How many hours do you fly in a year?

[CAV0K]

I thought it would be interesting to see how many hours you usually fly in a year

[pmccarthy]

The last few years were low for several reasons. This year I am back on track to meet my 2010 to 2016 average. So that is the number I have chosen in your survey.

[alf jessup]

Well for 18 years I averaged over 100 hours each year, last year only 45, this year only .9.

My how times have changed for my flying.

[CAV0K]

Thanks for all the responses and some trends starting to show.

 

Do you think there is any relationship between hours flown and aircraft ownership?

 

ie people with less hours tend to rent whereas people with more hours tend to own?

[spenaroo]

I think ill do 6 hours this year...
and it will almost be $2000.

as a single, 31 year old with a mortgage, its just too expensive.
I would like to fly more. but I simply can not afford to. not with the mortgage costs (and I have a small 2 bedroom unit, at the lowest end of the housing prices)

Similar story with my girlfriend.
She would like to get a license, but try justifying the cost while keeping a healthy finance situation on paper for mortgage applications

Edited July 3, 2023 by spenaroo

[facthunter]

Owning a plane you don't fly much is always expensive regards the hourly rate. Your fixed costs don't change and you have less hours to spread them over.  Nev

[CAV0K]

3 minutes ago, spenaroo said:

I think ill do 6 hours this year...
and it will almost be $2000.

as a single, 31 year old with a mortgage, its just too expensive.
I would like to fly more. but I simply can not afford to. not with the mortgage costs (and I have a small 2 bedroom unit, at the lowest end of the housing prices)

I agree it is getting too expensive, $300+/hr for hire and fly is crazy. What do you currently fly? I note your info says RPC, if youre flying RAAUS you can get a bit cheaper, however if youre flying GA then less than $300/hr is not easy.

[spenaroo]

46 minutes ago, CAV0K said:

I agree it is getting too expensive, $300+/hr for hire and fly is crazy. What do you currently fly? I note your info says RPC, if youre flying RAAUS you can get a bit cheaper, however if youre flying GA then less than $300/hr is not easy.

well....

I currently fly a champ,
but don't have the tailwheel endorsement. so need to fly with an instructor....
(literally just need more time, don't have the consistency to be signed off just yet - have the ability and fly great on a good day, but a bit lacking when the confidence gets shaken)

and now I've flown tail wheel, I don't want to go back to a tricycle gear for the 1 hour every month or two that I fly.
it feels so much more rewarding and involved to fly

which is a moot point

as both flight schools I've used that hire out aircraft have a 30-60 day check ride policy.
which means every flight would be a check flight with an instructor anyway with the hours I fly.
 

Edited July 3, 2023 by spenaroo

[facthunter]

Nice choice of Plane (But I'm Biased there).   They're not supposed to be particularly Challenging but any Tailwheel is basically directionally unstable on the ground, so you have to have a bit of "dancing feet" ability. You'll need to be able to handle near limit crosswinds and 3 pointers as well as wheel on landings..   Nev

[rgmwa]

2 hours ago, facthunter said:

Owning a plane you don't fly much is always expensive regards the hourly rate. Your fixed costs don't change and you have less hours to spread them over.  Nev

The biggest cost per hour for me is insurance. Flying and maintenance is cheap by comparison, although when you own the plane there always seems to be something that needs fixing. Our annual club membership and hangar costs are very reasonable, although I know that isn't the case for everyone.

[facthunter]

A Plane really needs to be put to work. They never were for "Ordinary' folks.  I spent the equivalent of HALF of a HOUSE getting my  Commercial + Instructor rating although a  Commonwealth scholarship at about 100 Hrs helped a bit. . Most people who had planes were well off and had businesses that helped support their hobby or were ex WW2 blokes that had the bug still. There weren't many of those either.   Nev

[kgwilson]

My hourly costs are minimal as I usually only have fuel as outlay. I don't bother factoring in depreciation so I have written off the build cost. Since new in 2015 I have installed a new Bolly prop in 2018 at a cost of $1,700.00 and other parts have been $300.00 for a coil, 2 batteries $280.00, starter clutch $220.00, new mains tyres $325.00, engine mount rubbers $130.00, tacho sender $65.00, oil/filter every 25 hours $45.00, spark plugs every 100 hours $55.00 & air filter $25.00. There are a few other minor things but that's it so far.

[turboplanner]

7 minutes ago, kgwilson said:

My hourly costs are minimal as I usually only have fuel as outlay. I don't bother factoring in depreciation so I have written off the build cost. Since new in 2015 I have installed a new Bolly prop in 2018 at a cost of $1,700.00 and other parts have been $300.00 for a coil, 2 batteries $280.00, starter clutch $220.00, new mains tyres $325.00, engine mount rubbers $130.00, tacho sender $65.00, oil/filter every 25 hours $45.00, spark plugs every 100 hours $55.00 & air filter $25.00. There are a few other minor things but that's it so far.

You can look at it as a write off, and if the aircraft itself lasts for 20, 30, 40 years it's a small part of the hourly rate.

Scheduled Maintenance is fairly easy to budget for.

Consumables like tyres, oil filter spark plugs etc are also easy to budget for.

Unscheduled Maintenance like, an unexpected starter clutch need to have money allocated per hour, or there's going to be a sudden hole in the pocket.

Over the last 20 years Unscheduled Maintenance in the form of an engine failure has taken a lot of people out of flying. Money needs to be socked away for every hour, then when it happens your flying doesn't come to a sudden end.

Where there is a big volume of product the Unscheduled Maintenance is a lot easier to budget for (or conversely the small volume of RA Aircraft is very diffficult).  Japanese truck pretty much wiped out the big truck parts businesses in Australia because they were free of Unscheduled maintenance for a lot more of their life. You could afford to pay $30,000 more because the competitor at the end of 4 years would have cost more than that in repairs and maintenance.

That led to being able to pick an ownership time - new to the time the truck needed its first replacement engine, so you could minimise your total cost of life by selling the trucks in the fleet a year before a replacement engine was needed = Zero Unscheduled Maintenance.

 

[spenaroo]

1 hour ago, facthunter said:

A Plane really needs to be put to work. They never were for "Ordinary' folks.  I spent the equivalent of HALF of a HOUSE getting my  Commercial + Instructor rating although a  Commonwealth scholarship at about 100 Hrs helped a bit. . Most people who had planes were well off and had businesses that helped support their hobby or were ex WW2 blokes that had the bug still. There weren't many of those either.   Nev

True,

in my case it was a house deposit to get the license,

 

but it seems that the days or recreational aviation are dwindling.
everyone I went through training with was using RAA as a stepping stone for bigger things. especially commercial or PPL, almost certainly using it for passengers and transport.
I seem to be in the rare zone of only ever intending to circuit bash, or do a afternoon coastal flight as a weekend treat.

don't even intend on getting the navigation endorsement. ill get around to a passenger one at some point... but its my fun

had an interesting talk with an instructor once about it, day with strong shifting wind and getting frustrated as I couldn't nail one issue free landing.
with the debrief he reminded me not to worry about it - if I'm not enjoying the flight stop.
was a reminder I'm only doing it for fun, and wouldn't be flying in that stuff anyway if it wasn't training. If solo, I would have landed instead of continuing touch and go's

(also a reminder that it applies with go-arounds etc... with my decision making - since that chat I call everything much earlier and don't try to save as many landings)
from talking with them, I get the Idea that I am an outlier - no goal or purpose, just having fun.

Edited July 3, 2023 by spenaroo

[facthunter]

Well There's ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with that, if it's ringing your bell. I'll let you into a secret. My Avatar symbolises an Animated Dusty Crop hopper that was always out of place in it's current aeronautical surroundings. Fly for YOU. Not what others think. Learn from those who have skills to learn from. Keep your ear to the ground. Dwell only on the important things. The REST can be distraction..  Nev

[spacesailor]

At  $ 200 s an hour dual . 

Your own plane makes sense for hour building. 

That's the break even price to sell your dream machine or ,hire someone else's dream machine. 

And don't forget the dollars for your club membership!  .

I can't fly but just love my " Dream machine " . So should I sell it . Just because I don't use it .

The Dollar spend IS in my favour,  as it has NO outlay at all .

spacesailor

 

[CAV0K]

4 hours ago, spenaroo said:

well....

I currently fly a champ,
but don't have the tailwheel endorsement. so need to fly with an instructor....
(literally just need more time, don't have the consistency to be signed off just yet - have the ability and fly great on a good day, but a bit lacking when the confidence gets shaken)

and now I've flown tail wheel, I don't want to go back to a tricycle gear for the 1 hour every month or two that I fly.
it feels so much more rewarding and involved to fly

which is a moot point

as both flight schools I've used that hire out aircraft have a 30-60 day check ride policy.
which means every flight would be a check flight with an instructor anyway with the hours I fly.
 

That's fair enough regarding enjoying the tailwheel and I find most schools have a similar requirement for check flights. I did 1 hour in a carbon cub and certainly enjoyed the challenge but ultimately stuck with tricycle.

 

40 minutes ago, spenaroo said:

True,

in my case it was a house deposit to get the license,

 

but it seems that the days or recreational aviation are dwindling.
everyone I went through training with was using RAA as a stepping stone for bigger things. especially commercial or PPL, almost certainly using it for passengers and transport.
I seem to be in the rare zone of only ever intending to circuit bash, or do a afternoon coastal flight as a weekend treat.

don't even intend on getting the navigation endorsement. ill get around to a passenger one at some point... but its my fun

had an interesting talk with an instructor once about it, day with strong shifting wind and getting frustrated as I couldn't nail one issue free landing.
with the debrief he reminded me not to worry about it - if I'm not enjoying the flight stop.
was a reminder I'm only doing it for fun, and wouldn't be flying in that stuff anyway if it wasn't training. If solo, I would have landed instead of continuing touch and go's

(also a reminder that it applies with go-arounds etc... with my decision making - since that chat I call everything much earlier and don't try to save as many landings)
from talking with them, I get the Idea that I am an outlier - no goal or purpose, just having fun.

If youre able to find/join an aeroclub you may find more like minded people who just enjoy flying for fun, it may even lead to you flying more by way of filling an empty seat to a flyaway BBQ breakfast or other aeroclub social activities, worse case you cost share. This is what I am hoping to do in the near future as I gear up to renew my RPC, my goal is to make it more fun and just enjoy the finer points (quick circuit bash/scenic flight).

[facthunter]

I do think the Social side is very important. Without that. Aerodromes can be dismal, soul destroying places.  Nev

[facthunter]

They can also be a bit tribal or like a chookshed with a pecking order. The ACE of the Base (self appointed) and the accident going somewhere to happen. Pilots are good at putting down their cohorts.  Nev

[johnm]

Facthunter - you always remind me of the comment you ? made where you said                   'you join a club to enjoy the differences of other people' 

 

that's important too 

[CAV0K]

2 hours ago, johnm said:

Facthunter - you always remind me of the comment you ? made where you said                   'you join a club to enjoy the differences of other people' 

 

that's important too 

I like that quote, its true that not everyone will get along/be best buddies in a club, but there is certainly knowledge to be gained in a diverse group who at least share a common interest in aviation!

[danny_galaga]

I think less than 20 hours a year for me. Hopefully at least 50 a year once I've finished building my stupid plane 😄

[facthunter]

  That's a bad side effect of the BUILDING Bit. Nev

[danny_galaga]

10 minutes ago, facthunter said:

  That's a bad side effect of the BUILDING Bit. Nev

Tell me about it! It would have been better to just do my re-solo, which I did. And then stop until the plane was say 75% complete. Ive been building for about 4 years. 

[kgwilson]

I was 90% complete after about 2 years but it took another 3 years to finish the other 90%. 

 

Take some comfort (when you di finish) in the fact that about 50% of all aircraft building projects never get finished at all.