Balance Masters from Leading Edge Air Foils

[Tony]

There are two kinds:

Engine Balance Master fitted on Fly Wheel

Props Balance Master fitted on Gearbox Flange behind the Prop

 

https://www.leadingedgeairfoils.com/engine-airframe-accessories/balance-master-products.html

 

Are they doing the job, are they any good ?

Please share your experience with them.

 

[Area-51]

I have one already fitted on the 912 prop flange; they work great. With the carburettors sync'd it runs as smooth as a button at all rpm ranges. Bought another two for the rainy day shelf.

 

They are cheaper to buy in Spain than the USA.

[Tony]

Por favor, what would be the link to Spanish outlet, gracias.

[skippydiesel]

Had one on my last 912ULS - Cant say either way if it did anything at all.

I started with a carefully static & dynamic balanced prop - smooth as silk!

Added the Blanche Master - no change.

Consoled myself with the thought that if I ever did loose a little bit off one blade, the Balance Master would compensate, allowing for a smoother emergency landing (DV!) 

[facthunter]

Think I'd just makes sure the balance is as good as possible in the first place.  Nev

[Area-51]

4 hours ago, facthunter said:

Think I'd just makes sure the balance is as good as possible in the first place.  Nev

Correct. The balance master adjusts for any fine deviation and inconsistency of both the static and dynamic balance. If you spend time getting the static balance right the balance master style disc will take care of the rest on each startup.
 

The same concept is used on larger units for automotive car and truck wheels and tail shafts, and for motor racing a small bag of lead shot is placed inside the tire to move around freely to where the balancing is required during driving.

[facthunter]

Never heard of that in racing tires  and IF it's already balanced the bag of shot going anywhere will unbalance it.  No?  Nev.

[Area-51]

On 05/08/2023 at 3:45 PM, facthunter said:

Never heard of that in racing tires  and IF it's already balanced the bag of shot going anywhere will unbalance it.  No?  Nev.

Totally the opposite; the bag goes to where its required. The steering vibrates like hell momentarily from the standing start then once the bag places itself it stays there until the wheel comes to a full stop, and the process repeats again. There is no other pre-balancing of the rims applied; the bag is the method used for dynamic balancing.

[facthunter]

What if the wheel is accelerated suddenly?.   If the thing is already in balance any weight anywhere will muck it up.  .  Nev

[Area-51]

2 hours ago, facthunter said:

What if the wheel is accelerated suddenly?.   If the thing is already in balance any weight anywhere will muck it up.  .  Nev

Centrifugal force keeps the bag hard up against the inner wall of the tyre. Because its a bag of pellets it will roll around and reposition itself again and flatten out, so if its a front wheel driven setup wheel spinning or the front wheels lockup under brakes then the steering will shudder again momentarily. The bags are used to mitigate inconsistent wear of the tyres during service such as flat spots etc.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Area-51

[facthunter]

You are really not answering my question. I find it hard to believe anyhow and wile having been involved with racing all my life. I've never seen it used in tyres and dynamic balancing can't be aided much by  something not very wide.  I've specialised in Balancing things for over 60 years. I've known of it being used on props  and not inclined to go there and I prefer in principle to balance each part separately and then you can swap things without worry.  The idea of thing s that can flop around doesn't do it for me at all. Nev

[onetrack]

Seems like you need to update your thinking, Nev - they're in use in regular cars and trucks, as well as race cars.

 

https://www.abcbalancingbeads.com/all-you-need-to-know-about-balancing-beads

 

https://www.abcbeads.com.au/products/6ozbag?variant=44946870862138&currency=AUD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&gclid=Cj0KCQjwib2mBhDWARIsAPZUn_m5ICwcfCPz3W5afY9SUkJPLOlZixR3DkvjJUYE7qMW-WUw7wV9NSEaAtiEEALw_wcB

[Area-51]

12 hours ago, facthunter said:

You are really not answering my question. I find it hard to believe anyhow and wile having been involved with racing all my life. I've never seen it used in tyres and dynamic balancing can't be aided much by  something not very wide.  I've specialised in Balancing things for over 60 years. I've known of it being used on props  and not inclined to go there and I prefer in principle to balance each part separately and then you can swap things without worry.  The idea of thing s that can flop around doesn't do it for me at all. Nev

I too have many decades dealing with precision mechanical components and criteria and was equally in absolute disbelief when first being introduced to pellet bags some eight years ago; never ever heard of them before that. And the whole concept just sounds physically impossible; but it works!

 

The balance master brand use mercury as the moving mass media; lesser quality brands use granulated lead shot which does not provide as precise result.

 

If your aircraft is already kitted out it will display what looks like a 5mm black ring directly behind your prop hub assembly.

[facthunter]

Liquids like mercury are another matter . It would still get out of synch at times Any part with any length still requires proper dynamic balancing and there's torsional  forces and reciprocating weights also.  a Change of vibration is a warning sign not to be ignored or masked  That is why vibration meters are commonly used  There's nothing UNSAFE about balancing each component to it's required tolerance and leaving it at that.. To Me it's the best. Where those meters were fitted the Engine was shut down IF the vibration increased. Not if it would put you into a hill of curse   Nev

Edited August 7, 2023 by facthunter
more content.

[IBob]

I would very much like to see an explanation as to how/why the mercury/shot would distribute themselves so as to provide balance.
I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm saying I would like to understand how. And so far I have not come across an explanation, just assertions that it does.

[facthunter]

It certainly can't do much dynamic balancing if it only a  few millimeters wide and what if there's a reduction gear involved.?  Nev

[Kyle Communications]

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

7 hours ago, IBob said:

I would very much like to see an explanation as to how/why the mercury/shot would distribute themselves so as to provide balance.
I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm saying I would like to understand how. And so far I have not come across an explanation, just assertions that it does.

Me too, iBob. I don’t understand how it works, but it does. I used slime in my bike tyres for yonks, mostly as a puncture preseal, but it also seemed to help with balance.

I have a mercury-filled Balancemaster fitted behind my prop and it seems to be running more smoothly. 
My plane has no vibration monitor, but I have a habit of filling in my flight plan while warming up the engine. Going back through years of sheets lets me see trends in wobbly handwriting. 

[aro]

My understanding is the "wobble" from imbalance causes the beads/mercury etc to collect on the light side, reducing the amount of imbalance.

It can never bring it to perfect because if it was running in a perfect circle the material would be distributed evenly and wouldn't change the balance, but it will be better.

Washing machines apparently use the same principle to balance their spin - a liquid filled balance ring at the top of the tub.

 

[Old Koreelah]

My old front loader had a great lump of concrete bolted across the top.

[aro]

Front loaders are a bit different, they have gravity on their side to stay put, and can even slow down and use gravity to redistribute the clothes when they are out of balance.

[onetrack]

The concrete on the front loader was merely a dampening device, using its mass to minimise big wobbles.

The ball-type balancers have been around for about 50 years at least, I can remember a company selling them to fit to truck rims in the late 1960's. They used steel balls inside a mercury-filled tube, back then.

The ceramic balls are an idea I've not seen before, I wonder how they get the weight into them? Some of the balancers used lead balls, but I would imagine they'd have to be a lead alloy or they'd be too soft.

[IBob]

10 hours ago, aro said:

My understanding is the "wobble" from imbalance causes the beads/mercury etc to collect on the light side, reducing the amount of imbalance.

It can never bring it to perfect because if it was running in a perfect circle the material would be distributed evenly and wouldn't change the balance, but it will be better.

Washing machines apparently use the same principle to balance their spin - a liquid filled balance ring at the top of the tub.

 

Yes Aro, but this is where I get stuck: if the rotating part is wobbling, due to imbalance, that means the 'heavy' side is rotating on a (slightly) larger radius than the light side. Would you then not expect the beads/mercury also to flow to that heavy side? Or, at best, is the angular acceleration identical at those two points...in any case, what I am getting at is what are the forces acting on the beads/mercury to cause them to distribute?
 

[skippydiesel]

If you assume/accept that the Balance Master works, the questions must then be;

• Is it any better than doing a good static/dynamic balance?
• If the Balance Master is as good as a static/dynamic balance, is is a more cost effective solution, to out of balance conditions?
• What if any are the long term implications of a Balance Master/conventional balance?

As I said earlier - Subjectively (no instrument) I could not detect any change/improvement, to my setup (careful static/dynamic balance), after fitting a Balance Master.