motzartmerv Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 so if it 'started a spiral' and that means a stall and spin-entry, then pulling the red handle is the only way out. . Ummm.. Got any BAK books in your library? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ozzie Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 N802DK from memory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaba-who Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Just saw the footage on SBS and heard the commentator reporting the event. Almost choked on my dinner when I heard it was a "Cessna -type aircraft". All while the video shows the aircraft obviously not a Cessna. And a visible logo showing its a Cirrus 22. And the pilot was praised by onlookers for the way he landed the aircraft in the front yard avoiding the house and the high tension power lines. Jeez they talk so much crap. 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Bloke pulls the chute all survive this instance, bloke tries to land it over the blue mountains somewhere news headlines may have been different. End result is a good one, damn lucky they didn't hit the HT wires as that would have been a different headline. Only the PIC knows why he pulled the red handle and I commend him for his actions, he and his pax live to fly another day. Alf 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Only wish the bloke I sold my old trike to at Tyabb had of pulled the chute that was fitted to it also. Alf 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Alf? Was that your old trike? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Yeah mate it was Alf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 :( From what i read it was on final? Bit late to pull it at that level IMHO. There isnt a great deal of info out there regarding their usage. All the acft ive flown that have them fitted, I havnt paid a great deal of attention to them to be honest. Some say to arm them before you blast off etc. Some say 500 ft..Some say 1500.. Our bantam had one fitted, but the handle was right next to the flap lever. And theres a few pilots I know of that I dont want playing around with things like that!!!. Made me very nervous seeing the hands go up and grab the lever, and fidget with the BS handle..Not a nice feeling... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotorwork Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 N802DK from memory I had read on another site that it was a Cirrus demonstrator , arrived in February, flown out from the US, it was at the Tyabb airshow in March, Had a recent tour to NZ as well. Fly Safe R W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Andy, BRS say they will deploy at around 300ft, and yes I had it armed every time I flew as you won't have time to fiddle around finding the pin to unarm it when the Fhit hits the San, time is crucial when your heading to the deck out of control. Alf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XAIRVTW Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 The aircraft is a demonstrator for Cirrus that's why it has a US rego. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkennard Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 for me I would not fly in that type of area with any single engine , unless u can reach a landing area it no go ...That has kept me out off trouble anyway each to there own ! Have you flown around there? Flying west out of Sydney you are now given many options. Maybe katoomba airfield, a few golf courses and I've noticed a few paddocks in the valley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Evans Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Have you flown around there? Flying west out of Sydney you are now given many options. Maybe katoomba airfield, a few golf courses and I've noticed a few paddocks in the valley. No mate only flown as far south as lismore / balina area but if I can't fly IFR "I follow roads I plan a safer route was taught in a 2 stroke and still fly one today I don't fly .. My life is valued by the wife so I don't take risk " she kill me if I did anyway ..".. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperplace Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 " My life is valued by the wife so I don't take risk " she kill me if I did anyway ..".. god yes, the ultimate regulatory authority. As a Jab flyer, I hope she never hears of this thread, because she'll want to know if jabs have these chutes. That I never fly over tiger country won't impress her in the slightest. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Oscar, I don't want to be a nit picky bugga, but since when does 'if it started a spiral' that it means a stall and spin entry? Its either spinning or spiraling and if these things are notorious at not coming out of a spin, and it was in a spin, it would be spinning. David - I reckon, from some of the 'eyewitness comments', that the commentators would hardly be reliable witnesses to the difference between a spiral dive and spin entry, and (and this is more presumption on my part, obviously) if it was sufficiently low that people looked up at the cessation of engine noise, possibly the pilot was feeling insecure about the amount of height available for recovery anyway? According to more recent news, the pilot reported his altitude as approx. 4,000 feet when the noise stopped, and Lawson's elevation is nearly 2400, so by my calculation he was about 1600 AGL. However, it's a moot point, but the pilot is around to tell the story, which is good. If you look at that area on Google Earth, there are pretty much zero Cirrus-friendly emergency landing spots; the pilot may have been merely doing a turn in the general direction of the nearby golf course before pulling the handle, I guess we'll find out eventually. Just looking at the general area, I can't see anywhere that I'd be comfortable in trying to land a Cirrus, the BRS was (I think) the only realistic option, and your idea that he may have been simply slowing up to pull the chute anyway is as plausible as any theory. It does seem that at least some Cirrus pilots go for the handle even in apparently benign situations - like that bloke in late 2012 who ended up in the middle of a large flat paddock near Gilgandra that a lot of pilots would consider pretty much ideal. (https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2012/aair/ao-2012-154.aspx) If you look at the final report, there are several photos of the landing site, and it's fine wheat stubble for bloody miles in every direction. Does that say anything about the perception - if not the fact - that anything less than a large length of black tarmac is not the place they feel comfortable about trying to land the thing on? Ummm.. Got any BAK books in your library? Merv - I am signed out for spins (in gliders, at least). I may be a bit rusty but I think muscle memory would suffice over reading the BAK handbook, even these days. A minimum of three fully-developed turns, demonstrated both with an instructor and solo, was in those days required for signature. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metalman Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Bloke pulls the chute all survive this instance, bloke tries to land it over the blue mountains somewhere news headlines may have been different.End result is a good one, damn lucky they didn't hit the HT wires as that would have been a different headline. Only the PIC knows why he pulled the red handle and I commend him for his actions, he and his pax live to fly another day. Alf It would really suck to get in strife, pull the chute ,then gracefully float into the Ht lines,,,,,,,good to see it worked out well for all ,,,,,as for it being a Cessna type they do sell something that looks remarkably similar ,but I doubt the dumbass reporter would know that Matty 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motzartmerv Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 No worries oscar, was only replying to what you said, not the eyewitnesses. You did call a spiral a spin. Surprised that a cunning linguist such as yourself would make such an error;) Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnarly Gnu Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Well it was a demonstrator so the BRS folk will be pretty chuffed how well the demonstration worked out with some amateur video footage to boot. The Cirrus folk, maybe not so chipper about the situation. Great that no one was hurt. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 ...Some say to arm them before you blast off etc. Some say 500 ft..Some say 1500.. Our bantam had one fitted, but the handle was right next to the flap lever. And theres a few pilots I know of that I dont want playing around with things like that!!!. Made me very nervous seeing the hands go up and grab the lever, and fidget with the BS handle..Not a nice feeling... Part of my Pre-start checklist. Pull the BRS pin and stow it in a special hole in plain view. If you need to lauch, you may not have time to fiddle with the security pin. Activating the igniter is said to require a pretty firm pull on the red handle, so accidental rocket launches should be rare if some thought is given to placement of the handle. Well it was a demonstrator so the BRS folk will be pretty chuffed how well the demonstration worked out with some amateur video footage to boot. The Cirrus folk, maybe not so chipper about the situation. Great that no one was hurt. I believe Cirrus make their own recovery 'chutes. BRS may have invented the concept, but it's a separate firm. This incident is a good reminder that parachutes require regular maintenance. My BRS is about due for a repack. We are lucky that this country has people authorised to do the job. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 No worries oscar, was only replying to what you said, not the eyewitnesses.You did call a spiral a spin. Surprised that a cunning linguist such as yourself would make such an error;) Cheers All good, Merv.. it's those little quotation marks that maybe confused you, they're a shorthand way of indicating that what is between them is taken from other text or conversation. I do seem to recall that recently , a low loop resulting in a serious crash in the UK was described by an eyewitness as 'a somersault'. Well, you just can't trust the Press to get it right, can you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 "The Cirrus folk, maybe not so chipper about the situation. Great that no one was hurt. Yeah, this is surprising, agent and maintainers quoting great success of chute and proudly saying that with the chute Cirrus now have fatality rates pretty similar to other light aircraft!!! Unlike earlier models! Not many indicating that under chute its without control at all As it was fired nice and early apparantly, like 3k feet ??, any spiral could be windmill under chute? Maybe cant happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunder Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 Similar to my mate who bought a new Harley. After 15 000k's it needed new shocks. He raved about how great the dealer service was..... I don't think he got the irony... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf jessup Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 It would really suck to get in strife, pull the chute ,then gracefully float into the Ht lines,,,,,,,good to see it worked out well for all ,,,,,as for it being a Cessna type they do sell something that looks remarkably similar ,but I doubt the dumbass reporter would know thatMatty Matty, Upside is if the plane had of gone in to the HT wires it still might have been ok as it was fiberglass, but I am betting it would have stretched the wires enough to touch each other and then the fireworks would have began. Luck played big part in this missing the wires as you are a passenger dangling under the canopy in any case, luck was on their side the other day. Reporters don't have a clue unless they are aviation writers, everything is a Cessna type almost in every media report. Alf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guernsey Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 I've been for a spin down the runway in my car and I didn't even turn once. If you can walk away from a landing it was a good one.. Alan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 I believe Cirrus make their own recovery 'chutes. BRS may have invented the concept, but it's a separate firm. I will make a note of that with my BIRO pen, ah I mean Papermate. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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