C.A.S.A ramp check

[dazza 38]

By this stage your average 95:10 is now overweight, you'll cop grief for that.

Also, where is one supposed to store all the crap that they want us to carry. Not much storage room in some ultralights.

 

 

[facthunter]

My comment is totally TIC. If your plane is a safe place, disregard. Nev

 

 

[djpacro]

A few thoughts:

 

1. Need to know the regulatory requirements for stuff to carry on the aeroplane (including nav log). Seems like some CASA people may be using the new draft Part 91 regs rather than the current regs. (I hope that the reg is significantly revised prior to release)

 

2. Need to know regulatory requirements for stuff to do as part of pre-flight planning. CASA likes to keep their thumb on commercial operators by making them provide evidence of such actions for every flight - this should be specified in their Operations Manual. It may help in a ramp check to carry all sorts of stuff simply to prove that you did the right stuff but there is no general requirement to do so.

 

3. As for the Ozrunways debate and size of the device - the CAAP is quite clear on this subject. I keep a marked up copy of the CAAP and extracts from the regs per 1 and 2 above on my iPad and iPhone for ready reference.

 

4. What I personally choose to do in pre-flight planning and carry on board for any particular flight will vary between what aircraft I am flying (not easy to access stuff in flight with a Pitts), the weather, duration of the flight and whether I am familiar with the route or not.

 

 

[boingk]

By this stage your average 95:10 is now overweight, you'll cop grief for that.

The plane is overweight? I would've though the pilot was the most likely candidate.

 

- boingk

 

 

[M61A1]

The plane is overweight? I would've though the pilot was the most likely candidate.- boingk

Are you suggesting that those who are close to MTOW without this stuff, diet, so that they can carry documentation without exceeding MTOW?

 

 

[damkia]

Are you suggesting that those who are close to MTOW without this stuff, diet, so that they can carry documentation without exceeding MTOW?

 

 

[boingk]

Mate my very small shoebox sized backpack with all my documentation and ELT weighs in at around 2kg... Most of that is the ELT (500g) and the backpack itself. Maps, printed ERSA and weather pages and the other necessary gear weighs perhaps a kilo.

 

If you are that tight on weight then, yes, I would indeed say take a look at yourself, be honest, and ask yourself if maybe you could do with some lightening up.

 

I know I have 5kg onboard I could do without.

 

− boingk

 

 

[bilby54]

Lets be honest, who actually refers to the printed weather document when in flight?? And I don't mean the big metal drivers.

 

The cockpit converstion would go something like

 

"Hey Sam that cloud over there looks big, I put the weather pages on your seat, can i have alook at them?"

 

"It was really uncomfortable sitting 6" taller as I couldn't see out the front so I shoved em behind the seat"

 

If you are at a fly in and have no intention of taking off because in most cases the bottle of red wine is not finished, you do not have to provide anything other than the aircraft is registered and you can navigate your way to the gents (or ladies) when the time is appropriate.

 

If you fly without proper flight planning then CASA should be the least of your worries

 

 

[kaz3g]

VH you have to have your pilot log book with you but leave your aircraft logs at home

 

Kaz

 

 

[Phil Perry]

with recent ramp checks and CASA appearences at local fly ins I think it would be a good idea for pilots tohave an idea of what is required.

to my knowledge to pass the ramp check:

 

up to date maps,charts,and ersa,A/C log ,A/C flight manual,pilot log,

 

complete flight plan, including fuel burn, heading and track,

 

current weather printed and carried

 

current certificate with appropriate endorcements

 

A/C reg up to date

 

A/C in airworthy order including all place cards (MTOW)

 

Anything I have missed ? please post

A friend had a CAA ramp check at an airfield in Southern Engalnd, ( Can't be too specific as the legal business is ongoing. . . ) apparently, the place he hired the aircraft from had NOT paid for a current licence for the radio gear the aircraft carried, and so they grounded it. As it was not possible to fly from a fully controlled airfield without radio comms. He had to go home via public transport, and MIGHT yet be prosecuted HIMSELF for not checking that the aircraft was totally legally compliant prior to him hiring it, and being, therefore complicit in the offence. . . . This is G.A. by the way, . . . I have not heard of any Microlight / SLA pilots being thus affected, . . .we have something called a "Transportable" licence for an Icom, or other brand of approved hand held to be temporarlily attached, by velcro or chewing gum, or whatever, to an aircraft for the purposes of aeronautical communications. . . ( Mainly on Trikes ) this costs the unreasonable sum of £15.00 GBP per annum ( ! ) but the installation of the fixed radio gear in a Cessna 152, for instance,. . . costs in the region of £250.00 per annum. . . . ie, no commonsense applied, "Let's just get their bloody money" the rich twats. . . . . . This isn't the Europeans,. . .this is the Radio Communictions Agency, another bloody useless quango designed to make money for nothing for the governement. ( For QUANGO - - read Quasi-Autonomous Non- Govenment Authhority. . . . . .we have LOADS OF THESE, staffed by "Jobs for the boys" appointees who have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA OF WHAT IT IS THAT THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING, nor any negative ramifications of same, . . . maybe you have similar committees in OZ ? I dunno. . . .

 

This is the sort of complete bullcrap we flyers are facing in the UK.

 

Phil

 

 

[horsefeathers]

To paraphrase one of Bill Cosby's comedy routines

 

Read Your VFRG.........

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

According to the Visual Flight Rules Guide , page 9, you do NOT have to carry your pilots log book - however, you have 7 days to produce it at a CASA nominated place.

 

 

Also, from the VFRG, these are the required documents required (Page v)

 

Licence

 

Medical

 

Aircraft Flight Manual (POH??)

 

Aircraft Maintenance Release.

 

 

In addition (page 10), charts and weather reports etc would be covered by

 

 

- PPrune has had a discussion on what charts are required - it seems that it is (once again) open to interpretation, and that you only need to carry a relevant chart

 

but a VNC with frequencies and prob a WAC seems the minimal

 

- ERSA carriage?? I cant yet find a definitive answer to this.

 

 

[kaz3g]

To paraphrase one of Bill Cosby's comedy routines

 

Read Your VFRG.........

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

According to the Visual Flight Rules Guide , page 9, you do NOT have to carry your pilots log book - however, you have 7 days to produce it at a CASA nominated place.

 

[ATTACH]21897[/ATTACH]

 

Also, from the VFRG, these are the required documents required (Page v)

 

Licence

 

Medical

 

Aircraft Flight Manual (POH??)

 

Aircraft Maintenance Release.

 

[ATTACH]21898[/ATTACH]

 

.

Hi HF

That's true about the logbook but it can be a long way to the nearest CASA office and its supposed to be updated with each days flying. I keep my licence and medical in a plastic wallet fixed to the inside cover of my logbook and take it all with me to avoid problems.

 

My CTA endorsements are not on my printed licence but are notated in the logbook. There is no manual or POH for Austers so they fly without them.

 

Kaz

 

 

[metalman]

If you were doing the right thing in the first place you wouldn't even be having that conversation. Maybe this is what they are trying to instill in people - that they ARE around and ARE checking, so it would be advisable to get YOUR airmanship in order. You can't blame them for your lack of preparation.

Well, here we are with quite a few post and it still is as clear as mud,,,,so this lack of AIRMANSHIP that I supposedly suffer from is a bit wide spread.

I know what I carry on a flight ,documents as required, very ambiguous I'd say, but back to my post I posed the question of when this current CASA movement will move from "education" to fines and tears,,,,,I don't know how this is a display of poor airmanship on my part but maybe I'm just not real good at this flying stuff,,,,so I thank you for your help, I'll be consulting with an instructor ASAP with focus on my aviation related questions

 

 

[djpacro]

I am currently on hols interstate with no plans to go flying. I carry my licence and medical at all times and my logbook stays safely at home. If I do happen to go flying then the logbook entry will be done next month - I believe that complies with the law (I haven't checked the current law but I know what is in the new Part 61 which takes effect in December.

 

... and that you only need to carry a relevant chartbut a VNC with frequencies and prob a WAC seems the minimal - ERSA carriage?? I cant yet find a definitive answer to this.

You may find that the reg refers more generally to relevant AIPs. If you don't need to reference a WAC because you have a nice VNC then you don't need the WAC (just my opinion but you are pilot in command and you get to decide). (Again I am more familiar with the draft Part 91 which is much clearer.)

[kaz3g]

To paraphrase one of Bill Cosby's comedy routines

- ERSA carriage?? I cant yet find a definitive answer to this.

CAR 233(1)(h)

 

​(h)​the latest editions of the aeronautical maps, charts and other aeronautical information and instructions, published in AIP or by a person approved in writing, that are applicable:

 

​(i)​to the route to be flown; and

 

​(ii)​to any alternative route that may be flown on that flight;

 

​are carried in the aircraft and are readily accessible to the flight crew.

 

Penalty: 50 penalty units.

 

Kaz

 

 

[damkia]

Well, here we are with quite a few post and it still is as clear as mud,,,,so this lack of AIRMANSHIP that I supposedly suffer from is a bit wide spread.I know what I carry on a flight ,documents as required, very ambiguous I'd say, but back to my post I posed the question of when this current CASA movement will move from "education" to fines and tears,,,,,I don't know how this is a display of poor airmanship on my part but maybe I'm just not real good at this flying stuff,,,,so I thank you for your help, I'll be consulting with an instructor ASAP with focus on my aviation related questions

MM2

I referred to "you" and "your" as the collective (ie "everyone"), not the singular in my original post.

 

Apologies if that was not clear and has been taken personally as an insult. I was trying to emphasise that everyone has responsibilities in their general behaviour.

 

 

[horsefeathers]

CAR 233(1)(h)

​(h)​the latest editions of the aeronautical maps, charts and other aeronautical information and instructions, published in AIP or by a person approved in writing, that are applicable:

 

​(i)​to the route to be flown; and

 

​(ii)​to any alternative route that may be flown on that flight;

 

​are carried in the aircraft and are readily accessible to the flight crew.

 

Penalty: 50 penalty units.

 

Kaz

Soooo, is the carriage of an actual physical ERSA (lets not get into electronic copies yet) compulsory??? or is it all open to interpretation while you're getting ramp checked

 

 

[kaz3g]

Pre OR (Ozrunways), you were required to carry current ERSA with you. Now....?

 

The current "rules" from CASA state that AOC holders must have a backup if using an electronic source (iPad) as their primary reference. The back up can be another electronic (iPad but maybe a mini) or paper. Or you can have paper only which makes the electronic a bit superfluous if you are worried about Exceeding MTOW.

 

It appears, but this is surmise only because no-one in authority (CASA) has admitted it, that non AOC operators could fly with only an electronic source. But if they land and are found to only have an iPad and that has crashed, then they will be guilty of a strict liability offence of not carrying required documents.

 

(Edit)... That creates an interesting thought. The current offence is about flying without the paperwork. Could be a good argument if one went to Court as a contest and gave evidence that the "crash" occurred after the aircraft wheels touched down.

 

If you need legal advice, please call your friendly senior legal counsel at CASA and see if you can nail him down.

 

Kaz

 

 

[horsefeathers]

If you need legal advice, please call your friendly senior legal counsel at CASA and see if you can nail him down.

Kaz

That would be like trying to nail jelly to a wall......slightly impossible.

 

But in all seriousness, if I carry a complete ERSA, it resides in the back seat, in a bag tied down - effectively inaccessible in flight- I photocopy appropriate pages to keep next to me, but there is no way I could keep the book next to me. And what about trikes or open cockpit aircraft like drifters - what is the point of making them carry an ERSA, I wonder? Could you open cockpit types actually refer to an ERSA in flight?

 

What I would like to see our RAA CEO do, is to approach CASA, and get a definitive ruling about what documents MUST be carried in an RAA aircraft. I think I just might send him an email about that very topic.

 

 

[flyerme]

. I think I just might send him an email about that very topic.

 

let us know the reply..

 

 

[M61A1]

That would be like trying to nail jelly to a wall......slightly impossible.But in all seriousness, if I carry a complete ERSA, it resides in the back seat, in a bag tied down - effectively inaccessible in flight- I photocopy appropriate pages to keep next to me, but there is no way I could keep the book next to me. And what about trikes or open cockpit aircraft like drifters - what is the point of making them carry an ERSA, I wonder? Could you open cockpit types actually refer to an ERSA in flight?

 

What I would like to see our RAA CEO do, is to approach CASA, and get a definitive ruling about what documents MUST be carried in an RAA aircraft. I think I just might send him an email about that very topic.

After a test flight in a military helicopter, where the pilots flight bag inadvertently dumped it's contents(including hard copy ERSA) around the unoccupied co-pilots pedals, requiring a precautionary landing, I have concerns about any of this stuff loose in the cockpit.

 

 

[Chrism]

Soooo, is the carriage of an actual physical ERSA (lets not get into electronic copies yet) compulsory??? or is it all open to interpretation while you're getting ramp checked

The CASA people at Av Saftey seminars last year said that up to date copies of the relavant pages (including potential deversion/emergency airfields) for your route is sufficient-so not the entire ERSA

 

 

[boingk]

I got the same feedback at this years Natfly - I took a whole ERSA and was told I only needed the few pages for my route and that they were available online so I could simply print them off and take with me.

 

I have concerns about any of this stuff loose in the cockpit.

Indeed. That's part of the reason why I keep it neatly organised in a small bag on my passenger seat, or parcel shelf if two up. I do NOT want my logbook, weather, ERSA pages, ELT etc flying around the cabin! I like using a bag as you can safely thread it into the passenger safety harness, or tie down on the shelf. - boingk

[biggles5128]

The CASA people at Av Saftey seminars last year said that up to date copies of the relavant pages (including potential deversion/emergency airfields) for your route is sufficient-so not the entire ERSA

I used to use a jeppersen soft folder which was A5 in size, strapped to your knee and had a number of heavy duty plastic sleeves built in. Very comfortable and perfect to hold approach plates and copies of the relevant pages of your ERSA, nothing fell on the floor and if you are flying open cockpit would work treat I think.

 

 

[cscotthendry]

This is the approved storage mechanism for the required documentation