Powerin Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 And as I keep repeating, if you go back over the last four years, it looks even more enlightening. OK Turbo....sigh. I was hoping someone with more financial sense might take up the mantle. I put poring over 5 years of financials right up there with crutching flyblown sheep. But let's say, for the sake of argument, in a moment of extreme intoxication, I might want to actually look at 5 years of RAAus financials. How would I go about it? I'd be happy if a passing turbo driven aircraft accidentally dropped a brown paper package in my back paddock As a member, I should be able to request the financials, but I have to go to Canberra to see them, and to be honest the abbreviated documents they give us don't say much in the way of detailed expenditure items anyway. Sure, I guess I could go down the FOI route, but I gather that costs money and I'm sorry, I'm not going to pay a cent to crutch someone else's sheep! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Good analogy Pow. We used to go round the sheep this time of year every second day or so, and usually one or two were flyblown. In a few minutes the dogs would have them grouped in a corner of the paddock and another minute or so, the small patch was clipped away and treated. My uncle used to employ workmen who preferred to drink beer, and they only went round the sheep until they saw enough struck to warrant taking them back to the shed. I got the job crutching and treating them which usually involved shearing them right up the back over the top of big fat maggots, throwing up over the sheep now and again. I'll post the details shortly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaz3g Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Once they are released under FOI they are released to the whole world... How about posting them as PDFs, TP. Edit: The reports, TP, not the maggots. And yes, I've lost my lunch over the odd sheep, too. Kaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 .........I'll post the details shortly No need to turbo.....my mind can fill in the blanks of you tossing your cookies over a Sheeps back......... Just joking...post the details if you can, and if you can scan or have the source documents in PDF and don't mind posting those that would be good also Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Pow, I'm surprised; RAA is an Incorporated Association Incoporated Associations are required to submit an annual return There is no need to FoI it, that's one of the big benefits of an Incorporated Association - the handling of public monies is very transparent. You just write a letter suggesting Annual Returns for the years 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, as follows: Office of Regulatory Services, Department of Justice & Community Safety, GPO Box 158, Canberra 2601 ABN: 40 070 931 645 Name: Recreational Aviation Australia Inc. Address: Unit 3, 1 Pirie Street, Fyshwick, ACT 2609 Attach $36.00 per year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerin Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Attach $36.00 per year Sorry...that's the killer. Donations are welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Sorry...that's the killer. Donations are welcome. Don't even think of going there. When, 18 months ago I suggested the membership incease of around a quarter of a million dollars was unjustified and unfair I was villified and member after member said it was petty cash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 TP can you clarify whether you are legally unable to post the financial reports or are unwilling? I don't really understand why once the information is out there it can't be shared in full. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 TP can you clarify whether you are legally unable to post the financial reports or are unwilling? I don't really understand why once the information is out there it can't be shared in full. Firstly it is copyright and it would be hypocrital of me to raise issues then beach copyright. Secondly it would be useless for you to use as evidence whereas a certified copy, or at least a copy addressed to you carries weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerin Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Don't even think of going there.When, 18 months ago I suggested the membership incease of around a quarter of a million dollars was unjustified and unfair I was villified and member after member said it was petty cash. True Turbo. It's all relative. I walk into our local stock and station outlet and spend $10K on crop chemicals without even blinking. But we all have priorities in life, and spending $150 on something I hate doing with a small chance of reward is hard to justify. I admire the fact that you have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Sorry...that's the killer. Donations are welcome. Provided that the resultant information is used to benefit/improve RAA's ongoing operations and does not just become cannon-fodder for more forums crappola, I'm up for the cost of access to one year's worth of financial info. For those members who are genuinely interested in getting RAA/AUF back on track now is the time put your hand in your pocket and buy Powerin some extra work. If a scenario of historical financial impropriety is indicated, it needs to be tabled at the Feb meeting. This mess ain't gonna self-cleanse. Tell me how and where to send the dosh Pow and yer on! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerin Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Provided that the resultant information is used to benefit/improve RAA's ongoing operations and does not just become cannon-fodder for more forums crappola, I'm up for the cost of access to one year's worth of financial info. For those members who are genuinely interested in getting RAA/AUF back on track now is the time put your hand in your pocket and buy Powerin some extra work. If a scenario of historical financial impropriety is indicated, it needs to be tabled at the Feb meeting. This mess ain't gonna self-cleanse. Tell me how and where to send the dosh Pow and yer on! Oh no...what have I got myself into... It's NY Eve and think I included a disclaimer about being intoxicated in a previous post:celebrate: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Saving RAA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 TP so if I pay for these documents am I legally not allowed share them? Does every single interested member have to pay $36 per report, the only winner here would be the Dept. of Justice. I can understand your point about a copy being un certified but perhaps if people could see or at least know exactly what the anomalies are they may be more willing to pay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerin Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Saving RAA? Fair enough...but I'm just a knock-about farmer that hasn't even got his cert yet (sigh). Surely there's someone more qualified to save RAAus? C'mon Shirley...I'm looking at you.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaz3g Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 I Pow, I'm surprised; RAA is an Incorporated AssociationIncoporated Associations are required to submit an annual return There is no need to FoI it, that's one of the big benefits of an Incorporated Association - the handling of public monies is very transparent. You just write a letter suggesting Annual Returns for the years 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, as follows: Office of Regulatory Services, Department of Justice & Community Safety, GPO Box 158, Canberra 2601 ABN: 40 070 931 645 Name: Recreational Aviation Australia Inc. Address: Unit 3, 1 Pirie Street, Fyshwick, ACT 2609 Attach $36.00 per year In which case, they are public documents and there is no breach of copyright in providing them to third parties. .,Kaz 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingVizsla Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 If we can get a copy we can mull over the issues privately and then present a certified copy at the meeting. So if "someone" has them PM me and I'll give you my mailing address. Alternatively I can put my hand in the pocket to fund them. Rather than have 100 members paying for 100 copies. I have been Treasurer of nearly everything in Springsure, so I know you can hide anything anywhere. What we report to our Qld Office of Fair Trading is only a summary, not detailed or with explanation. For example I have a register of every member and their status, but only report "membership" as a lump sum. If that changes drastically from year to year, it doesn't get comment from the auditor - mind you I usually give the auditors a thorough briefing. Sue 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerin Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 If we can get a copy we can mull over the issues privately and then present a certified copy at the meeting. So if "someone" has them PM me and I'll give you my mailing address. Alternatively I can put my hand in the pocket to fund them. Rather than have 100 members paying for 100 copies. I have been Treasurer of nearly everything in Springsure, so I know you can hide anything anywhere. What we report to our Qld Office of Fair Trading is only a summary, not detailed or with explanation. For example I have a register of every member and their status, but only report "membership" as a lump sum. If that changes drastically from year to year, it doesn't get comment from the auditor - mind you I usually give the auditors a thorough briefing.Sue Sue...verily thy name is Shirley (phew) I am happy to help. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 if the ORS suddenly recieved a huge influx of requests for the reports it would have to start a few bells ringing in that dept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlfaRomeo Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Why ask the ORS for reports? Why not just complain to the ORS that the Board have breached the Act in several aspects. And let CASA know that the Board have breached the Deed of Agreement. The Deed requires the Board to Act within the law. Breaching the Act breaches the Deed. And there are plenty of other things agreed to in the Deed that this mob have not got done. Wait. The Board are only volunteers so any FU of any proportion we should just live with after all they are doing, as they tell us, the best they can. Wait. That really is absolute BS. If the best they can do is ignore the Constitution for months on end (financial reports) and breach the Act in several areas, and breach the Deed of Agreement, their best really is not good enough. Keep going this way and best endeavours could see us with RA bankrupt. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingVizsla Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 OK Folks, I have received copies of the RAAus Annual Reports which includes the Audit Report from 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011 & 2012 (including Notes). If any RAA members would like a copy PM me and I can send them. I have them in pdf, about 4.8MB all up. Analysis to follow. Sue verily thy name is Shirley (phew) Powerin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Don't even think of going there.When, 18 months ago I suggested the membership incease of around a quarter of a million dollars was unjustified and unfair I was villified and member after member said it was petty cash. Anyone who thinks that is petty cash should pay it themselves especially when you see how it gets spent. Woops someone forgot? to include the proxy forms in the magazine doesn't matter just do a special mail out there's plenty of money. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomadpete Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Ar you guys still wading through those heavy tomes? Fallen asleep maybe? There's lots of us common unwashed folk waiting with baited breath for some gems of wisdom to fall. (Or bombshells, strike out that which does not apply) It must require a supercomputer called "deep thought"........ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damkia Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Ar you guys still wading through those heavy tomes? Fallen asleep maybe?There's lots of us common unwashed folk waiting with baited breath for some gems of wisdom to fall. (Or bombshells, strike out that which does not apply) It must require a supercomputer called "deep thought"........ Same sort of mathematical trickery involved too. We know the answer, we're trying to work out the question......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Ar you guys still wading through those heavy tomes? Fallen asleep maybe?There's lots of us common unwashed folk waiting with baited breath for some gems of wisdom to fall. (Or bombshells, strike out that which does not apply) It must require a supercomputer called "deep thought"........ No, I stopped when I got all the smart arsed commentary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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