds of it I am glad I have! At least until I get wayyy more time under my belt to be able to cope with that kind of behaviour! Would you fly one again, if given a choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeadInTheClouds Posted April 12, 2012 Author Share Posted April 12, 2012 Given a choice? Probably not, depending on the choice though. I would like to fly one again in calm weather though to see how it handles then. At the moment the thought of flying it solo terrifies me! haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I'll be interested in your Warrior/Jab LSA comparison HITC. My view is we are paying a lot of money to progress through training/stay recent, not to spend a whole lot of hours wrestling with a poor design. Less hours in a more expensive Warrior actually comes out cheaper for me, and I can take 3 passengers and do longer trips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayavner Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Given a choice? Probably not, depending on the choice though. I would like to fly one again in calm weather though to see how it handles then. At the moment the thought of flying it solo terrifies me! haha Thought of flying ANYTHING solo terrifies me at the moment!! haha :-P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeadInTheClouds Posted April 12, 2012 Author Share Posted April 12, 2012 I've already had two solo flights but flying this solo at the moment just seems out of reach.... By the time I come back to RAA lessons I may have a much better alternative to fly anyway. I do miss the good old Foxbat though. It's probably a good thing to be familiar with Jabiru's though seeing as they are so commonly available for hire throughout Australia. And yep I'll post back here once I have had the chance to fly a warrior. The LSA 55 is a challenge but I'm sure it could be mastered with more experience in it/in calmer weather. From my experience today though once I have my cert and pax endo I would be somewhat hesitant to take anyone up in an LSA in anything other than totally still and perfect conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I have never heard anyone like the LSA 55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naremman Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Jake, if you persist with that twitchy little Jab and master it, I will bet there will be many times in your future flying experiences, when you will reflect and view the Jab far more favourably than your first impressions. When I made a GA to RAA transition a couple of years ago I firstly flew a Jab 160, as my daughter was learning on one, and I was keen to be aware of the aircraft she had flown before she flew VH with me. I was favourable impressed with the aircraft, especially in the training role, and thought that anybody who flew a Jab 160 well was in a good position to move onto most aircraft. I then got to fly the Foxbat, and that is a pilot's indulgence. Great performance, and as for shooting a 40 Knot approach solo, just loved it. In choosing a trainer, my vote would favour the Jab. The Warrior is a very honest aircraft, exceeding easy to fly, but after my first flight in one I turned to my Instructor and said: "you are not training pilots in that are you"? Some of the best trainers are not easy to fly, and remember stability in flight impacts at the other end of the spectrum. Tiger Moths trained many great pilots, but even the venerable old Tiger has left many pilots with bruised and diminished egos. Enjoy, and learn from every experience Jake. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayavner Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 You got a point, even my instructor steered me away from in in earlier days, saying he didn't want to put me off flying... I can see why now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camel Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 So I flew for the first time since January today, and seeing as the Foxbat is no longer available I had my lesson today in a Jabiru LSA 55. What happened to the Foxbat ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeadInTheClouds Posted April 12, 2012 Author Share Posted April 12, 2012 What happened to the Foxbat ? It's no longer being used by the flying school for reasons I'm not going to go into/not entirely sure of. It was never owned by the flying school anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 The Jabiru in question is not a plane I would just send anybody off solo in. It requires a serious input and understanding of it's characteristics. Once you have done a bit of time on it you will feel better about it, and if you fly it well. you won't have trouble with other planes, generally. Don't get slow, or cross controls and keep the weight off the nosewheel, always. It could do with a bit more rudder authority, but you can cope with that...Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Given time you could probably find a way to make a soft landing in a paper bag with a rock in it. My point is we should not be paying thousands of dollars just to work that out. It slows the training down, a bit like learning how to drive in a car with no brakes, one indicator and a savage pull to the right. It might make you a more experienced driver but it's a rip off not using a roadworthy car. Naremman, each time we have a discussion on the LSA or the J170, someone comes up with a story on how the J160 isn't a problem. The three aircraft have different surface areas, empennage moment and a few other variations - they are three completely different aircraft. I'd agree the J160 isn't an issue, but what HITC is describing is common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultralights Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 the little LSA Jabiru will teach you to really fly. the aircraft won't help you at all. and if you can master the LSA, then you can easily fly anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Heard it all before UL, a bit like getting a degree in Japanese origami........at our cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galpin Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 the little LSA Jabiru will teach you to really fly. the aircraft won't help you at all. and if you can master the LSA, then you can easily fly anything. I did most of my training in the LSA 55. While it was a hand full, initially, I soon learned to appreciate the aircraft. Thankfully I never bent it or ran into any objects on the ground. Since training days, I have flown a few different Jabiru's and a Lightning. The LSA 55 certainly helped me in my flying of these other aircraft. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Going from the Foxbat to the Jab 55 is a bit like going from a small auto car to a manual ute, when you have no experience with manuals. Don't give up on the Jab, but being truly honest if you want to get in the air quicker go the Warrior. As I reckon you'll need at least 3-5hrs of circuits in the Jab before you'll have it mastered, coming from a Foxbat background. You'll have the Warrior down pat in an hour easy I reckon. Pity they use so much more fuel! It should't idle bad, if it does that needs to be fixed, usually an idle adjustment, unless it's a fuel jet issue. Stalling it on I wouldn't recommend on those older Jabs with smaller tail and rudder (just personal experience, I'm no instructor). I do love Jabs, they are a great little aircraft, flown every model except the old 470 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SAJabiruflyer Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I have never heard anyone like the LSA 55 Here I am! I have spent some time in an old LSA55 with over 6000hours on the airframe, and probably about 20 engines or more.. and I liked it. I found it easy to fly, and you cant argue with the price on the 2nd hand market. I also liked the simplicity of the flaps. I flew on calm and on windy days. I might be biased because most of my time has been in Jabs, but I tend to have a smile a yard wide anytime I fly, in any plane :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deskpilot Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 As they say, if you can fly a LSA55, you can fly anything. I am amazed, even shocked, that some-one would send you up in one without previous experience. Flown correctly, they're a great little plane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 You would be surprised how RAA schools operate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngster Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 HITC, you've got me a bit worried. I was just starting to get the hang of the Foxbat, and now I've got my first 55 lesson booked for next week. Perhaps it's not a bad thing learning on something that a little hard to handle. Although compared to the Foxbat, I reckon anything would be hard to handle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeadInTheClouds Posted April 13, 2012 Author Share Posted April 13, 2012 As they say, if you can fly a LSA55, you can fly anything.I am amazed, even shocked, that some-one would send you up in one without previous experience. Flown correctly, they're a great little plane. You might have read it wrong, I was with an instructor... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeadInTheClouds Posted April 13, 2012 Author Share Posted April 13, 2012 HITC, you've got me a bit worried. I was just starting to get the hang of the Foxbat, and now I've got my first 55 lesson booked for next week. Perhaps it's not a bad thing learning on something that a little hard to handle. Although compared to the Foxbat, I reckon anything would be hard to handle. Don't worry about it, really I am probably exaggerating a bit because of my previous flying experience in such a nice plane which would make us both a bit biased. As long as the winds are somewhat calm I'm sure you will manage it fine, it's just different and harder to get used to really. Despite the fact I wasn't a fan of it I still managed to be able to do takeoffs and landings unassisted after the first go at each, just that they weren't so glamorous... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SAJabiruflyer Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Don't worry about it, really I am probably exaggerating a bit because of my previous flying experience in such a nice plane which would make us both a bit biased. As long as the winds are somewhat calm I'm sure you will manage it fine, it's just different and harder to get used to really. Despite the fact I wasn't a fan of it I still managed to be able to do takeoffs and landings unassisted after the first go at each, just that they weren't so glamorous... You know what they say Jake... "any landing you can walk away from is a good one". Also, it's a great landing if the plane is still in one piece! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Moore Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Jake, You will probably find the warrior a piece of cake. Things happen a touch quicker but the oleo's on those old girls can seriously cushion some hard blows. The low wings ride you in on a cushion of air and there a lot more like a truck where as your Jab55 is a sports car. I am might the only one here but I find most new aircraft types a challenge at first until I get the hang of them. When your hours are lower you tend to rely on the idiosyncrasies of each type as a golden rule of flying so when they change it really throws you out!!!! They tell me that changes with time and experiences. For me it changes with grappling with the idiosyncrasies of each aircraft I fly and adding them to my brain, categorised by aircraft type!!!!!! Hey it works!!!!! As for all the comments learning in harder aircraft/paying more as opposed to easier and paying less. I figure it is about net zero either way. Pay more learning a harder aircraft and go fly mostly anything or pay less learning something easier then take the time getting the experience (costs money) to fly the harder aircraft. Either way your out of pocket about the same amount so go for the goal of choosing the option you enjoy more. Not going to lie, I have done about 10 minutes in a Jab on a test flight after replacing the heads for some friends. Not sure the model number but it was a 4 seat version with the 6 cylinder. I did not like it at all to be honest, nothing against the aircraft just not my cup of tea. Was different to everything else I have flown and I know if I took the time to learn to handle it well would be a very nice aircraft, but I also found the build quality (was factory built) a little messy and untidy. I only have a little RAA time, most of it in the Auster which is still a pretty heavy aircraft lots of inertia. Enjoy the difference of the warrior to the Foxy and Jab, takes a little to get your head around! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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