Jerry_Atrick

When the AUD was high, I was looking at importing GA aircraft into Aus; the model being that it would be sold as ready to fly - conversion to VH register which would have included a new annual, upgraded avionics, refurbished (not necessarily new) interior and if required, and a bare metal respray. It sounded fanciful, but at the time, the used SEP (SIngle Engine Piston) and twin GA aircraft market was depressed all over Europe. This was mainly because EASA was allowed to run riot under Patrick Gordeaux, who had something against GA and interpreted a request to harmonise regulation across the member states as to also harmonise regulation between all forms of GA - including private flying with CAT (RPT) to the point they were seriously proposing to require certified flight data recorders (and possibly cockpit voice recroders) in aircraft over 1,000kg MTOW. Under EASA, the costs shot up overnight as well as burdening restrictions which further increased costs. For example, all twin aircraft were banned from operating into or out of an unlicenced aerodrome despite having safely operated like this for years. The result - added landing costs and handling fees. They wanted to do away with the UK IMC Rating - which was only valid in the UK, despite the enormous enhanced safety it provided. Oh, but if you wanted to do a full IR, you required ATPL theory - all of it! (that has since changed to some effed up system to save face). Result - 18 months of theory study with very expensive books or even more expensive classes.. as well as a massiver delay in getting your IR. Your aircraft had to have an annual maintenance and a separate annual review certificate (ARC). The ARC was just a wad of paperwork and had to be carried out by your CAMO (Certified Aircraft Maintenance Organisation). This additional paperwork added about £2K to the annual - some for paperwork and some for the CAMO insurance covering their liability because, they didn't necessarily have to be the shop that did the work - in fact the ARC and the annual could occur at different times. Also, in the UK, as most major airfields are privately operated or coucil operated on a profit basis, landing fees and parking charges became more expeinsive due to upgraded EASA reg requirements. Shoreham charges something like £30/landing (I am talking PA28 type a/c), Bristol - £54, Fairoaks (where I operated from) £28, although we had an annual landing card. I can't recall Blackbushe, where I last operated from, but would think it would be minimum £25.. It all added up and as the UK, France, Ireland, Spain, Germany, and I think Portugal and Austria are in a recipricol agreement where LSAs and I think Microlights from each country can enter the other country for a max of 30 days at a time without prior permission, there was no difference for the average PPL in going to LSA or microlight as they already had their flight radio telephony licence, nav and controlled airspace checks (it is different here anyway; I think you have to do the latter two as part of your national licence here). The only difference for some was that they couldn't fly in IMC in the UK.. something that has since changed. So, PPLs were switching to LSAs in droves and cashing in their SEPs for LSA material as these were still not too extravegently priced. The result is there were very good GA SEPs with low hours at knockdown prices. As this coincided with the AUD being at all time highs in living memory, I hatched a plan to export these aircraft to Australia. So, I started looking into the economics of it all. Export CoAs from the UK were a doddle.. From memory, all it was, was a piece of paper than confirmed it was on the UK register (with all the numbers) and a charge of £10 as long as it had a current UK CoA. I looked at the aircraft for sale on the Aus market - many were what I would call high time - greater than 5,000 hours... often more than 6,000 hours in the airframe, with higher engine times as well. In Europe, there is still, in relative terms, a plethora of airframes on the market at 3,500 or less... I would say the frequency distribution bell curves turns upward at about 2,000 hours and starts to flatten out on the downward side at about 4,000 hours. If you coudl get a Swedish aircraft, which was also going through the same thing (EASA members include non-EU states), you were pretty well assured a decent aircraft - they hangar them all in heated hangars and only fly them on nice days... almost. The idea was to export and convert to the VH register ready to fly - so with an annual and upgraded avionics. Also, the interior and exterior would be refurbed as required to bring it up to scratch; and if the engine was over 1,000 hours, we would have considered zero timing it (assuming it hand't been overhauled already). These would be factored into the buying price. The idea was for about the same price or a little more than what appeared to be clapped out galopies on the Aussie market, you could have a very tidy aircraft with around 1/2 the hours and better avionics and be confident that you weren't buying a lemon. In fact, we were looking at also providing a warranty (limited). As an example of the aircraft that could be had at the time, a mate of mine picked up a '79 Warrior II with about 800 on the zero-timed engine with an OK paint job an leather interior - slightly aged for £18K. The paint was faded and there was some minor corrosion - that cost him £6K. to fix to a decent standard ... The avionics had a Skymap III (outdated), but dual 8.33KHz coms and a Mode S ADSB Out (all Garmin). Airframe had about 3,500 hours on it. For £21K, he had himself a very tidy aircraft and it has been relatively trouble free. Another mate of mine bought himself a tidy C177 for about £32K - had to spend £4.5K on a new exhaust... It does look a little dated, but flies beautifully. Avionics were pretty much the same as the PA28 (although it may have had a GNS430). I have no idea of the hours it had when he bought it, but I would say he does over 100 hours/year and his last annual in November has it at 4550 hours (thanks to G-INFO). The plan, however, came unstuck for two reasons: 1) We severly underestimated the cost of the work involved in converting to the Aussie register. If we did all the work to spec here, crated it to Aus disassembled and had a local shop inspect, put it together, add the parts requires (e.g. brakes, gaskets, etc which have asbestos.. and a couple of other things), my god they knew how to charge. The going rate for a LAME equivalent in the UK was about £50/hour.. it was about $150/hour in Australia from memory. Even at the lowest value of the AUD, that was an eye-watering rate. I checked a couple of LAMEs in Aus and they were all about the same. It meant that Aussies would pay a bit more but we still thought it was not a bad idea. We did search Europe for a VH registered LAME; there are plenty of US, SAF, and even a couple of NZ.. but we couldn't find an Aussie LAME in Europe to do the work at much better rates. The second reason is that, as I worked at an investment bank, I got the FX traders to give me their forecast of the AUD. The pricing curves on the swap rates and futures didn't look good, and we figured that as we were getting to be a profitable business, the FX exchange rate would move against us and make that business model unviable.. It turned out the markets were correct and it wasn't long before the AUD headed from $1.43 to the £ to something like $1.70... Again, it wasn't insurmountable, but made it that much harder for presenting a case of buyung one.. especially as the Aussie LSA/Microlight scene is also a lot more vibrant than when I had originally left Australia. The GA SEP market has improved thanks to, despite years of official UK protestations, Europe listened to France and booted Gordeaux out of the EASA, replaced him with Patrick Kye and under the DGAC (French CAA), oversaw changes that reduced a lot of the burden and cost in a face-saving way - so could have done better. Also, I forgot to mention, but EASA reqired avgas to have VAT applied in all European countries.. so for the UK, it raised the cost of fuel by 20% overnight - people are now used to it. Also, the higher performance LSAs and even the Microlights seem to be a trifle expensive to purchase these days, and people are saying £30K for a PA28 or £70K for a PS28/Bristell... they'll take the PA28 and use the difference in proceeds for fuel and maintenance - for the average PPL, that will be many years of flying and the PA28 will probably be around when the PS28 has given up the ghost.. Consequently, demand has slightly increased for GA SEPs.. not so much twins. With COVID, most people were expecting prices to plummet, but, like Aus, they have firmed up and there is not that much on the market. Good Warriors of the 1980 mark are asking £40K now. I have been thinking of offering a European sourcing service for Australia where do the pre-inspection, provide a comprehensive report and list of recommended improvements, purchase (review logs, handle all the legals, etc), we get it all ready and disassembled, ship it, clear customs in Australia, and the Aussie owner only has to get his LAME to put it back together, add the missing consumables and issue the VH CoA. And we would warrant it is in exactly the condition as described all the way to the point oif the AUssie LAME getting his or her hands on it. But I doubt there would be a big enough market to scale it to be viable. The idea would be more about lower times, better aircraft for your money.. those extra operational hours turn into $ anyway. Another thing to think about when importing a GA a/c from the US, is my guess is there will be a few US registered LAMEs about.. Why bother converting to the VH register? Run the thing on the N reg.. All you need is a piggy back licence (maybe).. unless AUs prevents it (EASA tried to stop it for a/c based in Europe > 2 years.. Germany and the UK revolted... ) My last shareoplane was N reg and apart from having to pay an annual trustee something like £400, it was easier on the maintenance wallet by far.. and is far cheaper to import.

Story is behind a paywall, but foudn this: https://www.australianflying.com.au/latest/soar-aviation-goes-into-administration. Interesting to note the AQSA accrediation was later restored, but there has obviously been some issue as they have accrued some $6m in debts and that is exclusive of any damages that would have been awarded under the class action being taken by Gordon Legal. For Kholani, I would not expect this to be the last you will see of him... My guess is, as an enterprising soul, he will lick his wounds and take it as a lesson of life, hopefully learn form it and come back in some way or other. If he does, let's hope he applies lessons learned in a positive way. The industry needs enterprisig people - we prefer them not to make mistakes though...

You could try a wanted ad in a couple of the above publications/sites... You would be surprised at the response you can get... sometimes people don't put their aircraft on the market because they don't want to have to deal with tyre kickers and dealers or they are thinking about it but haven't committed to sell; but when they see a well worded wanted ad, they think a loit less hassle and can sometimes sell.

@onetrack - my understanding was that India and Pakistan split very soon after India obtained independence - and that Ghandi was intent on keeping them together. The news we get from Pakistan is the horrific stuff that goes on and to be frank, is allowed to go on. I dodged a bullet in having work send me to Karachi. But a close colleague was sent there for a pre-sales demo and consulting.. and when he came back, he mentioned that it was a lot better than the media portrays. As with most poorer and third world countries, most of the crazy stuff happens in the rural and remote areas.. where education is poor and the authorities have little care of. Having said that, he wasn't in a hurry to return any time, soon. The Indians and the Pakistanis do hate each other.. with a vengance. I was on a client site in Abu Dhabi and installing some kit. There was an Indian and a Pakistani - one was a manager and the other his subbordinate - I can't recall which was which. Well, I handed the subordinate a 3.5" disk with hand written instructions of how to install the monitoring software on a PC. I tested the server was working fine but for some reason, the subordinate became visibly nervous.. As I was walking over to see what was wrong, the manager leaned over and asked what was happening.. His subordinate was quivering and said the software install wasn't working. This was rapidly met wth a slap to the back of the head - not a joiking one - but with almost his whole force - pushing the subordinates head forward to almost hitting the monitor (an old CRT one). "What the F! Why difd you do that?" I yelled at the asshole. He gave one of those gallic shrugs - "He is paid to do his job - if he doesn't do it, this is what happend!". I was ropable... "You can't do that... you d!phead!".. and I rushed over and asked what the subordinate did.. Almost now stuttering, he said "I followed your instructions.." I took a look at them and you have probably guessed, I omitted a vital step. I made this known to his manager abd asked would he like to take a pop at me.. He backed away a bit.. Now, I am only 5'6" and apart from adding a bit to my grith in my latter years, I am not built like a bick poop-house, nor am I an intimidating nor imposing personality, But I walked up to this sad excuse of a person and virtually nose to nose said in a very calm and soft voice - just lound enough for the subordinate to hear me - "If I see or hear of this behavior again, I will effin punch you in the face so hard, you'ss be breathing from the back of your head... and I know you can't touch a pinkie..." A pinkie is what white expats were called... And there is (or was) a pecking order - locals, pinkies, and the rest... If anyone from "the rest" touvhed a pinkie, they were in big touble.. When I got back to my temporary office (I was only there for 2 weeks), I spoke to my Egyptian chaperone who was aboslutely lovely, and nonchalantly, she told me it was normal behaviour... That (and a couple of other thigns I observed) in a progressive and western-ish Arab nation is why I will never return... unless I am broke beyond belief.

Do we not go back to put first principles in our theory to work out what effect the controls have? Application of rudder in S&L flight will cause the aircraft to rotate (yaw) around the normal (vertical) plane of the aircraft. That is the primary effect. Due to the inertia of the aircraft, it will continue in its original direction, however, one wing is presented more into the relative airflow than the other less so. This causes an increase of lift (and drag but not so much) in the into-wind wing, and less life (and drag but not so much) in the out of wind wing. The result is, at some stage later (depending on airspeed, dihedral, lateral stability, etc), the into-wind wing will rise due to the lift and the out of wind wing will drop, causing the aircraft to rotate (roll) and the vectored lift would turn the aircraft. Even if one held opposite aileron to keep the wings level, the thrust line, has vectored, so it would eventually also turn the aircraft. I did read somewhere that early aircraft only had rudders and they used to make wide, skidding turns; before ailerons were developed, some aircraft warped their wings as well. The ailerons basically reverse the primary and secondary effect... the aircraft will initially roll and continue in a straight line, however, the lift vector will cause a yaw and drag the nose around. Of course, particularly at lower airspeeds, the up going wing will initially want to drag the nose in the opposite direction (adverse aileron yaw), and this is negated by the rudder. The elevator primarily controls rotation around the lateral plane of the aircraft and pitches the nose up or down around the axis. In a propellor aircraft, its secondary effect is a change in airspeed. In a roll, it can intensify the rate of turn.. Well, that's what I recall learning in PPL theory, anyway. And I know it all depends on inertia, airspeed, etc.

And Europe/UK

That may be the case, but they are ones who are investigating the specifics of the accident and will provide the authorative report. That is my point. Often, those who are emotionally raw will do an internet search to find information to help them make sense of their loss. That search may bring them to this thread. They may or may not have any flying experience. My post was to point out to those in this sad situation who may be reading this that the conversation had morphed into the generalities of limitiations of the flight envelope based on what would be credible but not necessarily complete information of the cause of the accident. Therefore, nothing specifically should be drawn from it about the accident. It was also to point out that despite our training, which teaches us not to do many stupid things, our experience, and ongooing learning from those who have trodden the path before us, that we are fallable and can make mistakes. I did mention in my post that, "I don't want to stifle the conversation on generalties of these situations as we always learn a lot." [edit]@Turbs - this wasn't specifically referencing you; it was a general point as I think a few have misinterpreted the reason for my post [/edit]

Fellas, I understand that we have moved from speculation of the cause of the tragic accident to discussing the generalities of the fatal turn. But, in respect of both the deceased and his family/friends who will probably be reading this thread, can we please clarify that we do not yet know the cause of the accident, let alone attribute fault or otherwise. That is my bold, but we must remember, that it is an account, but not necessarily the account of what happened. I just want to clear that up for anyone who may be reading this who is directly affected. Until the excrement hits the fan (in our case, literally), we only like to think we know how we will react. I have had in flight situations where I was proud of the way I handled them.. And then, I had a bout of press-on-itis, after years of flying and constantly reading accident reports and shaking my head at those poor souls who succumbed to it. Well, I learned not to be so judgemental as, after much frustration waiting for a cross-country test in the UK, I succumbed. My article on it was published in both Australian Flying and Pilot (UK) magazine in the readers learnings sections. You would have thought I would have learned. Nope.... A perfect storm of various human factors we all read about conicided to drill the holes in the Swiss Cheese - again. Even when I took off, I knew it was going to be a challenge that was likely to exceed my skill level, but I pressed on. Eventually, sandwiched between two layers of stratoform cloud with no horizon, I reluctantly turned back - reluctant because I knew what I had just flown through and didn't want to again. All I wanted to do (under various external pressures) was to see my son before he took off on a big trip, but I can guarantee, I almost never got to see my son again. I think I was half-a-hole in the Swiss Cheese away from you reading about me in an AAIB report. Let's make sure we let the ATSB do their stuff. I don't want to stifle the conversation on generalties of these situations as we always learn a lot. I just want people to know we do not make any judgement, as we don't yet really know what happened.

Hi Bull, Really sorry to hear of this. Sincere condolences to your mate, his family and friends (including yourself). Best you can do is offer him support and a shoulder to lean on. Also, let him know there are a bunch of stangers on here whose thoughts are with him and his family, as ours are with you, too. Life sometimes just isn't fair.

Hmmm sounds interesting - though presumably if that were the case they could finance it without resorting to advertising owns a business for sale ad?

Was perusing through some classified and saw this: https://www.businessesforsale.com/regional-jet-airline-for-sale.aspx Wondering who it could be?

My step father-in-law has a weather station at his place and I think he contributes to it.. He is an ex aviation meteorologist before turning his hand to bank manager. Even so, he is a handy resource when flying with me.

A bit like this:

I have swapped toPilot Magazine as they still produce a paper magazine - albeit muchg less quality of paper than previously. I don't have a problem with that personally... But, it is OK... They had a review of... the C150.. .OK -they were re-imagined, engineered, furbished, or whatever the current re- word of the moment is.. but they are still C150s. The article opened with the statement that virtually everyone that has gone down the PPL route has probably flown one.. Well, if that is the case, them why do we need a review on them? I seriously was falling asleep reading hte article as I have numerous hours on them, and the 152s.. At least he could have found an aerobat, did some aeros on them, and written about the challenge of energy managment with them (thanks to Mr Gower, ex of RVAC fame for putting me through a barrel roll on one in my first lesson with him - think I had soloed on PA28s by then) There was also a review on some other out of production, not particularly classic, nor special, high-wing.. although apparently it has great STOL performance. In my card was a voucher to subscribe to Aussie Flying.. Just done it... I don't mind the trip reports - the photos can be great and the route map gives me a bit of inspiration for trips - biut to be honest, I rarely skim, let alone read the articles Unf. Shelly Ross no longer writes for Aussie flying (she has this website, though: https://www.flyingtheoutback.com.au/ ). She had some great adventures, and she is a great writer... Also, Unf, Jim Davies has moved back to South Africa, though I stil llike readign his analyses of accidents, even if they are now from SAF.

I don't recall any theory - sunstantiated or conspiracy - that reckoned the 9/11 terrorsists decided against flying into the Sydney Opera House because they would have needed an ASIC (yes, I know, they weren't around then). This comes up occasionally here and in PPRUNE, and in UK Flyer Forums, etc. It is a complete joke, but it has created a small industry where the background checks can't be too thorough as I can apply for one here and as long as a designated person who is authorised to sign for the docs sees me and them together, it is done in about 2 weeks.. Which makes me think its little more than a criminal record check, possibly a credit check and maybe a trawl though public health record systems of any evidence of violent psychological disorders - oh, and a check if one is licenced shooter and has licenced firearms - of course that will catch the nasty types.. In fact from here, I can have the ASIC ready to go without them having seen my documents and when I front up to collect it, I just have to show them the docs to prove I am who I say I am - because I can givem them an Aussie address they can post things to. How they will tell I, as a foreign resident, have any issues, I will never know - not in a couple of weeks. I had a UK SC Security clearance which allowed me to have access to secret and occasional top secret assets. As I was only in the UK for about 3 years at the time.. maybe 4, it took 9 months and I know the depths they went to to make sure I wasn't a risk... Over here, which arguably has a much higher terrorist threat than Australia, we are not required an ASIC type card to visit any airfield. Blackbushe, the field I was last involved with would issue an identity card, but that was really to show a) you had passed their out of hours operations questionnairre, and b) the fuel operator had faith you could take your fuel on account. No one wore them (except those who also wore G suits for C150A aeros). GA airfields have as about as lax security as they ever had.. And the security is tight as fishes posteriors at major airports.. it is mandated by law the min standards and as part of their licence, they have to satisfy the Home Office their security meets it, it is audited, etc. etc. I bet few, if any foreign operator crews have an ASIC yet they can come and go through Kingsford-Smith, Tulla, etc.. because of the security the airprt has to deploy - not because of ASIC. That is just another layer to justify it to the masses. It is also costing GA operators good money (how much, I am not sure), but every so often someone in the flyer forums or who you speak to raises it as they intended a great flying holiday in Aus, but instead opted for a 1 hour joy-flight around the Sydney basin (or wherever they happened to be)

Close call - Baby lakes for $22K or wife... I know which is cheaper....

Yes, get well soon, Ahmed; Wishing you a speedy recovery and tapping at the keys, ASAP.

Those graphics are stunning... Are you flying around Blackbushe? Be careful not to bust Farnborough's new dog breakfast airspace! It looks so real, the CAA will come and get you 😉 Just saw the Jackrells Farm reference.. .so no.. not near Blackbushe..Those light coloured fields in the background and the town off to the left had me thinking Eversly's Quarry...

OK, this is a Cherokee 6 and ther eis IFR (when not really required), but you can do this with LSAs as well.. Enjoy (I did):

I was taking a photo fo a static B1 Bomber at Fairford when a rather attractive woman entered the shot just as I hit the shutter... or that's what I told my partner 😉 Anyway, flame out happened quickly and obviously using the sea as an extinguisher.

Glad to hear things are going well with FS2020... Any chance of a vid/screen shots? I think I would have to upgrade my graphics card and possibly RAM to make it work well.. But my PC is an I7=9700K, which I would have thought would be good enough to run FS2020. But it was £500, so unless the yoke is expensive, I fear I would have to get something better... and I would rather spend that sort of money on 10 hours in a Warrior rented from the local school. Maybe...

Thought I would test out the feature 👍

OK.. impossible to work out where they were, but even assuming a non FISO airfield, there should be radio calls somewhere?!? That is nuts... BTW, rather sadly, I used to work at Coles Myer at their Tooronga head office in Melb (nicknamed the "Tooronga Zoo"). A lovely lady (few years my senior) who was a server at the canteen (called "The Bistro") had a husband who was a glider pilot. He drove to Tocumwal every second Sunday, went for a glide and drove back. At the time, I used to go to Toc one a month for a weekend (Friday night to Sunday morning) mostly for gliding, but I never met him. I used to glide on Saturdays as well and left Sunday for a lazy sleep in and lunch before the 3+ hour drive back to Melbourne. One Sunday evening I get back to Melbourne but go to the sis-in-law's place instead of home. As we are yapping away, one of her kids grabs my attention to the tellie to show me a glider accident at Toc; A power pilot was descending on final and the prop cuts through the tail of a glider. My heart sank as, although I didn't know his name (they hadn't yet married), I just knew it was him. The next day, she was not there, and when I asked about her, they just said she had a sudden family bereavement. I felt gutted, as she confided to me she hated him gliding, but I used to assure her the drive home after an early morning drive up + all day gliding was far more dangerous than the gliding itself. When she finally returned to work, I greeted her; she came out from behind the counter and gave me a big hug.. Tears were streaming from both of our eyes as I apologised for giving her false assurance. She told me not to be silly and agreed it was a freak accident and it brought some comfort he died what he loved doing. It was the only time I thought of chucking it all in. I gave up gliding not too long after, though.. I have not been in a glider since (although I have yearned to a few times). [edit] I still have the newspaper cut out...

Glad to hear pilot will be (or should be) OK... Noted that the ATSB were informed.. Do they investigate such actions for RAAus aircraft?

2017 - 145 hours 2018 - 122 hours 2019 - 65 hours (a/c was in the paint shop for a bleedin long time) 2020 - Zippo hours... a/c came out of paint shop just before lockdown, sold the share, work dried up.. Start some work on Wednesday, and we go into lockdown on Thursday!