turboplanner Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 Does anyone know if there was another accident about the same time in the same area because the reporting at first said a six seater and possibly 6 dead?Or was it just another reporting stuff up? It could have been in the desperate search by Police etc to identify the aircraft, or it could have been an Operator thinking it was one of their aircraft which had departed for that area. There's a lot of confusion in those first minutes and people do their best. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 Horible horrible run we are having.... This one has witnesses. Not going to repeat what was 'reported' by them on the news incase it turns out to be more rubbish. Thoughts are with the family and friends.. . 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shafs64 Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 I was looking at the for sale section in December RAA mag and notice that aircraft for sale. new was still getting his eye in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Does anyone know if there was another accident about the same time in the same area because the reporting at first said a six seater and possibly 6 dead?Or was it just another reporting stuff up? This should answer your concern. "Earlier, a Queensland Police Service (QPS) spokesman said the crashed aircraft had the capacity to carry six people, but they could not confirm how many people were on board at the time of the crash." Source: ABC News 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Oh dear!!!! One look at original photo of the AC in the water and it was clear to see it couldn`t carry 6 people. Frank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Frank, this was probably a policeman doing the best he could under the circumstances almost definately would have been told it was a 6 seater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planedriver Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 As well intentioned as the local cop may have been, he probably dosen't have the knowledge that most of us here do 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webbm Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 According to news sources, it was reported to the authorities that up to 6 people were onboard, creating a As well intentioned as the local cop may have been, he probably dosen't have the knowledge that most of us here do And the benefit of hindsight. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 It's probable that some of the first actions of police, as the wreckage was drifting in, were to try to identify who it was by phoning local aero clubs and airfields to see who might have left for a flight over North Stradbroke. However, taking swipes on the accuracy skills of journalists and police should be the last thing on your mind. If a witness statement is correct, that the aircraft dropped a wing and fell in from 90 metres, you have a lot more to be worried about, with a score of six on the board for the past year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 ...... If a witness statement is correct, that the aircraft dropped a wing and fell in from 90 metres, you have a lot more to be worried about, with a score of six on the board for the past year. Same story for the one that went in off Avalon beach after a fuel starvation. Subject to other no problems you should be able to land a low wing in the water with the correct technique and live to tell the tale ... no judgement call here just an observation very sad outcome. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shafs64 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 295ft thats very low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Perhaps he had lost power and was attempting to glide to land (pure speculation of possibilities on my part), if witness accounts are credible it could have been a stall spin attempting to stretch the glide, the same thing that happened in the Speed accident and fatality at Avalon following a fuel exhaustion no power scenario where at least the passenger survived to tell the story. Difficulty is we may never know ... poor bugga. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I remember saying on this forum years ago that pilots were not practicing and therefore not skilled at glide approaches, I got attacked from all sides for that. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultralights Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 remember i witness accounts cant really be relied upon for accurate assessments. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 remember i witness accounts cant really be relied upon for accurate assessments. Well not always. Depends on the competency of the witness. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Yes, silly old police, always advertising for eye witnesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 remember i witness accounts cant really be relied upon for accurate assessments. Unless the witnesses are themselves pilots. . . .? then their statements become more valuable.. . . .? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 Funny thing about witnesses,. . . . .we had an incident at our local field, ( already reported here ) where there were two pilots,. . .one a student,. . .and one a retired airline pilot with 12,000 hours and now an aerobatics instructor and low level display authority examiner. The NON pilot, waiting for a trial flight, said that the aircraft was climbing, and that it suddenly stopped climbing, and pointed downwards. ( Stall ? ) the other two reported it for exactly what it was,. . .a departure stall, by a pilot who had only 1 hour time on type, and had loaded the aircraft with full fuel and a "meaty" passenger. . . .and had climbed "Exuberantly" ie, at too steep an angle of climb for the type, at the particular weight. So. if I was an air crash investigator,. . . I wouldn't wish to discount a statement made by a non-pilot, especially if there was no one else around,. . .the investigators can glean quite a lot of useful info from non pilot witnesses. . . . . This probably doesn't apply to the accident described in the thread,. . .but info from the the "grockles" should never be completely discounted as worthless all of the the time. . . . . As for the police,. . . they are just doing their job. . . .and the media,. . . . .WELL that, as they say,. . .is another story. . . . . .get it out one the web FIRST . . . . and quick,. . .the facts are secondary. . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 In my experience with a couple of accidents, non- flyer eye witness reports can provide the missing key. They know what they saw and don't forget it, even if they way they relay it isn't exactly accurate. Often they are the only witnesses also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 When a witness says 'the plane was flying slowly then the left wing dropped and it nose dived into the deck' it is highly likely the writing is on the wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 I remember a Coroner who said it would be desirable to stop motorcycles leaning over on corners, being a cause of accidents. Another famous statement from a judge about a 3 engined plane asking which wing had 2 engines on it. "The engine was working hard flying into the strong wind" before the crash etc Estimating height of aircraft from a non qualified witness, never seems to stand up in court, unless it flew under a bridge or such. Any information is better than none, but we know how most reporters get nearly the whole lot wrong often. The best thing is a camera shot. Nev 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick-p Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 I remember a Coroner who said it would be desirable to stop motorcycles leaning over on corners, being a cause of accidents.Another famous statement from a judge about a 3 engined plane asking which wing had 2 engines on it. "The engine was working hard flying into the strong wind" before the crash etc Estimating height of aircraft from a non qualified witness, never seems to stand up in court, unless it flew under a bridge or such. Any information is better than none, but we know how most reporters get nearly the whole lot wrong often. The best thing is a camera shot. Nev Speaking on camera shots Nev maybe that's the go. Instead of black boxes for us they make it mandatory to have forward facing go-pro's hard wired into the system giving a full account of each flight. We could even fit interlock systems for those that are a little suspect so far as their drinking habits are concerned. The list is endless but I suppose then we would have to up the weight categories to be able to legally carry all the extra hardware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 Well it would certainly facilitate any inquiry. The technology is cheap. Regarding fitting it as instrumentation, I would rather keep that basic and have a GPS backup. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDQDI Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 The technology is cheap. Nev You and I view the price of a go pro very differently:yes:, cheap is not what I would describe them as. Mandating working video capture for ultralights IMHO is going overboard and is adding another cost that isn't needed. Yes I own a go pro, and I enjoy recoding my flights occasionally, and I can understand how much easier it makes things for investigators. BUT don't mandate for me to have one on every flight. Flying is meant to be fun but seems some of us are wanting things 'we' like mandated so everyone has to do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 I'm not suggesting mandating anything. Cost is all relative. A movie camera wouldn't be cheap either. When our planes go in, often there isn't much to go on. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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