Yelling "....clear prop...."

[Tomo]

Thought I'd post this here, as it's a pretty simple thing....

 

Do you yell out clear prop before starting...?

 

My simple answer is, yes.

 

:big_grin:

 

 

[Guest Decca]

Deadly Weapons

 

Good idea to reinforce the discipline and duty of care required here Tomo, anywhere on the forums.

 

Propellers are deadly weapons. They have killed and maimed before. Who's the Aussie golfer lost an arm & other bits when he walked into one? Bet he swore off alcohol after that.

 

That incident also points out the care that people outside the aircraft have to take.

 

Much better to be sure, than have to help clean up the mess afterwards.

 

Regards, Decca.

 

 

[turboplanner]

This came from the old head over the side days of tigers etc before fully enclosed cabins.

 

I figure people can't hear you anyway, even when you open a door slightly, so I say All Clear as a check, but do a careful left to right scan

 

 

[Bidgee]

Absolutely. For me its also a reminder to have another good look around and double check the brakes are on before hitting the starter.

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

Yes, always

 

 

[dazza 38]

I always say "Clear prop". But im thinking of changing it to the military way. That is "Stand Clear, Starting". Reason being, it makes more sense to non pilots than "clear prop." What to you guys think?

 

 

[numptie]

I always say "Clear prop". But im thinking of changing it to the military way. That is "Stand Clear, Starting". Reason being, it makes more sense to non pilots than "clear prop." What to you guys think?

I always have a good look around and call clear prop. I'm starting to think "stand clear, starting" might be a better thing to call out.

 

 

[Admin]

No, you have to yell:

 

CLEAR PROP

 

 

 

The pilot discount shop

 

 

 

 

 

sorry just joking...couldn't help myself :big_grin:

 

 

[turboplanner]

Well two sense are four times better than one.

 

No problems with yours Dazza

 

Audible is great for Drifters etc.

 

In an enclosed insulated cabin, verbal warning at maybe 100 dBA will wash to about 40 at a country strip where the ambient may be 35 so still may be intelligible to someone walking towards the prop or crouching down under it.

 

There's still the issue of whether they could interpret it, or whether they are a four year old kid and it doesn't mean anything.

 

At somewhere like Bankstown with an ambient closer to 95 dBA it's less likely that anyone will hear or understand.

 

So hence my system

 

On thinking more about it, from my trucking experience where someone can drive up and park behind you inside your mirrors while you're filling out your log book, and you never reverse without getting out and checking that black spot, I have a good look at the action as I walk out on the apron, and the eyes are scanning all the time for someone entering the area -I usually know where everyone is. So my left to right scan is backed up by the previous scans. On one occasion where I was delayed, I got out, looked around and started again.

 

As Decca mentioned in this case the PIC has the Duty of Care, so I would never knock someone's own version of solving the problem.

 

In some ways it's a bit surprising a standard electrical device - push button horn/siren hasn't been adopted for closed cabs, like the 3 siren blast of large boats, ships

 

 

[turboplanner]

What was that Ian, I'm a bit deaf!

 

Ah now I get it - we can't change the wording

 

 

[dazza 38]

No, you have to yell:

CLEAR PROP

 

 

 

The pilot discount shop

 

 

 

 

 

 

sorry just joking...couldn't help myself :big_grin:

That would be good advertising ian:laugh:

 

 

[turboplanner]

And to think he's indoctrinated a whole industry for generations to yell out his advertising message for free!

 

 

[facthunter]

Very Clever then...

 

Seriously, it is a reminder to the pilot to CHECK for proximity of people etc. IF he/she just calls it because "you are supposed to" then it does not serve its purpose. When hand propping was the norm it was not as necessary as it is now where you are enclosed and more people mill around amongst aircraft.

 

I would suggest that you open a window or door and project you voice outside, (not to the passenger) and say loudly something like STARTING ENGINE, CLEAR PROP and then wait a few seconds for the message to sink in to anyone outside. ( No point doing it as you hit the starter button). Nev

 

 

[GraemeK]

Always! Open the door and yell "Clear Prop".

 

When I'm on the field, I have no trouble hearing others call clear prop - that, together with watching for rotating beacons is a "belt and braces" thing, along with being aware of what other planes are doing around you.

 

 

[Deskpilot]

Interesting question Tomo. Of course, we all call it out 'cause we've been trained to, haven't we. Well I guess there might be a few exceptions, 'specially like those folk with their own strip and/or live in the outback.

 

Thing is, is 'calling it out' sufficient. As previously mentioned, it would be barely audible, 'specially if there're other aircraft running nearby. Apart from getting out again and having another look. I suggest:

 

Wait 'till other a/c leave....if possible.

 

Open door and yell. Pull door to closed (if not locked) position. (Jabiru doors can be buggers to lock at times)

 

Wait (always wait) a couple more seconds just in case there was/is someone under the prop.

 

Start engine.

 

Lock door.

 

Now another question. Is it really neccessary to call at all if your engine it top mounted like Drifter, Thrusters and water planes when on water?

 

 

[Thx1137]

Wait (always wait) a couple more seconds just in case there was/is someone under the prop.

Now there is the thing. Most times I hear a "clear prop!" call the engine is started immediately after. I always thought that that made it useless as a verbal warning.

 

I always yell it but I place no confidence on its effectiveness. I place more confidence in my scan of the area first. I wont catch someone who has snuck under and in front of the aircraft but without a camera there isn't much I can do and besides, people on the tarmac also have a duty of care!

 

I suspect it is possible less of a problem for RA aircraft because being smaller the person would have to be a small child to be missed in the visual scan. I don't think "clear prop!" would help them.

 

So, I try to stay aware of who is near or heading towards my aircraft but do yell "clear prop!" anyway.

 

Steven.

 

 

[pudestcon]

Now another question. Is it really neccessary to call at all if your engine it top mounted like Drifter, Thrusters and water planes when on water?

Yes it is necessary, certainly on the Thruster as you can easily walk into the propeller.

 

On Tomo's question, I always have a good look outside right to left as far as my old neck will turn and then yell loudly and clearly "Clear the propeller" before waiting a couple of seconds then hitting the starter. The reason I yell "Clear the propeller" is because I have heard many times a garbled, muffled call "Clear prop" which to non-aviation types might not mean anything. To me personally it also signifies the start of the flight and I need to be concentrating and in complete control - I reckon I get a surge of adrenalin at this point:laugh:

 

Pud

 

 

[Guest rocketdriver]

Always ...

 

 

[hihosland]

Originally Posted by Deskpilot

 

Wait (always wait) a couple more seconds just in case there was/is someone under the prop.

 

-------------

 

I always turn the master switch off

 

then call "clear prop"

 

master on

 

starter.

 

This sequence ensures a pause between the call and the start and protects the ears of the passenger from being blasted through the headset.

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

This sequence ensures a pause between the call and the start and protects the ears of the passenger from being blasted through the headset.

Wouldn't it be better to leave your headset off until the engine's been started so if someone calls back "don't start yet!!" or something you can hear them?

 

 

[hihosland]

Doug did ask

 

"Now another question. Is it really neccessary to call at all if your engine it top mounted like Drifter, Thrusters and water planes when on water? "

 

__________________

 

I'd say that yes it is necessary just as it is necessary to treat all props as potentially live.

 

That way the habit is firmly engraved and you won't forget some day when the prop is down at people level or is attached to a inpulse magneto that could fire from just a quarter turn.

 

Davidh

 

 

[hihosland]

Wouldn't it be better to leave your headset off until the engine's been started so if someone calls back "don't start yet!!" or something you can hear them?

Fair comment.

 

My habit has been to get the passenger set up with headset adjusted and mike in right place before the noise starts.

 

Davidh

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

My habit has been to get the passenger set up with headset adjusted and mike in right place before the noise starts.

I agree with that idea, seems much easier to explain to them how it should fit etc without the engine noise.

 

I think if it were me I'd get them set up but leave mine off until after starting so I can hear any potential responses from people outside :)

 

 

[dunlopdangler]

I always look out and about and yell out "clear prop"... With aircraft without a left door or canopy, I yell out through the storm window, and yes people in close proximity do hear something and look around, then I start the engine with my headset off my ears...reason for this is to check any "funny" sounds coming out of the engine on start up which can't be heard with the headset over the ears:headset:

 

 

[GraemeK]

I also leave the headset off until after start, for the same reasons as DD (plus, as Darky says, more chance of hearing other things).

 

No point wearing it anyway, since the avionics are off during start anyway (and a few seconds of noise shouldn't do too much damage to the old eardrums).