FlyingVizsla Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 Man dead after plane crashes on farm near Bourke in western NSW - ABC News WWW.ABC.NET.AU A man has died after the crop dusting aircraft he was in crashed into a paddock near Bourke in western New South Wales. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 Hopefully ATSB will do a good job on this. Crop spraying is a precision application with a high level of potential risk, but still needs the investigative focus to avoid others becoming victim to the same cause. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 It's a risky occupation. Always sad. Nev 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 Don't know about you - I find the use of the word "crime" as in "crime scene" to be inappropriate, even disquieting. This and others like it, are an accident/incident scene/location - at some time in the future, it may be determined that a crime of some sort has been committed, until then this word is completely inaccurate and inappropriate. 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 I agree with that but the accident scene is required to be kept undisturbed till all evidence is collected from it and crime scene is probably the only sign they have. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 10 minutes ago, facthunter said: I agree with that but the accident scene is required to be kept undisturbed till all evidence is collected from it and crime scene is probably the only sign they have. Nev Sounds about right Nev - why be accurate when you can escalate & save money at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 The scene is declared a crime scene to ensure no evidence is disturbed until an official police investigation is complete. Police are eternally suspicious, and need to be satisfied that every serious event, from fires to death, do not have indications of foul play. If you've ever had a house fire, you'll know that police immediately investigate and interview you, and declare it a crime scene until they're satisfied they've found the exact cause of the fire, and there are no reasons to suspect a crime has been committed. Probably about every third house fire is arson of some type. Angry tenants, love triangles, criminality involving setting fires to cover up robbery or other crimes, financial reward from insurance, the list is substantial. Someone may have had it in for the pilot and sabotaged the aircraft, this has to be checked out thoroughly, the police question the pilots closest relatives to dig up problems that raise warning flags. It is part of police pyschology to advertise that a major event is a crime scene, this makes potential crime planners think twice about carrying out cunning crimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 The same LAW applies if ATSB are investigating it. It's the authority's property till they release it. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 4 hours ago, onetrack said: The scene is declared a crime scene to ensure no evidence is disturbed until an official police investigation is complete. Police are eternally suspicious, and need to be satisfied that every serious event, from fires to death, do not have indications of foul play. If you've ever had a house fire, you'll know that police immediately investigate and interview you, and declare it a crime scene until they're satisfied they've found the exact cause of the fire, and there are no reasons to suspect a crime has been committed. Probably about every third house fire is arson of some type. Angry tenants, love triangles, criminality involving setting fires to cover up robbery or other crimes, financial reward from insurance, the list is substantial. Someone may have had it in for the pilot and sabotaged the aircraft, this has to be checked out thoroughly, the police question the pilots closest relatives to dig up problems that raise warning flags. It is part of police pyschology to advertise that a major event is a crime scene, this makes potential crime planners think twice about carrying out cunning crimes. My point is simple - it's not a crime scene until a crime/suspicion of, has been found. It serves no good purpose (other than the cops promoting themselves) to prematurely declare every incident one. By all means declare an incident/investigation scene but don't call it a crime scene until strong indication that there may have been one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 5 minutes ago, skippydiesel said: My point is simple - it's not a crime scene until a crime/suspicion of, has been found. It serves no good purpose (other than the cops promoting themselves) to prematurely declare every incident one. By all means declare an incident/investigation scene but don't call it a crime scene until strong indication that there may have been one. You better tell Albo then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 He's NOT the relevant minister and the cops will be STATE employed anyhow. Whatever they designate it as is not " earth shattering" anyhow. . Hardly in the first ten of things you'd like to fix. Nev 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 May not be "earth shattering" however the increasing use of hysterical language, in our media and by our authorities, is a trend that should be called out. We no longer have "Extreme Fire Danger" weather condition, an accurate description, it has escalated to "Catastrophic Fire Danger" which isn't even good English. Such misuses of emotive language, does no one any good , and does not help to appropriately motivate the population. It almost seem that there is some sort of competition to see who can come up with the most alarming, disproportionate language, for any given situation. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area-51 Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 1 hour ago, skippydiesel said: May not be "earth shattering" however the increasing use of hysterical language, in our media and by our authorities, is a trend that should be called out. We no longer have "Extreme Fire Danger" weather condition, an accurate description, it has escalated to "Catastrophic Fire Danger" which isn't even good English. Such misuses of emotive language, does no one any good , and does not help to appropriately motivate the population. It almost seem that there is some sort of competition to see who can come up with the most alarming, disproportionate language, for any given situation. Let's up the game and go straight to "Apocalyptic Fire Danger", or, "Apocalyptic Storm Conditions"... We don't want the population wandering around taking photos or trying to help. Got to scare them back into the basements and sports stadiums... gone off topic again... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reggie Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 I lost almost everything (except my aircraft) in a fire 8 years ago. (And DFES did nothing.) I watch the news and see emergency service boss's stand there wearing more bling than the top cop and tell me what I should be doing and how to do it. Empire building at its best. Fk off. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnm Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 the top cop still have some way to go 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 11 Share Posted February 11 Gong ki Kong looks all Wong. Nev 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantomphixer Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 Imagine having to pin that lot back on after dry cleaning 🤣 Well off topic now. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgmwa Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 Better than chainmail in a battle. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmccarthy Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 Has a name been released yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 No. The only information is that the pilot was 47 yrs old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 On 11/02/2024 at 10:55 PM, Area-51 said: Let's up the game and go straight to "Apocalyptic Fire Danger", or, "Apocalyptic Storm Conditions"... We don't want the population wandering around taking photos or trying to help. Got to scare them back into the basements and sports stadiums... gone off topic again... On ABC TV today, Victorian fire person talking about the potential for a bushfire in today's high temperatures & windy conditions - he talked as if the State was already being consumed by fire. This sort of alarmist language, seems to be employed by most emergency response services and the BOM - people just turn off. This may be to their cost, when the dire predictions actually come true. It seem that there is little awareness of the difference between information/advice and hysteria. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 Nothing to do with a Crop Duster Crash and have you ever experienced a bushfire roaring down on you? It's the DRY Conditions and excess grass growth that makes Today a Greater potential disaster with thunderstorms and dry lightning PREDICTED. Preparation has been minimal generally because of the unusual rains and resulting grass growth here so any warning can't be too big. . Nev 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 54 minutes ago, skippydiesel said: On ABC TV today, Victorian fire person talking about the potential for a bushfire in today's high temperatures & windy conditions - he talked as if the State was already being consumed by fire. This sort of alarmist language, seems to be employed by most emergency response services and the BOM - people just turn off. This may be to their cost, when the dire predictions actually come true. It seem that there is little awareness of the difference between information/advice and hysteria. Yes, The story applied ”catastrophic” to the whole of Victoria, but green grass doesn’t burn. Later there was reference to the North West which might well be dry. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 1 hour ago, facthunter said: Nothing to do with a Crop Duster Crash and have you ever experienced a bushfire roaring down on you? It's the DRY Conditions and excess grass growth that makes Today a Greater potential disaster with thunderstorms and dry lightning PREDICTED. Preparation has been minimal generally because of the unusual rains and resulting grass growth here so any warning can't be too big. . Nev ".....ever experienced a bushfire roaring down on you?" Yes I have - twice in our present location, The Oaks, NSW. First event - we (the street/local) had little help from overstretched/under maned fire brigade - all down to us. Despite some near losses, we, the residents (only two family's bailed) prevailed, with minimal asset damage. The fires burned for weeks, doing a good job of consuming many years of accumulated tinder (bugger all fuel reduction in our area). Second event - years later (fuel built up in interval, still no controlled burns) featured big response by fire brigades AND an air show. Pretty much the same result, as we the residents managed previously. The air show was great, huge water bombers wheeling about, seemed like 100ft over our heads - no way they could have done that at an air show. Choppers took over when the bulk of the fire had been contained. Problem with this was, they kept operating for the next week or so. Not only did we get thoroughly sick of the constant noise, they put out the inaccessible burning gullys (that had burnt out the first time) preserving all that fuel for a future "Catastrophe" "....warning can't be too big" Appropriate warning/information is a good thing. Hysterical language is just plain wrong and results in panic / apathey (when repeated hysterical announcements/prediction comes to little or nothing). 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 As the circumstances turned out don't you think the warning was appropriate? Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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