onetrack Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 This American Champion Scout 8GCBC is a 2021 model with only 2.1 hrs test flight time - but it's been damaged by a falling hangar door. The wings were not attached at the time of the damage incident. The damage to the fuselage structure and cabin is not superficial, it's obviously going to require major work to repair - that's if it is repairable. The aircraft is fitted with a 180HP Lycoming O-320 C1G and Hartzell variable pitch prop. It is registered as VH-EWP. It's currently located at Pickles Auctions yard in Bibra Lake, W.A., and no viewing of the item is available, you purchase on what you can see in the photos. Auction commences 11th July 2022 at 10:00AM AWST, and ends Sunday 17th July 2022 at 5:00PM AWST. I'm fairly sure this aircraft has been one of W.A.'s Dept of Biodiversity, Conservation and Attractions (DBCA) aircraft (who thinks these names up? - this must be about the 5th change of name for the Dept!). DBCA are amongst the largest users of American Champion Scout 8GCBC aircraft, they're used for fire spotting and water bombing operations supervision. They operate 10 of them, and turn them over at 4000 hrs TT, and go and buy new Champion Scout replacements. DBCA and its predecessor, DPAW (Dept Parks And Wildlife) have gone through nearly 30 of these aircraft, and they obviously think they're the ducks gonads, thanks to their performance and STOL abilities. https://www.pickles.com.au/trucks/item/-/details/AMERICAN-CHAMPION-AIRCRAFT---MODEL--Scout-8GCBC/3040239496 https://www.americanchampionaircraft.com/post/new-8gcbc-for-dpaw 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Student Pilot Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 At a guess 50K+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flightrite Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 Worth we’ll over a $100K. Engine/prop/avionics covers that alone, never lone a pair of new wings! Be interesting to se what it goes for? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thruster88 Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 Should make around 200k aussie. https://www.americanchampionaircraft.com/scout 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 Pickles will have set a reserve price on the aircraft, in consultation with the seller. Pickles aren't known for giving things away, their reserves prices are usually initially aimed high. But what happens with auctions, is that if the item is auctioned and doesn't meet the reserve, it is put up again - and then if the bids still fall far short of what the seller and Pickles have set, they reset the reserve price to a lower figure. The item will then generally sell, once all the potential buyers are drawn out of the woodwork, and all the genuine bids are placed. Unlike a liquidation auction, where the liquidator is trying to get rid of assets quickly to satisfy a bunch of creditors, auctions such as the one above, rarely produce any real bargains. Even if the seller is an insurer (I'm not sure whether DBCA would insure their aircraft, or carry their own insurance - but I would guess that the cost of insurance would make self-insuring a real possibility for the DBCA), insurers rarely sell insurance claim items at a low price, if they have a reasonable chance of repair. As I see it, the new owner would have to factor in a replacement fuselage frame, and all the labour involved in swapping all the parts and components from the damaged fuselage frame over to the new frame. On that basis, I would estimate Flightrite is near the mark, and someone will finally acquire it for around $100K - $120K, because the seller will have done his homework, and costed all the outlay required to get her in the air again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpacro Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 A bit of surgery needed in a jig. This one needed more extensive work but easier, not being damaged near the wing spar attach fittings. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thruster88 Posted July 12, 2022 Share Posted July 12, 2022 Bidding has opened @ 62k with a long way to go. I think my estimate is a little low. Place your guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted July 13, 2022 Author Share Posted July 13, 2022 (edited) Bidding is at $62,500 with just under 4 days to close of auction. The original link to Pickles that I posted above, no longer works, Pickles moved the auction link to a different page. 3 genuine bidders at this point, 2 from W.A., 1 from S.A. I still think they'll let it go at $120K, fixing bent aeroplanes get spendy, real fast. https://www.pickles.com.au/general/item/-/details/AMERICAN-CHAMPION-AIRCRAFT---MODEL--Scout-8GCBC/1040392863 Edited July 13, 2022 by onetrack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 The good thing about this one is it's new but may have been subject to some weather exposure. Labour will be a big component of it's rehabilitation. OK if you have the space and can divert time to it when things allow. A steel truss frame is always repairable. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flightrite Posted July 14, 2022 Share Posted July 14, 2022 It’s a hassle being in that other communist country to the west of Australia! 😉If it were close I’d take a look. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossK Posted July 15, 2022 Share Posted July 15, 2022 At the current price, the engine, prop and avionics would make it a good donor for someone building a RV. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flightrite Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 Wonder what this machine sold for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thruster88 Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Flightrite said: Wonder what this machine sold for? Currently at 90k with 90 mins to go. Doubt the serious bidding has started yet. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted July 17, 2022 Author Share Posted July 17, 2022 Wait until the last 10 mins, then you'll see the serious bidding from the genuine, keen buyers, start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flightrite Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 Thought It was finished, the links shows page not avail? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thruster88 Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Flightrite said: Thought It was finished, the links shows page not avail? https://www.pickles.com.au/general/item/-/details/AMERICAN-CHAMPION-AIRCRAFT---MODEL--Scout-8GCBC Not sure the link will work. 157k has gone into extra time, will keep going until no bid for 10 mins? Edited July 17, 2022 by Thruster88 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted July 17, 2022 Author Share Posted July 17, 2022 (edited) The first Pickles auction link no longer works, because Pickles moved it. Thruster88's link works, the bidding is currently at $169K, and still going fast and furious at 1:16 WST, with 7 mins currently left until finalisation. Each bid moves the auction end time back by 10 mins, to allow bidders time to place their bid, in case they're having connectivity problems or for any other reasons. Edited July 17, 2022 by onetrack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flightrite Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 Found the link…$192+K….wow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thruster88 Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 (edited) Ended at 170k plus the buyers premium of 13.5% makes $192950. Right again😎 If you compare it to say a Van's 15 kit plus all the items required to complete it is good value and a lot less work. Edited July 17, 2022 by Thruster88 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted July 17, 2022 Author Share Posted July 17, 2022 Even though the sale ended at $170K top bid, Pickles auction webpage now says, "This item is no longer available for sale." In Pickles-speak, this means that the aircraft was passed in - and the seller, or Pickles has decided that they can get a higher price for it. If the aircraft had been sold, the webpage would read, "this item has been sold". You'd normally look for another auction for the aircraft, in about 3-4 weeks time. A lot of the time, this auction is just a trial run to see what they could get by way of bids. However, in the meantime, Pickles will call the top bidder, and advise them they want $XXX,XXX for it. The bidder may make a lower counter-offer than the requested figure, and the seller and Pickles may accept the counter-offer that is higher than the $170K, but below what the seller is seeking. In which case, the sale will proceed, Pickles will still get their 13.5% cut, and the aircraft will not turn up again in any auction. I think perhaps there'll be a deal done on this basis, as the number of possible buyers across Australia would be low. But ... if the top bidder simply tells them their pricing is too high, look for another auction with the aircraft in it, in about 3-4 weeks time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyBoy1960 Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 Its a corrupt system they use if it is as you say above, dont like the 10 minute extensions, thats fraud, it should finish at the finishing time period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted July 17, 2022 Share Posted July 17, 2022 I don't think comparing this type of plane with other different options has a lot of value other than a general comment. These are "Niche" planes with their own following.. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted July 17, 2022 Author Share Posted July 17, 2022 Many online auctions today usually have a bid extension time built in, to prevent people using automated bidding programmes, called "bid sniping" which enables them to drop a bid in, 1 or 2 seconds prior to a fixed-time auction closing. This sniping is theoretically designed to stop "bidding wars" - but if allowed and used, it often means that the item sells for way below market value. Bid sniping was banned from some auction sites to ensure all bidders got a chance to bid the item up to their desired bid level. But the banning of automated auction sniping was declared illegal in some jurisdictions. I've used bid-sniping programmes on the likes of eBay for fixed-ending-time auctions, it's useful when an auction ends at some ungodly hour on the other side of the world. However, the main auction houses in Australia that specialise in machinery, equipment, vehicles, boats and aircraft, are fully intent on drawing as many bids out of the woodwork as possible, and ensuring the sale price is high. There are many reasons for this - the auction house has a need to maximise their cut of the sale, they don't like seeing the market value of items declining, when they may have other items similar for sale, because that reduces the buyers bidding levels overall. Most auction houses are dealers, they are intent on being price-setters if they possibly can. The corrupt part of their practices is deleting bidding information immediately after an auction ends, thus keeping other potential buyers from seeing what the previous bidding amounts went up to, when the auction house is intent on starting another auction for the same item. At least Pickles does give some information about bidders identification and location, unlike some auction houses where the bidders identification and location is hidden. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted August 12, 2022 Author Share Posted August 12, 2022 (edited) Well, it appears that Pickles did a deal with the high bidder, and the aircraft has been sold. There's no way of knowing what the final sale value was, but it would have been between the high bid of $170K, and the reserve price set by Pickles and the W.A. Dept of Biodiversity, Conservation and Attractions. Sometimes the high bidder is convinced to pay the reserve price, but most times the high bidder digs in, and won't raise their offer by much. The 13.5% buyers premium would have been a "nice lil' earner" for Pickles, I have never seen such a high level of commission for an item that sold for that kind of money. Usually, the B.P. is around 5% once you start getting up around $50K. A lot of auction houses only charge 5% commission for items once they get over $20K. I can't really see what Pickles did, to earn their money here. https://www.pickles.com.au/general/item/-/details/AMERICAN-CHAMPION-AIRCRAFT---MODEL--Scout-8GCBC/1040392863 Edited August 12, 2022 by onetrack 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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