gandalph Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 The 'Volvo Driver' analogy seems somewhat appropriate. Hey! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 I just went through a lot of that data base. Taken a whole lot of lives!This was the 55th deployment of the CAPS chute. All the ones that used the chute resulted in survived occupants, minimal injuries. Of all the attempts to fly the aircraft down, there are many (mostly) fatalities..... Also quite a few fatalities during take-off and other maneuvers. Must be a very unforgiving aircraft.... And a surprising number of engine failures! JG JG Interesting reading isn't it, I only went through the 1st page and there were a lot of CFIT in crap weather too. I think it is a fairly advanced aircraft for the average pilot to fly, a little bit like the doctor killers the Bonanza was unfortunately given earlier on in it's life. As you say quite a lot of deaths in the Cirrus since it's inception in 2002 and would be a lot more if it wasn't fitted with the CAPS system. Alf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 Not sure of the facts but wasnt the CAPS implemented accross the range due to its unforgiving nature or maybe as a response to poor performance in spin testing. I am too interested on engine failures, seeing they are all near new engines From the good old skool design why are they stopping? Comparison to bonanza is probably right, high performance aircraft in average performance pilots has poor outcomes Lots of ways to read stats, but even with caps its reported fatality rate is only just below that of GA singles presumably running older engines and no chute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 To me a BRS should be an additional layer of safety that the aircraft owner can choose to have fitted. A BRS that is an alternate to the usual safety characteristics.....that has the hair on my neck raised, I want more options for safety not ones that are used to hide the fact that the usual ones aren't there..... A statement that says "Nope we never formally tested it so it never formally failed " what a load of total BS, they may never of formally tested it because they already informally knew they were going to fail!!!! I mean who designs an aeroplane and then thinks wont bother testing for stall/spin entry/exit characteristics.........swallow that and I can sell you a relatively new bridge over a pristine harbour in Sydney for a very reasonable price! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 I mean who designs an aeroplane and then thinks wont bother testing for stall/spin entry/exit characteristics.........swallow that and I can sell you a relatively new bridge over a pristine harbour in Sydney for a very reasonable price! That bridge sounds alot more stable than a Cirrus!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tadge Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 G'day, I just had a read of the SR22 ECL. After the 'Engine Failure In Flight' memory items the checklist then reads "If the engine fails at altitude, pitch as necessary to establish best glide speed. While gliding toward a suitable landing area, attempt to identify the cause of the failure and correct it. If altitude or terrain does not permit a safe landing, CAPS deployment may be required. Refer to Section 10, Safety Information, for CAPS deployment scenarios and landing considerations". So depending on the terrain in the area it appears the pilot in this case followed the ECL as published. Regards, Brendon 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotorwork Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Noticed another Cirrus SR22 Caps deployment on ASN http://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=166871 Following a loss of engine power, the aircraft, a Cirrus SR22, experienced the deployment of the Cirrus Airframe Parachute System (CAPS) and came to rest upright in wooded terrain in Burlington, northeast of Laurence G Hanscom Field Airport (KBED), Bedford, Massachusetts. The airplane sustained unreported damage and the two occupants onboard received minor injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlegg Posted August 6, 2014 Share Posted August 6, 2014 Just gotta love this: "Watch this" says the salesman/instructor as he puts the cirrus into a spin........ Aviation safety investigations & reports Loss of control involving a Cirrus SR22, N802DK, near Katoomba, NSW on 10 May 2014 Investigation number: AO-2014-083 Investigation status: Completed Summary On 10 May 2014, an accredited Cirrus salesman conducted a sales demonstration flight of a Cirrus SR22 aircraft, registered N802DK, in the local training area, from Bankstown Airport, New South Wales, with a pilot (and potential aircraft buyer) seated in the front left seat and one passenger on board. At about 1330 Eastern Standard Time, the aircraft departed Bankstown and the salesman, as pilot in command (PIC) elected to track towards Katoomba at about 6,000 ft above mean sea level. After demonstrating a series of turns and a straight and level stall, the PIC selected 50% flap, rolled the aircraft into a left turn at about 25° angle of bank, reduced the power to idle, and raised the nose of the aircraft. The right wing dropped rapidly and the aircraft entered a spin to the right. When about 2,000 ft above ground level, the PIC was unsure whether he then had enough height remaining to recover control of the aircraft, and elected to deploy the aircraft’s parachute. The rocket fired, the aircraft initially pitched up slightly and then as the parachute deployed, the aircraft pitched down rapidly into a nose low attitude. About 6 seconds after the rocket fired, the right snub line of the parachute released, followed by the left snub line, which then established the aircraft in a wings level attitude. The aircraft narrowly avoided powerlines, collided with branches of a tree, and came to rest on a fence in the garden of a residential dwelling. This incident provides a reminder to pilots to know your own limitations and those of the aircraft. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpacro Posted August 6, 2014 Share Posted August 6, 2014 Highlights the need for pilots to be totally familiar with the stall/spin characteristics of their aircraft such that they can readily determine the difference between a stall with a wing drop, an incipient spin, a fully developed spin and a spiral dive. The recovery actions for each are significantly different (refer the CASA Flight Instructor Manual). 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Huh.... funny how the truth changes the whole perspective. What happened to the alleged engine failure???? Explain that one to the insurers, a deliberate aerobatic entry where there was insufficient height to recover. I wonder if he even did his basic HASEL checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 I can think of better places to do those sort of manoeuvres than over the Blue Mountains! 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDQDI Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 I can't think of a worse place to do it...... I'd reckon there would be some sucking up happening to the potential buyer to try and mitigate any litigation. I also reckon the pic would be feeling pretty small at the minute. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Jeez, give the salesman some slack! If anybody has ever better demonstrated: 'and by the way, DON'T do this' to a potential customer, then he/she deserves a Gold Elephant Star and a beer in the pub afterwards. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandalph Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Just gotta love this:"Watch this" says the salesman/instructor as he puts the cirrus into a spin........ Aviation safety investigations & reports Loss of control involving a Cirrus SR22, N802DK, near Katoomba, NSW on 10 May 2014 Investigation number: AO-2014-083 Investigation status: Completed Summary On 10 May 2014, an accredited Cirrus salesman conducted a sales demonstration flight of a Cirrus SR22 aircraft, registered N802DK, in the local training area, from Bankstown Airport, New South Wales, with a pilot (and potential aircraft buyer) seated in the front left seat and one passenger on board. At about 1330 Eastern Standard Time, the aircraft departed Bankstown and the salesman, as pilot in command (PIC) elected to track towards Katoomba at about 6,000 ft above mean sea level. After demonstrating a series of turns and a straight and level stall, the PIC selected 50% flap, rolled the aircraft into a left turn at about 25° angle of bank, reduced the power to idle, and raised the nose of the aircraft. The right wing dropped rapidly and the aircraft entered a spin to the right. When about 2,000 ft above ground level, the PIC was unsure whether he then had enough height remaining to recover control of the aircraft, and elected to deploy the aircraft’s parachute. The rocket fired, the aircraft initially pitched up slightly and then as the parachute deployed, the aircraft pitched down rapidly into a nose low attitude. About 6 seconds after the rocket fired, the right snub line of the parachute released, followed by the left snub line, which then established the aircraft in a wings level attitude. I guess the question arises: Was the salesman selling the plane or the parachute.....? Another strong candidate for the Darwin awards 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 So who was in command? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 So who was in command? The BRS by the sounds of it Motz, at least it knew what it was doing 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Cirrus Circus........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrZoos Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 I have been electrocuted and i have been hurt by gravity and inertia.......i will take voltage any day.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 So who was in command? One assumes the accredited Cirrus Salesman .... but a good question, cause he was in the right seat (even though you can still be PIC in the right). Who could ever really know, maybe the potential client cocked up? There was also a PAX in the back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrZoos Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 They all survived so i guess its the ultimate selling point...usually when u corknup a Flat spin we all start sending condolences 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 I have been electrocuted and i have been hurt by gravity and inertia.......i will take voltage any day.... That's a shocking attitude Mate. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrZoos Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Really , Its a current issue? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 He didn't have AMPle time to pull out........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 ..... Watt? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Oh please ... you guys ... go to bed. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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