Markproa Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 My question didn't get answered in another thread so I'll start a new one. It was stated that RA is a lot cheaper to fly than GA and I'm interested in the details. Excluding the cost of getting a license and the costs of maintenance (I'm building my own plane so can do my own maintenance) what are the advantages of me registering my plane RA rather than GA? Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 Some clever people regard Exp GA as the most suitable "area " to operate in if you want design freedoms . There's No ONE answer or everybody would be there. People have different want's and expectations. YOU have to study what each offers and make your decision for YOUR aviation needs. Go to aerodromes where the various organisations work and talk to people.Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markproa Posted January 14, 2018 Author Share Posted January 14, 2018 Thanks Nev. I was hoping people on this forum would help to enlighten me with some discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I wouldn't take it personally . They might not like to open up old wounds. Give them a bit more time. Price isn't everything . It depends on where you wish to end up and also where you at coming from. While credit is given for certain experience, Changing ships invariably means some will want to re assess your abilities when you arrive on their doorstep. There's a big variation on cost/hr and not all hours are equal. Briefings and debriefings must be done properly. Taxy time isn't productive, etc Where you live is important. re choice of school. How much you can do each week is too. I would favour a school that does both but not rule out one which doesn't.. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markproa Posted January 15, 2018 Author Share Posted January 15, 2018 I'm afraid my choices are very limited where I live. Coffs is my local airport which is controlled with no GA training but there is a RA school. The RA guy just gets into an anti CASA rave and wants to sell me training so I'm asking here to try to get some balanced opinions. I won't be able to fly out of Coffs anyway as I'm using a converted diesel car engine. Basically my question is : Is it cheaper to fly RA than GA in the same aircraft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 There are too many unknowns in your question. What same aircraft do you have in mind? There aren't a lot that fit that description and RAAus is weight limited as well as 2 POB max and RAAus CERTIFICATE.. GA is certified unmodified unless EXP . and RPL/ PPL (or above) LICENCE .Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Two objectives usually dictate what is best for an individual, cost & mission requirements. Too many variables outside of those two to give a single firm answer. Personally I like to have options, be able to fly in most weather conditions, to be able to change missions when required, that comes at a cost. Like all things in aviation it's a trade off. Fir all intensive purposes RA is cheaper but that also comes at a cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poteroo Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Excluding the cost of getting a license and the costs of maintenance So, if we assume you hold both an RPL and an RPC - then your 'cost' of operating the same aircraft at a private strip in Class G airspace will be cheaper in GA. Many costs will be the same - insurance, hangarage, landing charges, ASIC. Your BFR/AFR will cost more in GA than RAAus, probably by $200/2 years. But your aircraft doesn't require a registration fee in GA - it does in RAAus. I estimate a net annual saving for an EXPERIMENTAL amateur built GA aircraft which is maintained entirely by the owner, and is not flown in CTA. There will be a range of opinion on this, and I think if you search the site you'll find a previous thread on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markproa Posted January 15, 2018 Author Share Posted January 15, 2018 Ok, I'll make this more personal. I'm building an aeroplane that can fit in either 19-**** or VH reg. It is under 600kg MTOW. It's a French design called a Gas'aile 2 with a converted 1600cc diesel engine. I have an uncurrent UPPL so will either go through a GA flight review or do the whole RAA certificate. What I'm interested to know is once my plane is built are there any advantages to flying under GA or RA? As I understand it my engine will preclude me from flying into controlled airspace or over built up areas so there may not be much advantage to a VH reg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markproa Posted January 15, 2018 Author Share Posted January 15, 2018 Thanks Poteroo, that's the sort of answer I was looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Just looked up the design, interesting to see the auto engine conversion, keep us posted on that score Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poteroo Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Ok, I'll make this more personal. I'm building an aeroplane that can fit in either 19-**** or VH reg. It is under 600kg MTOW. It's a French design called a Gas'aile 2 with a converted 1600cc diesel engine. I have an uncurrent UPPL so will either go through a GA flight review or do the whole RAA certificate. Wait up! You've told us to exclude the cost of gaining a licence, and now you've revealed that you will need a Conversion to RAAus plus a full AFR to regain your PPL. You'll be spending a fair amount to achieve either, or both, (to convert you need your PPL to be current) - but lets overlook that as you've asked us to. In aircraft specifics - there is an advantage in not spending money on RAAus registration every year. Most other costs are the same, as I noted above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 You won't have to do the whole RAA certificate. I imagine you will have to do an air legislation exam regardless.. Your certified log book and how you fly will determine how many hours you have to do. If you are up to speed I wouldn't expect many hours to be required.. Verify all this.. My opinion only. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yenn Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Markproa I would say that GAExperimental would be cheaper. No rego, or RAAus fees. Medical RAMPC for GA costs whatever your GP charges. I got one last week for no cost, being a pensioner. The unknown is cost of BFR, which varies with instructors. For me I paid about 400 dollars for a GA review last year. That covers me for RAAus, but flying a single seat RAAus plane, I have had several free BFRs, but have also hired a Jab and paid about 200. So there is not much in it, but I would go the GA route if I was you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 With a converted diesel engine; GA Experimental Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markproa Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 With a converted diesel engine; GA Experimental Please elaborate. Does RAA not like converted diesels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Please elaborate. Does RAA not like converted diesels? Experimental has more guys to give you hands on experience with the aircraft and the engine. Hourly cost will not be the major factor, design probably will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Insurance will be more in GA ($700 p,a extra for me personally) due to having to have extra public liability coverage. Medicals, I’ve never gotten out of cheaper than $400-600 every 2 x years. Usually have to join SAAA to get the plane registered with any form of help. To do maintenance in GA you’ll need to do the MPC course for about $550. You’ll prob need an English launguage assessment too for GA. Inspections for first licensing in GA were more than RAA but I was lucky there for my first build. If I didn’t want to do aerobatics I wouldn’t even consider GA,,,, it’s just way too hard. Building in RAA was significantly easier for me. If you do build in RAA though be sure to make sure everything is correct. SAAA will help you with all your documents, flight manuals, maintenance plans and lots of other things, I could go on. Your very much on your own in RAA I’ve found in my area is all I can’t comment on. You need to talk to someone in person that has done both. If you have a supportive RAA school go with him,,,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunder Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Just got my RAA rego bill......$165..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Is that expensive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunder Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Is that expensive? Since I'm the one to pay, it feels like it!Not that long ago I seem to remember $135........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff13 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 The costs for registration of my plane from its first provisional rego in 2010 are listed below. The 2 $65.00 fees where part year costs due to change of ownership. So a 3.85% increase in 2015 A 3.7% increase in 2016 And 17.9% in 2017 Type Start Date End Date Cost Paid Date Full Registration 15th Aug 2017 15th Aug 2018 165.00 3rd Aug 2017 Full Registration 15th Aug 2016 15th Aug 2017 140.00 11th Aug 2016 Full Registration 15th Aug 2015 15th Aug 2016 135.00 7th Aug 2015 Full Registration 19th Jan 2015 15th Aug 2015 65.00 19th Jan 2015 Full Registration 11th Aug 2014 19th Jan 2015 130.00 15th Aug 2014 Full Registration 6th Sep 2013 11th Aug 2014 65.00 6th Sep 2013 Full Registration 11th Aug 2013 6th Sep 2013 130.00 6th Sep 2013 Full Registration 11th Aug 2012 11th Aug 2013 130.00 1st Aug 2012 Provisional Registration 11th Aug 2011 11th Aug 2012 130.00 4th Aug 2011 Provisional Registration 11th Aug 2010 11th Aug 2011 220.00 11th Aug 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Av 5% per year increase, will be less once previous years included. Not condoning the price rise, but if $30 per year is significant to you maybe better to take up something else Of course you have membership on top of this so keeping Reg and membership paid up is significantly more than GA, medicals aside. Can you maintain an engine you havent substantially built in GA experimental? Even with MPC? Finding a LAME for the diesel might be a problem if not. Maintenance in RAA for 19 reg is pretty unlimited unless you want to do major modifications and even then theres a process. Its a massive benefit of RAA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff13 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 I find RAAus costs to be reasonable. Membership and Rego still cost me less than the registration on my motorcycle so in that light I think its fair. But in terms of increases and percentage increase we need to remember the increase by stealth we had in 2016 when they drop our magazine then asked us to pay extra for it. That proved to be a no brainer for me, I just don't read the magazine any more so no increase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 ...I'm using a converted diesel car engine... Once you sort out which regime to register your machine under, I'd like to hear more about your Diesel engine and the aircraft design. There are a few Jodels fitted with Peugeot diesels, including at least one on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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