That's ironic.

[red750]

[dutchroll]

Waiting......waiting......waiting.......

 

 

[Downunder]

Off topic forum went that way ->

 

Yes, it's an aircraft, but the topic is not.

 

 

[Bats]

Oh I dunno, we were all celebrating International Womans Day recently by offering rides, here we have three who have not merely puttered around as passengers, but risen to the top of their profession - as pilots.

 

 

[Downunder]

Ok, I'll give you that....fair enough.

 

 

[ron dunn]

Good luck to them. They are pretty well looked down on in most other respects. Says something for aviation.

 

 

[winsor68]

[ATTACH=full]41973[/ATTACH]

There is no law forbidding women from driving in Saudi Arabia.

 

 

[Bats]

Really? Must be a recent development then, because they certainly were banned from doing so when I visited about 18 months ago. Their attitude to the subject is probably best summed up by this case; ie batshit irrational! http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-30602155

 

 

[winsor68]

Really? Must be a recent development then, because they certainly were banned from doing so when I visited about 18 months ago. Their attitude to the subject is probably best summed up by this case; ie batshit irrational! http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-30602155

That is how batshit irrational people spread batshit irrational bxxxshit. Good work. THERE IS NO LAW FORBIDDING WOMEN TO DRIVE IN SAUDI ARABIA. The fact that you managed to visit the place and still have no idea is very informative.

 

 

[Mriya]

That is how batshit irrational people spread batshit irrational bxxxshit. Good work. THERE IS NO LAW FORBIDDING WOMEN TO DRIVE IN SAUDI ARABIA. The fact that you managed to visit the place and still have no idea is very informative.

OK.. I'll bite....

Care to elaborate Windsor? The article did highlight that it was not technically illegal, but from all I have heard it may as well be. Do women drive in Saudi Arabia? If so, what practical limits do they face?

 

 

[Bats]

That is how batshit irrational people spread batshit irrational bxxxshit

What part of "they do not issue licences to woman" did you not understand Winsor? Perhaps I need to reduce it to basics with a local analogy - "Australian Aboriginals are not banned from voting, we just refuse to register them as voters" Is the concept clear enough for you now?

 

As a aside, ever noticed how the self styled guardians of tolerance and light find it entirely acceptable to reduce their viewpoint to personal insult and abuse?

 

 

[Yenn]

Nobody said it was illegal for women to drive there. What was said was that Saudi would not let them drive a car. Not quite the same as saying it was illegal.

 

It is not illegal to do some things in Australia, but the government will not let you do them. For instance they will not let you can meat in Tasmania. No law against it but plenty of beaurocracy to stop you being allowed to do it.

 

 

[winsor68]

Nobody said it was illegal for women to drive there. What was said was that Saudi would not let them drive a car. Not quite the same as saying it was illegal.It is not illegal to do some things in Australia, but the government will not let you do them. For instance they will not let you can meat in Tasmania. No law against it but plenty of beaurocracy to stop you being allowed to do it.

I stated (accurately) that there is NO LAW BANNING WOMEN FROM DRIVING IN SAUDI ARABIA. Batman then asked "Really" and stated they most certainly were banned. That is not the case. Just stick with the facts and stop being extremists.

 

 

[dutchroll]

Windsor is correct, as much as that will irritate some people.

 

In fact women driving in Saudi Atabia is tolerated in rural areas out of necessity. There's no actual Saudi law against it, but it is generally forbidden by extreme religious custom (unlike most other Islamic countries where women can drive quite freely) especially in urban areas.

 

Women who drive there, and there have been many examples, risk being detained. The usual punishment is to sign a pledge (sometimes their husbands must sign it) that they will not drive again.

 

Sure, they may as well for all practical purposes have a law against it, but I'm just pointing out that what is allowed and what isn't in Saudi depends on where you are and, to some extent, who you are.

 

 

[P4D]

Dismal oneupmanship hair splitting. Legal or not the effect of their men's bigoted ignorant view of a females role in their society means that they are denied the privilege of driving. More of an indicator of their backward stone age mentality than their legal system.

 

 

[Bats]

I believe my old grandad called it picking the flysh!t out of the pepper - and it wasn't a compliment. I do console myself with the image of a self important defender of Saudi dignity explaining to a gathering of women that actually there isn't a law stopping them from driving, including those who have been arrested for this non-crime in the past few years. Perhaps he could carry on to explain this to the King's advisory council who have the possibility of permitting women to drive on their agenda, and have done for several years? I suspect that it could be a highly entertaining spectacle.

 

 

[dutchroll]

Who is the self important defender of Saudi dignity? I think it's an atrocious society - a terrible example of outdated religious extremism in so many respects.

 

However it's pretty bloody fundamental to distinguish between a country's legal or constitutional framework, and pure religious oppression. They're not the same thing and I would've thought it's rather basic and important to know which of those two is the prime cause of the problems.

 

That's not *picking flys**t out of pepper". It's just having an understanding of what you're talking about.

 

 

[P4D]

That's not *picking flys**t out of pepper". It's just having an understanding of what you're talking about.

That's mistaking methodology for outcome

 

 

[facthunter]

It's general attitude of controlling women. They can't get a passport without husband's permission either, nor can ex-pats live there with a woman they are not married to. Some of this stuff is pre new testament behaviour/attitude. Of course it wasn't that long ago women didn't get the vote here either, so we can't regard ourselves as long perfect. Nev

 

 

[dutchroll]

That's mistaking methodology for outcome

The methodology matters a lot if there is a need to work backwards to change the outcome. Unless someone doesn't give a crap about the outcome......in which case they can arrive at it however they like.

Anyway......whatever. I agree Saudi is an abomination. What they need is not law changes, but a fundamental shift in societal attitudes. Scrapping or modernising the odd law here and there will do absolutely diddly squat for Saudi women.

 

Classic example is rural India. They actually have fairly modern laws. Makes stuff-all difference to the severe oppression and appalling treatment of rural women there.

 

 

[facthunter]

The "Class" system in India is rather an abomination for a modern Democracy, Getting rid of that would have to be a first step. Nev

 

 

[Geoff13]

The "Class" system in India is rather an abomination for a modern Democracy, Getting rid of that would have to be a first step. Nev

I thought exactly the same thing about the Class structure in England when I was posted there in the mid 80's

 

 

[pmccarthy]

India is sorting itself out gradually which is as fast as society can be changed. In some places they are even dealing with littering. It will be a different country in twenty years.

 

 

[dutchroll]

I can only hope so. It was only a few weeks back that yet another Indian girl (18 years old) had acid thrown in her face causing 95% burns and permanent damage to her eyes because she rejected a marriage proposal from a boy. It's very sad when a country has to have a specific criminal offence titled "causing grievous hurt by use of acid".