naremman

Certainly have David. "A Gift of Wings" sits along with works by Richard Hilary, Ernest Gann and Winkle Brown on my bookshelves. One of Bach's lesser known literary works is "One", which contains a certain aviation focus with some other interesting components.

The farmer in me loves winter weather. I have a great appreciation for mud, though I tend to deal more with dust. Winter weather certainly can inhibit the opportunities to go flying, but some of the best flying weather occurs in winter. The performance of an aircraft in winter bears little resemblance the pititiful summer climbouts, and turbulence is certainly less of an issue. Some of those cold crisp days of winter are flying nirvana. Winter also has the capacity to bite thee firmly on thy backside. Quickly moving fronts, lowering cloud, visibility changing in an instant, last light arriving all too soon, and the realization that a carb heat knob is actually there to be used are all issues that are incorporated into the proficient pilot's mindset. Winter is all part of natures cycle. I have sometimes posed the question to some of my city cousins: "when you turn the tap on in February, what do you want to come out?"

Nev, the Tiger Moth that I flew at Narrogin in the 1970s has a long range tank fitted above the knees and behind the instrument panel of the front seat. It had a pump, and swing bar running down the right side of the cockpit accessible to both pilots to pump fuel up to the top tank. A bit crude, but effective. I had no overwhelming desire to sit in a Tiger for five hours to burn that lot of fuel though. My late first wife was singularly unimpressed on her first Tiger flight to have Avgas dripping onto her leg!! Flying an Airtourer you are sitting on up to 132 litres of Avgas, but its location between the spars and it being a rubber fuel cell has resulted in very few fuel fires in survivable Airtourer bingles. Cliff Tait experienced burns after an Airtourer crash, but that aircraft had a metal fuel cell and Cliff is a strong advocate for the original fuel cell. In an aside, Richard Hillary and Geoffery Page, two Battle of Britain pilots experienced extensive burns when the header tanks in their Hurricanes behind the panel lit up. But they were dealing with someone from the Luftwaffe intent and capable of considerable harm, thankfully something we don't have to deal with.

No, no, no Tommo. The wife is the GPS. Forever telling you where to go!

If you fly an Auster you have probably got a fair idea Louis, or failing that you would have an Auster with the most gravel rashed wingtips going!

PPL with 250 hours in command in the min criteria Nev.

I must be an even worse bowerbird than you David, as I laid hands on ASG 100 printed in 1977! Macarthur Job was thethen Editor, and this bloke has probably never received adequate recognition for his work in aviation safety. He wrote in the 100th edition: "Some things never change and the hazards that plagued helmetted and goggled occupants of the open cockpits of yesteryear are the same that catch out those who fly in the snug comfort in today's sleek aeronautical machinery. Those hazards moreover, have no respect for persons!" In the days pre internet and social media the "Crash Comic" was the prime medium for promoting safety within aviation. Every aero club has copies laying about, and Instructors made frequent references to articles featured in the editions. Within ASG 100 here is "Cautionary Tales", an aviation message expressed in verse, with some classic artwork. Featured was Grasping Gilbert: Gilbert's plane is fairly bulging, In overloading He's indulging. "She'll handle it," he's heard to boast, -whenever he is overgrossed. Another kilo he tries to squeeze, But beyond the strip - a clump of trees! 'Twas density altitude Gil forgot, -and that was how he copped the lot! And Fearless Fred: VALE POOR FRED - an aspiring flyer, A shame he wasn't flying higher! VALE POOR FRED - he was lost for ages, And now he's in the Digest pages!

I would be interested to see if there are any projections on current PPLs with a current Class 2 who will excercise the option to go with a RPL. Whilst I see some appeal with this option, it would make my NVFR rating redundant, and I would be closely checking on any other further limitations before heading to a RPL. Could be interesting with Angel Flight. As an existing Angel Flight pilot would they accept pilots with a RPL flying missions? A pretty fair proportion of AF pilots are at the mature end of the spectrum, and what impact would a good number of AF pilots choosing to fly RPL have on their ranks?

Working around the farm I have never been comfortable with a wrist watch, and most times never wore one. Just had to remember to grab one before I went flying. The solution came with a Leatherman watch complete with belt catch, which I purchased through the Paramedics Australasia website. Very easy to read face, extremely durable and has as an a feature an infra red external light. It has been incredibly robust surviving 28 months of farming, flying and ambulance use/abuse. It is still on its original battery. Just have to remember to unclip it from my belt and place it somewhere accessible in the aircraft before I get strapped in. Most of us fly with mobile phones and GPS these days which tend to make the watch a secondary instrument.

The C150/152 is another example of a docile predictable trainer with NO nasty surprises. These types make great ab-initio trainers. You must not have flown the C150 I did part of my training on David. This bird had a known history of unpredictable wing drops, even from a conventional power off stall, and despite the best efforts of the LAMEs to check out the rigging and iron them out, they persisted. I think the Instructors gained some perverse pleasure observing the look of panic on their students face on the first occurrence. As more confidence was gained in stalling we used to try and predict the wing drop, something the Cessna was unwilling to go along with. Progression to Incipient spins occurred with nothing untoward. I was then sent up solo to do some upper air work, and come back over the airfield, do some stalls in all configurations and then a couple of Incipients to finish off with. All went well up to the first Incipient. Things happened pretty quickly, and the next thing dust, loose small peices of paper and seat belt ends were going North past my nose!!. There was no sky to be seen and all I had was a windscreen full of brown Narrogin farming country, slowly rotating. Order was restored to the airframe, but not my pulse. Terra firma looked an appealing option. I don't know who was the more startled, me or the Instructor on the ground watching it all unfold, and probably dwelling on some of the possible consequences. In a sad postscript this C150 was bingled, stock mustering with fatal consequences. I have pondered whether its wayward nature was a contributing factor or not.

Good point Nev. Narrogin Flying Club purchased both a C 172M and PA28-151 new in the mid 1970s. They then acquired a second, and then third Warrior when people walked past the Skyhawk. Similar engine, close in terms of capability, but the punters picked the Piper. Now I have no desire to buy into what was the better plane as I have enjoyed flying both, but once the tapered wing went onto the Cherokee range it certainly became a more appealing option. At the risk of being pilliored, I don't mind a small element of instability in a trainer. I learned on the early models of C150/172, and whislt not as easy to fly as the later models, appreciated the training I received in them. Navs were in a C172M which was a lot better proposition for cruising than the earlier models, and night training was mainly the Warrior. Purchase of the Airtourer occurred when I was completing my Navs, and I gained my aerobatic endorsement in it, which gave me a pretty broad exposure to a number of aircraft in the early stages of my flying journey. Without doubt the Airtourer is my first choice of aircraft, but will quickly acknowlege that it is not everbodys' cup of tea. I am always interested in seeing the GA pilots introduced to the Airtourer, and how they react to the control responsiveness. The initial response is not always favourable. My late first wife learned to fly on the Airtourer, and parallelled two students learning on NFCs Warrior. The Instructors comment was :"longer to solo, quicker to complete the licence, and I know who will be the better pilot" in reference to the Airtourer. The Instructor had 3500 Instructional hours and we had a hard job getting him out of the old Victa!! Stefan, bless him, was one of the pilots Australia decided could be part of an export program in 1989, scored a job with Singapore Airlines and has not returned. Every aircraft will have an owner that loves it. Just because you love it is no guarantee that the masses will too. It must be a vexed issue for a flying school operator making a choice of aircraft that appeal as a trainer, turn out a good pilot and still have a bank manager on polite speaking turns. Sadly history is littered with too many examples where this trifecta has not been achieved.

Yenn, are you referring to the "Kookaburra", which was lost searching for the "Southern Cross" in the Coffee Royal saga?The aircraft I was referring to was located in an old hangar at the old Alice aerodrome which was adjacent to the townsite, and not at the current location. The memory is a bit dimmed, and I imagine the musuem and its contents have long since been dispersed, but it would be interesting to find the aircrafts current location. Facthunter, where art thou?

Frank, if my memory serves me correctly, I think I saw that recovered aircraft at an aviation museum in Alice Springs, circa 1984. The piloted had detailed his experience on the rudder using a pencil, and most of it was still readble. Remarkably poignant. We had just taken part in the Airtourer Association's Simpson Desert Safari when 18 Airtourers had safely flown from Birdsville to Alice Springs. We were returning to the West with a Ayer's Rock direct to Forrest, 407 Nm distant with a map, compass and watch,and not without a small degree of trepidation. Some of our Airtourer mates were really helpful with some of their advice should we ended up at any place other than Forrest. Was most relived to see the hangar at Forrest appear right on the nose after four hours of flight. It certainly was a memorable flight, but certainly highlights the need for good preparation, plenty of survival gear and an awareness just how vast that outback countryside is.

Jake, if you persist with that twitchy little Jab and master it, I will bet there will be many times in your future flying experiences, when you will reflect and view the Jab far more favourably than your first impressions. When I made a GA to RAA transition a couple of years ago I firstly flew a Jab 160, as my daughter was learning on one, and I was keen to be aware of the aircraft she had flown before she flew VH with me. I was favourable impressed with the aircraft, especially in the training role, and thought that anybody who flew a Jab 160 well was in a good position to move onto most aircraft. I then got to fly the Foxbat, and that is a pilot's indulgence. Great performance, and as for shooting a 40 Knot approach solo, just loved it. In choosing a trainer, my vote would favour the Jab. The Warrior is a very honest aircraft, exceeding easy to fly, but after my first flight in one I turned to my Instructor and said: "you are not training pilots in that are you"? Some of the best trainers are not easy to fly, and remember stability in flight impacts at the other end of the spectrum. Tiger Moths trained many great pilots, but even the venerable old Tiger has left many pilots with bruised and diminished egos. Enjoy, and learn from every experience Jake.

It ain't short Motz, but anybody who has taken the trouble to read such a well thought out espistle would surely have picked up many grains of wisdom Any apology for its lengtth is completely unessessary. The title to his thread brought a wry smile to my face. A while ago, as a testosterone charged 20 year old, I was about to embark on my aerobatic training with John Douglas, the then CFI of the Royal Aero Club of WA. John enquired why I wanted to learn aerobatics? I responded to the effect that I owned an aerobatic aircraft, I was keen to experience aerobatics, and was looking to improve my overall flying skills. "Just remember, far too many aerobatic pilots have died less than a mile from their girlfriend's house" was the salient rejoiner. Whilst my late first wife was happy to have me doing aeros over my airstrip, both my late mother and second wife were firmly of the opinion in they not only did not wish to observe the activities, they did not want to hear them either!! Most of my aeros locally have been conducted 10 miles from home, downwind.

Now Kaz, just how useful was your time in the bush in preparing you for a career in law? My Grandfather used to tell a story that used to be lore in the Kimberley. Some station owners invited one of their neighbours over for a Sunday roast. At the conclusion of the meal the host enquired of his neighbour had he enjoyed the beef? "Yes, it was a very nice bit of beef" the guest replied. "Well, it has probably been a long time since you ate some of your own meat"!!

Alan, I used that quote last year in response to a post by you when you made mention of the the support you had received from your wife when you were learning to fly. You are now returning that love and support, and continue to do so in bucketfuls.

You must have some pretty good intuition, coupled with a capacity to listen and act on the message Alan. Heart attacks can have some pretty serious implications, so it is great to hear that your wife has received timely and appropriate treatment. From comments that you have made on previous posts, you have a special lady, and remember, "you married the prototype and entire production run of that variant".

"Safety is no accident" was one of the first of many memorable quotes that my Instructor attempted to pound into me very early in my training. Whilst that sounds like a very simple statement, and has many possible interpretations, but the attitude Mr Dawson wanted us to adopt is that you had to work to attain safe operations. The training phase is vital to inculcate the rules and regs to aspiring pilots, then making the transition of applying that knowlege to develop the airmanship to safely fly an aeroplane. Any pilot who receives an exceedingly good level of instruction has very the sound foundations required to make a top quality pilot. Quality instruction must never be under estimated. Gaining experience gives us a better perspective to assess situations and make more appropriate decisions. Listening to that little bell within our cranium that rings when we venture into areas that we ought not to, and acting quickly to restore adequate safety margins is a damn good suvival mechanism. Carrying all the requisite paperwork is no guarantee that a pilot will follow the printed tomes. A weather forecast is guide and indication only, not gospel. Last week on some Angel Flights I had an Area 60 forecast, valid for 12 hours, that takes in metroplitan Perth, most of the Wheatbelt and extends North into the Murchison area. Thats about 3 times the size of Victoria!! In the first 130 Nm leg there were 3 entirely different weather scenarios encountered. The skill for the pilot is to thoroughly read the forecast, make some good observations of the weather prevailing at their current location, attempt to reconcile the two, and then set about making the best decision with safety to the forefront. Once I had achieved my then RPPL, my Instructor described it "as a licence to learn". How right he was. There is no such thing as "instant experience". Mistakes I made aplenty, thankfully with no dire consequences, and the list of things that I have only done once is long. I believe in the old adage:"learn from other peoples mistakes, you are never going to live long enough to make all of them"!! In an interesting aside in my early fifties I joined St John Ambulance and trained to Advanced Ambulance Care level as a Volunteer Ambulance Officer. My aviation experience was incredibly beneficial in the process, and in return my ambulance encounters have heightened my attitude to aviation safety. This maturing pilot still aspires to make very old pilot status.

G'day Pud. Hopefully the following will keep the thread levitating. On Thursday I got a double measure of Angel Flight. I was scheduled to conduct a AF2 flight to transport two ladies from JT back to Narembeen following chemo treatment in Perth hospitals. Sounded quite straight forward. I would be able to feed sheep and catch up on a few fencing jobs before I kicked off for JT mid afternoon. The best laid plans of mice and men....!! I awoke on Thursday morning, looked outside to see the birds walking. VFR was a dream. The phone started just after 7 am when the pilot tasked with the outgoing flight, and living on the wrong side of the Darling Scarp, called to say that he was socked in and unlikely to move soon. A few phone calls to and from Angel Flight and it boiled down to: "are you doing anything this morning?" Well, nothing that could not be deferred, and I was mindful of all the effort that had gone into getting two chemo appointments into sync on the Thursday before Easter. Scatter. Obtained a forecast. Yuk. Submitted Flight Notification, grabbed flight bag and headed up to the hangar to pull the 172 out. Dipped the tanks, and whilst there was enough fuel to get to get to JT under normal conditions, headwinds and crap weather called for more. Cracked a 200 litre drum and pumped another 90 minutes of the green fluid in. Airborne from the farm for the five minutes into Narembeen in conditions that with some imagination could be called VFR. Hearteningly I could see a few splodges where the sun was trying to peek theough the clouds in the South West quadrant, from where the weather was coming from. Obligingly the Shire had heaps of gravel, graders and rollers on the main runway doing some long awaited improvments, so it was accept the shorter runway with crosswind, taxi back to the threshold, park and walk back the apron for my two passengers. Briefed my passengers that whilst I was comfortable to commence the flight to JT, there was no guarantee of arrival there as safety was the ultimate consideration. I also stressed that if they were uncortable at any point they were not to hestitate expressing that concern. In essence: "get going" was the responce. I suppose that I was fortunate that both my passengers had flown with me on previous occassions. In short it was a comparatively straight forward flight with a bit of weather at either end, with the majority conducted in fair conditions, and by keeping low, thankfully with little turbulence we kept the headwind to sub 10 Kts. A 10-30 am arrival had been scheduled, and we pulled up outside the Royal Aero Club at 10-28. I wanted it recorded that it was one of the few times I have ever been early for anything!! The Earth Angel was waiting, and I reckon these blokes get the tougher end of the deal having to negotiate the freeway with perpetual earthworks and increasingly congested Perth traffic. A quick cup of complimentary coffee at the Runway Cafe, bless them, pick up fuel and kick off for home. This time the wind was aiding me and at 7500' on top of some broken strato Cu the GPS indicated a 145 Knot groundspeed. If I could organise a 35 Knot tailwind permanently I will give up my dream of one day owning a Mooney!! Back to shifting the mob of sheep that needed relocating, getting the "meals on wheels" full of oats and not quite feeding all the rest of the sheep before it was time follow the original plan. The run back to JT was slower that the morning trip, even after turning it into a 500 agl excercise. Walking into RACWA again John Douglas chided me that I had not been able to find Narembeen on my first attempt, and had to return to JT for more fuel before I tried again. Gee, I have some great mates!! Chemo for one of the passengers had taken longer than has anticipated and by the time they arrived at JT last light considerations at Narembeen were coming into play. The transition into aircraft and prop turning was as quick as could be, thwarted by a taxi to the furthermost point of the aerodrome for departure, and whilst at the holding point observed a "great landing, all three of them" event in a Cessna 172, much to the consternation of my passengers. Once clear of JT I normally climb out OCTA following the steps. This time I requested an airways clearance direct to 7500', something that was quickly and obligingly granted. I have found that the "Angel Flight" prefix to our registration gains exceedingly good treatment, something I, and all Angel Flight pilots really appreciate from Air Services. Once established at 7500' it was as smooth as, the GPS looked good with a 135 Knot groundspeed and the Wheatbelt below us looked spectacular with the light of the late afternoon sun. Even after flying for 39 years I never cease to be amazed by the sights afforded to us as pilots. We landed at Narembeen just after the sun had set. It was a quick offload of passengers, but not before reflecting on "that we had achieved everything that had been planned for the day, whilst not strictly adhering to the original plan". I was able to sneak back to the farm strip with a dead heat for last light. After pushing the old Cessna back into the hangar I felt a great sense of satisfaction that Angel Flight, combined with an aged Cessna had combined to support two ladies in a valiant journey with cancer. As a pilot I know that in future years that when I scan back through my log book I will see that 5 hour 40 minutes entry and have many memories come to mind, and I certainly hope that there many more experiences still to encounter and log.

If you want a simple answer, the reality is that there is no simple answer. A calculator might not be your best friend in this instance. I have stated before that anybody embarking on an encounter with aviaition should empty their wallet, view it and become comfortable with this position. Before locking yourself into a position it is probably sound to venture a distance down the track before making a decision that might be not all that easy to undo. I am a part owner of a Cessna 172 that had a new owner come on board with the intention of learning to fly in his own aeroplane. Sound intent, but he tied up a sizeable amount of money for the purchase, was out about for a $110 a hour for an instructor and still had to kick in $60 an hour for fuel. From my observations anybody buying an aircraft to learn to fly in and finding a fianacial benefit in the process would be in the minority. As for my own experience: I learnt to fly through an aero club, and purchsed a Victa Airtourer as I was concluding my training, for the then princely sum of $3500. I it was my intention of keep it for a few years and then selling it. I still own it 37 years later. Buying a quarter share of a Cessna 172 in 1981 gave me the four seat capability. Having access to both aircarft has been a good fit. A bit like having a Commodore and a MG in the same garage. As for the benefits of hire. I have not owned a Tiger Moth, but have about 20 hours logged on a DH82. I have DHC1 time logged, but have yet to own a Chippie. I have aerobatic time in a Beagle Pup 100 and am decidely happy not to own one!! I have enjoyed my encounters with Jabs and Foxbat, but am unlikely to have either aircraft displace the two currently in my hangar. I have been flying flying for 39 years and have yet to loose my love of flight. Pushing 2000 hours in the log book I am accutely aware that I probably would not be still flying today without aircraft ownership, and would certainly not have accumulated those hours without ready access to my own aircraft. I have to readily admit that some early decisions have been remarkably fortuitous to keep aircraft ownership within reasonable bounds. Living in the eastern Wheatbelt of WA the nearest aircraft for hire is 160 Kms away, which makes hire not such an easy option. An extreme example was one individual who purchased a share in our C172 and over a fifteen year period logged two hours in it. Those two hours in effect cost him around $8,000 a hour!! I recall an instance a few years ago when as as Vollie Ambulance Officer with St John Ambulance doing a RFDS transfer and two pilots having the the chance for a bit of a chat. The RFDS pilot stated that he paid for the first 200 hours of his flying career and since that point he was paid to fly. He considered I was a candidate for the funny farm for having paid for my then 1800 hours myself!!

G'day Pud, The RFDS Western Ops website gives the following as suppliers of windsocks available in WA: Taskers 58 Sparks Rd HENDERSON 6166 Ph: 94379222 www.taskers.com.au A & B Canvas 12/14 Hodgson Way KEWDALE 6105 Ph: 0427 600090 www.canvasaustralia.com.au On the airfield specs there is a design for a windsock pole and sleeve, which I am certain would survive a Cat 5 cyclone, but I don't think this old cocky would make one quite like that. Looking forward to the chance of making an aerial inspection once you have your windsock established Pud.

This reply does not relate to the Savannah directly, but some parallels with the Airtourer may be applicable. Victa initally introduced the Airtourer in 1961 with a 100 hp engine, with a Max All Up weight of 1650 lbs (750 Kg). In winter at sea level it was a fair performer. In Australia we don't always fly in the winter, and not always at sea level, and performance at a Density Height of 4000' does not show up too well on a VSI. It was not too long before the 115 hp variant was put into production, and a choice was available for either 100 or 115 hp. Same airframe, same MTOW, just different engines and props. The benefit was in the climb as the extra 15 hp went into the climb. Usefull load and range went in the 100s favour. In cruise the 115 was faster of course, but probably not as much as was anticipated. Most of my experience has been in then 100 and I have not experienced any 115s getting any better than a five knot advantage, and using an extra 2-3 litres a hour to achieve it. Alan Wood and I did a formation flight for nearly two hours together in 1987 when Woody had VH-MUL still flying, and he was surprised at how little he had to back off the throttle. The 100 hp variant of the Airtourer has always been acknowledged as the nicest model to aerobat, that is if you are prepared to accept the altimeter unwinding at a fair rate!! Once again how much power you are comfortable with is a matter of owner, or pilot choice. Some are comfortable not having their socks blown off, others want a world beater. Having some Scottish blood, I am far happier funding the 21 litres for an hours flight in a 100 hp Airtourer than 32 litres for a 150 hp model at todays Avgas prices!! Ditto, I imagine between a Jab 170 or 230. Are there any 80 hp Foxbats in Oz?

Whilst I recognise the merit of a windsock on public aerodromes, I am yet to replace the then $80 purchase that blew out after only two years on my farm airstrip ten years ago. Two windmills within 500 metres of the strip, water now in dams, tree movement and dust coming away from grazing sheep will tell me most of what I want to know. A windsock will only tell you of the wind conditions at that windsock. It does not always tell you what the wind is at the the threshold at the other end of the airstrip. One of the co-owners of our C172 has just learnt to fly at Jandakot. When he started flying in the bush he struggled to make the adjustment to assessing wind conditions himself, rather than being told by either the ATIS or tower what the wind direction and strength was. When I started flying in the early 70's there was a mixture of the older canvas and newer poly windsocks in service and that certainly created uncertainty and confusion. I learnt quickly that when the heavier canvas windsock was close to horizontal a hangar was the best place for an aircraft, yet always gained a sense of satisfaction from a crosswind landing with a poly windsock far from vertical!