DrZoos Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 1000 engines per year?..................Whomsoever believed that really , really had his head up his ****.....................100 per year, that sounds credible...... Total sales was 90 engines per month at its peak in 2007 and 2008 most that equipment would have been depreciated by now. About Jabiru - Jabiru Aircraft & Engines Australia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 Cant get to 7000 flying in without that kind of production numbers somewhere CAE borrowed and geared up for this capacity, I think AUD rates killed overseas orders, but also this was when Hydraulic lifters introduced, chinese sourcing of parts and problems began. Look at dates on SB. Jabiru take no responsibility for this and lump all the blame on GFC. Reputation was allowed to be trashed by inaction and self denial which continues. No doubt Camit was too big to handle low volumes seen since then and ham fisted CASA action was simply nail in coffin. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaba-who Posted October 14, 2016 Author Share Posted October 14, 2016 Cant get to 7000 flying in without that kind of production numbers somewhereCAE borrowed and geared up for this capacity, I think AUD rates killed overseas orders, but also this was when Hydraulic lifters introduced, chinese sourcing of parts and problems began. Look at dates on SB. Jabiru take no responsibility for this and lump all the blame on GFC. Reputation was allowed to be trashed by inaction and self denial which continues. No doubt Camit was too big to handle low volumes seen since then and ham fisted CASA action was simply nail in coffin. There's always two sides to any story. The consistent story that I have heard from close circles of Rods since about the gfc time is that Rod advised Ian on multiple occasions in the 2000's NOT to go into debt and NOT to expand their manufacturing capability. The high orders and the lag time of several months for orders was a catalyst for Ian to want to increase but Rod's opinion was that there was always a downturn potentially around the corner. The lag time for orders was an irrevocable consequence of maintaining a buffer against downturn. Then the gfc hit and that was way before the engine problems and CASA debacle. As far as I am aware those huge outputs of 90 + a month stopped at or about the 2009 mark and never peaked again. At the same time sales of airframes ( which Ian has no involvement in ) also dived. So it was not just jabiru making Camits a sacrificial lamb. I'm not saying for an instant that Ian should have listened to Stiffy etc etc. Ian's decision was to upgrade. A decision for him to assess and go with. Had it all worked we'd be saying how great the business was. That's Ian's decision. But whatever other decisions were/are made by Jabiru to avoid going down with the "Camit ship" they have to be looked at in that light. if as a result of a decision it goes pear shaped - then for the rest of us to weave a tale of deceit and foul play is probably less than fair. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj_richo Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Rod Stiff has posted a more detailed response to Camit's closure on the Jabiru Facebook page Jabiru Aircraft Bundaberg | Facebook 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 I don't think it's productive to take sides too much. Obviously in this game, survival is not assured and people play it as they see it from their vantage point. I can easily see how basic aims and how they are achieved can go down different paths. Always easy to be wise in hindsight but it's a bit pointless as perfection is only a conceptual aim, like zero accidents. What happens from here is the main concern. People out there with Jabiru products will have even more concerns than before this situation arose. Maybe things are as bad as they will get so don't panic. When you buy a plane car or boat you should just write off the money in your mind and restart from there. If your plane is still flyable, (legally) use it. You didn't buy it as an investment (I hope). I have just now read the link above. It played no part in my post above. , so take that into account. Keep smiling everyone.. Everything (normally) could be worse..Nev 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 Dear all, can anybody in Australia, or local to Bundaberg, or "in the know" provide an update on Camit? Are there any plans for a Camit resurrection? Or their modified engines? Or any plans (or truth in the rumours) that Ian Bent may be working on supplying modified parts for Jab engines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 The company is being liquidated. That's it. There are no plans or possibility to resurrect the business At this stage no one is making parts for either Jabiru or Camit engines. (Aside from Jabiru 2210 parts) Jabiru may do so but will take time, equipment and plenty of money? Id suggest Ian is not likely or able to be doing much until the company liquidation is completed which could take years. Plenty of rumours and little truth. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted December 3, 2016 Share Posted December 3, 2016 The company is being liquidated. That's it.There are no plans or possibility to resurrect the business At this stage no one is making parts for either Jabiru or Camit engines. (Aside from Jabiru 2210 parts) Jabiru may do so but will take time, equipment and plenty of money? Id suggest Ian is not likely or able to be doing much until the company liquidation is completed which could take years. Plenty of rumours and little truth. Thanks for the update, however not what I wanted to hear. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaba-who Posted December 3, 2016 Author Share Posted December 3, 2016 The company is being liquidated. That's it.There are no plans or possibility to resurrect the business At this stage no one is making parts for either Jabiru or Camit engines. (Aside from Jabiru 2210 parts) Jabiru may do so but will take time, equipment and plenty of money? Id suggest Ian is not likely or able to be doing much until the company liquidation is completed which could take years. Plenty of rumours and little truth. Rod Stiff told me himself they are in the process of setting up building the new engines with external sources engines for most parts. Some of these sources are already building the parts. It sounded like they would be available sooner rather than later. Despite the pervading perception on this forum that Ian could do no wrong, and Stiffy could do no right, The reality is Ian's business model was such that it led Rod to perceive several years ago he would go under. Rod has been preparing for the outcome that eventually happened and seems to have at least a plan which is now actually underway to get through it and have jabiru engines continuing to be made. I'm not saying anything (and don't want to get into a slanging match) about who is right or wrong, who is a great bloke or a hard nosed businessman. Whether or not if Rod had done things differently things would have been different for Ian or if they would have both gone under. Just the facts about pending availability as they pertain to someone wanting to buy an engine. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 Yes of course they are gearing up to make parts and the continuing existance of the Jabiru brand is depending on it seeing as they won't allow Rotax as an option and the new engine isn't released yet. What else do you expect Rod to say? They seem to STILL take no responsibility for damage to the engine reputation and the now downfall of suppliers. Id expect engine production to head overseas and that won't happen quickly let alone difficulties achieving aviation quality and consistent products. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlegg Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 There was an auction last week of Camit's parts and equipment. Offers Invited - Camit/Jabiru Aircraft Engine Components Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff13 Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 Does anyone actually know when the new engine will be released? Both 4 and 6 cylinder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted December 4, 2016 Share Posted December 4, 2016 New 2210 was quoted as "end of the year" Just my thinking but without new cases and key parts like cranks, rods, and bottom end available, more likely rebuilds with new heads and cylinders will surface first. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fritterburner Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Saw the CAMit parts listed online, but didn't realise it wasn't going to auction on Grays - just an 'offers invited'. Haven't seen that done before on Grays like that - was waiting for catalogue of parts to be released for bidding. The entire workshop is being listed shortly - plant, equipment and vehicles are all up for grabs. Bidding looks like it will be open between 6pm 7 Dec and ~7.30pm 13 Dec. CNC Metal Manufacturing Facility Doesn't appear to be any plans to resurrect the show, based off that, unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 The Jab parts already have been listed and posted for expressions of offers. It is now closed. Now its just the machinery in the workshop going to auction starting wednesday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 The offers closed last friday for the parts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Someone has offered enough and been sold the bulk of the parts offered. It wasnt an auction but an EOI, if you bid enough to exceed valuers estimation , you get it There is a small chance some of the un sold lots could end up in normal auction There really wasnt much there to start with and near no Jabiru parts other than a crank and couple of heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 There really wasn't much there to start with Previously dropped off at a "friends" house maybe? Many would in the same position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Too honest I'd suggest, receivers are very good at finding out that stuff and it can go very badly afterwards 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 no engines only parts Listing Download.pdf Listing Download.pdf Listing Download.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eightyknots Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Saw the CAMit parts listed online, but didn't realise it wasn't going to auction on Grays - just an 'offers invited'. Haven't seen that done before on Grays like that - was waiting for catalogue of parts to be released for bidding.The entire workshop is being listed shortly - plant, equipment and vehicles are all up for grabs. Bidding looks like it will be open between 6pm 7 Dec and ~7.30pm 13 Dec. CNC Metal Manufacturing Facility Doesn't appear to be any plans to resurrect the show, based off that, unfortunately. Perhaps Rod will be a bidder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Maybe but it was CAE parts not Jabiru ones. They were quite different Doubt he would sell them anyway. I didn't see much there they would be interested in. Might be saving money to buy a machine or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 The Mazak looks to be pretty old JetJr and the horizontal machine centres I wouldnt have a lot of use for. I prefer to work vertically than horizontal. Horizontal is of course better to work on engine stuff Depends on what they go for as the cost to fix these machines if they are a bit worn is extremely expensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Oh and Grays rape you...the price will be plus their 10% and then add a further 10% GST to that total so whatever you get the machine for you need to add at least 21 or 22% on top of the auction winning price. Can make a old machine very expensive 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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