derekliston Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 Drove out to Watts Bridge today (Hopefully fly in next year) Perfect day and lots of beautiful aeroplanes but you really have to feel for the Stearman pilot who ground-looped in front of probably 300 pilots and I think ripped a wheel off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 Embarrassment!!! There would have been plenty of people who can tell him what he did wrong anyway, he will never have to wonder. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poteroo Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 Drove out to Watts Bridge today (Hopefully fly in next year) Perfect day and lots of beautiful aeroplanes but you really have to feel for the Stearman pilot who ground-looped in front of probably 300 pilots and I think ripped a wheel off! Refer to Tailwheel Endo in Student Pilot section of this site. I'll bet this Stearman driver had more than 1 hr of dual in his logbook. One lapse in concentration and your taildragger is away! Sad that it happened to such a great aircraft. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Where was it from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Refer to Tailwheel Endo in Student Pilot section of this site. I'll bet this Stearman driver had more than 1 hr of dual in his logbook. One lapse in concentration and your taildragger is away! Sad that it happened to such a great aircraft. Poteroo, It is incorrect statements like yours above that give taildraggers their unjustified bad reputation. Truth is most taildragger pilots loose it through lack of overall experience in the type, or because they attempted to land too fast, both the fault of the knob behind the knob, not the aircraft. The Stearman is a WW2 trainer that is not know for being overly dangerous as a taildragger................Maj..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M61A1 Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I saw the Stearman with a bunch of people around it, but I didn't realise that it had ground looped until reading it here. I initially assumed that the pilot had been marshalled into a ditch or got a flat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poteroo Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Poteroo,It is incorrect statements like yours above that give taildraggers their unjustified bad reputation. Truth is most taildragger pilots loose it through lack of overall experience in the type, or because they attempted to land too fast, both the fault of the knob behind the knob, not the aircraft. The Stearman is a WW2 trainer that is not know for being overly dangerous as a taildragger................Maj..... What was incorrect? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 What was incorrect? "One lapse in concentration and your taildragger is away" is not really a correct statement. It may be for some taildraggers ( Pitts etc) but not for most.,and certainly not the Stearman. It is clear from viewing the landing video that it was prob pilot induced in that he appeared to land fast and failed to slow down fully before attempting to exit the runway....don't really know what his hurry was...guess some people like to learn the hard (and costly ) way. Cheers........Maj..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Could it have been a mechanical issue like a brake locking up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Listening to a Stearman owner at Luskingtyre some time back. There are 3 powerplant options fitted to them, as the HP goes up the meaner they become. Many have been caught out with the highest HP rated one when doing touch and goes. Open up too quickly and be slow on the rudder and aways youse go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekliston Posted September 1, 2014 Author Share Posted September 1, 2014 I don't know where it was from. Just thought it was an expensive Oops! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Poteroo,It is incorrect statements like yours above that give taildraggers their unjustified bad reputation. Truth is most taildragger pilots loose it through lack of overall experience in the type, or because they attempted to land too fast, both the fault of the knob behind the knob, not the aircraft. The Stearman is a WW2 trainer that is not know for being overly dangerous as a taildragger................Maj..... Well Majjy old son. You obviously haven't been bitten yet by a momentary lapse in concentration with all those tailwheel hours under your belt in that sweet little Lightwing. Unlike you I was bitten twice when I was the most current and cocky. As Potts said all it takes is a momentary lapse in concentration and they can really surprise you .. I know that from personal experience but was lucky enough not to damage anything other than my underwear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 If you all look at the video you will see his feet were asleep as she started to yaw ... There was no rudder input even after she was going. BTW, I think Potts is eminently more qualified on this subject than almost anyone on this forum ... Not that he needs me to defend him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 But it was nice of you to do it anyway! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poteroo Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Checkout pprune for the video of the accident, plus many comments following. happy days, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 If you all look at the video you will see his feet were asleep as she started to yaw ... OK David or anyone can you tell me where the video is? For some reason I cannot find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 If you all look at the video you will see his feet were asleep as she started to yaw ... There was no rudder input even after she was going.BTW, I think Potts is eminently more qualified on this subject than almost anyone on this forum ... Not that he needs me to defend him. Well Majjy old son. You obviously haven't been bitten yet by a momentary lapse in concentration with all those tailwheel hours under your belt in that sweet little Lightwing. Unlike you I was bitten twice when I was the most current and cocky. As Potts said all it takes is a momentary lapse in concentration and they can really surprise you .. I know that from personal experience but was lucky enough not to damage anything other than my underwear. David my friend, I have been flying taildraggers since 1984 with probabily 80% of my total time in them including biplane time. I have had three exciting moments that come to mind. First in the aforementioned biplane landing on a sealed runway on top of a ridge with a solid crosswind. = loss of directional control with lower wingtip scrape. 2nd ...complete loss of control in same biplane whilst testing a new style tailwheel which failed = switches off with 720 deg rotation = 2x groundloops. Third was in 912 Skyfox after owners had changed the MLG bungee wraps without informing me = aircraft left runway into long grass with prop damage. Just last week I did two very nice landings in a friends narrow- gear Kitfox 4 912 without drama, bit I did make a point of not touching down one knot too fast. Having lived in the States for 12 years I can guarantee I have seen a shitload more Stearman landings than you have, with all sorts of engines including 450 Pratts ( bull Stearman.) .The guy at Watts either had a brake lock up or simply tried to leave the runway with too much speed. He should have let it slow a bit and he would have had no drama. not a real flash demo of how to land anything in my opinion. I'd be interested to know his TT in Stearmans. Lightwings by the way rarely try to bite anyone.........................Majjy old son............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PapaFox Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Thank you Papafox.......just watched the video again. The first Stearman (33) did a lovely landing using quite a bit of right rudder imput indicating there was probabily a left crosswind component. He did the right thing and let it roll out and slow whilst keeping it straight. Red Stearman touched down too fast whilst also using right rudder imput also indicating a left crosswind component, he didn't take care of business quick enough, let the left wing come up and then lost directional control. Fortunatly not a lot of damage except to his pride. Stearmans are known for being tough. The deflated right tire is typical after a groundloop when the side load rolls the tire off the rim.........you do need to stay ahead of taildraggers...he was behind it in this case............Maj........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Could it have been a mechanical issue like a brake locking up? Er, you experts, what if the PILOT said it was a brake lockup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Er, you experts, what if the PILOT said it was a brake lockup? Tubzy darling .... if so where was the rudder input to counter the yaw from possible brake lock up???? I should also say i feel sorry for him, but he got off pretty light really considering what could have happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 David my friend,I have been flying taildraggers since 1984 with probabily 80% of my total time in them including biplane time. I have had three exciting moments that come to mind. First in the aforementioned biplane landing on a sealed runway on top of a ridge with a solid crosswind. = loss of directional control with lower wingtip scrape. 2nd ...complete loss of control in same biplane whilst testing a new style tailwheel which failed = switches off with 720 deg rotation = 2x groundloops. Third was in 912 Skyfox after owners had changed the MLG bungee wraps without informing me = aircraft left runway into long grass with prop damage. Just last week I did two very nice landings in a friends narrow- gear Kitfox 4 912 without drama, bit I did make a point of not touching down one knot too fast. Having lived in the States for 12 years I can guarantee I have seen a shitload more Stearman landings than you have, with all sorts of engines including 450 Pratts ( bull Stearman.) .The guy at Watts either had a brake lock up or simply tried to leave the runway with too much speed. He should have let it slow a bit and he would have had no drama. not a real flash demo of how to land anything in my opinion. I'd be interested to know his TT in Stearmans. Lightwings by the way rarely try to bite anyone.........................Majjy old son............. I know sweet pea, I knew you had sh!t loads of hours in the tail draggy thingies, so you now agree a momentary laps in concentration can make things exciting; and that is all Pottsy was saying. The thing is the Stearman pilot may have little TT. But in my case I got bit by the aircraft I was most familiar with and the most current, took me by surprise the little Citabria did. The C180 and 185 never surprised me ... but I was very aware they could and concentrated like hell when flying those magnificent machines. Now my old Auster ... well she is always full of bouncing surprises,but they are manageable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Er, you experts, what if the PILOT said it was a brake lockup? Don't think that will happen that was left cross wind and feet not working could happen to anybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 I think those planes would not be easy in cross wind because you can not put the into wind wings down much as the lower one is already close to the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza 38 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 A mate of mine was there and he said that there was no x wind. Calm conditions 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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