derekliston Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 "it was a Rotax which killed him"; There are several likely scenarios for his death, but none have been released by any of the responsible people.If you have evidence that they don't, then you have an obligation to provide it to them. Thanks for that turbo planner. Poor phraseology I agree. I should have said perhaps, the engine on the plane in which he died was not a Jabiru! I have no idea what the cause of the crash was, my point merely was that aviation can kill you. Doesn't matter whatever make of aeroplane or engine, we all need to be aware of that always! 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Tuncks Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 The Adelaide Soaring club at Gawler have just got a new Jabiru with the new engine. It will be interesting to see how it goes. Over the last 15 years, there have been thousands of hours run up here in Jabirus with very few engine problems. I don't mean for this to sound like an advert, but other engines ( Subaru, Revmaster, Rotax) have also had problems and they are not used in training like the Jabiru. I'm hopeful that the new Jab engine will prove to be very reliable, so I can buy one when the time comes. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDQDI Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Not meaning to be nit picky but rotax engines are known to be used in training. Having said that I too hope that this latest engine is a winner, not particularly for jabs sake but for the sake of us rec flyers as a whole! 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Yep there sure is a lot riding on the success of this round of upgrades Everyone hopes its successful, history says major changes take a while for them to sort out. Its still unkown why aome locations have great run with Jabirus and others the opposite 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Tuncks Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Sorry you Rotax guys. I only meant that the training operation around here used Jabirus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ave8rr Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 The Adelaide Soaring club at Gawler have just got a new Jabiru with the new engine. It will be interesting to see how it goes.Over the last 15 years, there have been thousands of hours run up here in Jabirus with very few engine problems. I don't mean for this to sound like an advert, but other engines ( Subaru, Revmaster, Rotax) have also had problems and they are not used in training like the Jabiru. I'm hopeful that the new Jab engine will prove to be very reliable, so I can buy one when the time comes. I assume the new Jab engine now has CASA Certification to be able to be used for training? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 CASA plays no part in this matter. Since the advent of the ASTM 'self-certified' regime for LSA-class aircraft, it is up to the manufacturer to Certify that the aircraft and its components meet the appropriate ASTM standards. The last Jab. engine (as far as I am aware) to be 'Certificated' was the Jab 2200C; no Jab. 3300 engine and all later 2200 engines are self-certified by Jabiru. That does not mean that the ASTM certifying regime is in any way deficient vs. a 'Certificated' engine - in fact, the ASTM tests are extremely similar and in some regards slightly more demanding than those for 'Certificating'. However, for an engine to be 'Certificated' by an ICAO-recognised national Airworthiness Authority to an international standard, requires that the testing be observed (and signed-off) by the national Airworthiness Authority. To be 'Certificated' means that the engine (in this case) is issued a 'Certificate' by the national Airworthiness Authority. By comparison, to be 'Certified' means that the manufacturer declares the engine to comply with the ASTM standard - and no manufacturer of decent repute would do that without having the testing regime results fully documented. So in short: for any J160 other than a 'C' model, any J170 ( I think), any J120, any J230x, used for training or hire, 'a Certificated' engine is not required - they are 'Certified' aircraft and a 'Certified' engine is what is required. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Somewhere I read the new engine is accepted as replacement for certified models No idea how, its either an all new engine or its not, this seems like they are having a bet either way In reality certificated owners would be in deep trouble were this not the case as there are no longer even parts made under correct production certificate anymore 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 CORRECTION!. The 2200 J model was Certificated. 2200J TCDS.pdf 2200J TCDS.pdf 2200J TCDS.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Certification plays a big part in stagnating development 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 If only Toyota or Hyundai would bring out an aviation engine. They could probably design one by smoko. Yes..... I know the cost.... the low numbers sold.... but just imagine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 It was mentioned round the coffee table at the airstrip this morning that it was Jabiru who bought Camit plant and equipment at the clearing auction. Having been out of the country for six weeks recently, have I missed something or does someone have an authoritive rebuttal? Massively curious. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ave8rr Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 It was mentioned round the coffee table at the airstrip this morning that it was Jabiru who bought Camit plant and equipment at the clearing auction. Having been out of the country for six weeks recently, have I missed something or does someone have an authoritive rebuttal? Massively curious. Jabiru bought only a few bits and pieces through the auction process. No machining equipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDQDI Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I wasn't aware that Camit got out of making Jab motors? It happened in October last year. Camit closing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camel Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 You live in Perth, that's about as far away as you can get from this country, so yes yo have been out of the country for a while:oh yeah: I wasn't aware that Camit got out of making Jab motors? Mr Capt Wally ! You try to speak as an authority ! You don't realise how uninformed you appear to me ! I think Riley is better informed than you are ! What does where he live have anything to do with anything ! The whole world knows about what happened to Camit except you apparently ! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevek Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 If not Hyundai what about Honda, they already make a 1800cc water cooled fuel injected flat 6 cylinder for the Goldwing range 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camel Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 It was tongue in cheek, you angry man! Don't call me an angry man you clown ! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Tuncks Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 There are Subaru powered aircraft around. One did a forced landing around here a couple of years ago. They don't come with dual ignitions and that may have been the problem, so a purpose-designed thing would be better. The main problems are the speed, with aircraft wanting a slow crank speed, and crankshaft strength, where auto does not need to carry a prop load. So most auto conversions need a reduction setup, which adds a whole lot of problems. In the meantime there are quite a few auto components in the Jab engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Jabiru bought only a few bits and pieces through the auction process. No machining equipment. Thanks for the clarification. This snippet of misinformation emanated from a person of self-appointed expertise and great knowledge in all things so I probably should have waived it off but- as stated, I was out of Perth for six weeks and that's really 'out of touch'! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 In the meantime there are quite a few auto components in the Jab engine. The pistons, gudgeon pins and circlips (originally, ACL-produced Commodore V6 pistons, but for years now, Jab. have sourced theirs from China - not without problems) and the main bearings - ironically, Subaru spec. The oil-pump is a Borg-Warner 35 (I think) auto gear-box gear-pump pair, in a bespoke housing. I'm not sure of the valves and springs origin, but probably - knowing Rod - also originally auto-parts sourced. VDO senders and (mostly) gauges with hand-painted limits on the faces; the engine mount rubbers are Falcon XM-XP tie-rod ends. Standard auto oil filter, get them from Supercheap. The starter motor is a Toyota Corolla Nippondenso body with a bespoke nose. The Bing carby is basically a motorcycle part - not car part - used by BMW on their boxer twins. Though, of course, Rotax also use them.. Rod used OTS parts where they were the best choice available and manufactured - via CAMit - the remainder of the engine to optimise weight/performance. He didn't get ALL the bits completely right, which compromised CAMit in their 'upgraded' version to be 'backwards-compatible', but the Jab. engine remains a remarkably successful small-volume production aero-engine in terms of its weight/performance. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Doubt I would want Hyundai to get involved, Toyota yes, oh what a feeling:-):-) Nothing wrong with Hyundai. My choice would be Yamaha, who do a lot of engine development for Toyota anyway (and on some Toyota engines the Yamaha triple piano tuning forks can be found). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guernsey Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Nothing wrong with Hyundai.My choice would be Yamaha, who do a lot of engine development for Toyota anyway (and on some Toyota engines the Yamaha triple piano tuning forks can be found). Thanks for that, I'll make a Note of it. Alan. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Thanks for that, I'll make a Note of it.Alan. ...sounds you two blokes are in accord on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 ...sounds you two blokes are in accord on that. I don't ride in Hondas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Tuncks Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 I ride a Yamaha ag bike on the farm. It is an air-cooled 4 stroke, like the Jab engine, but the airflow over the engine is nowhere near as good. Yet is has shown no overheating problems. And it doesn't run on avgas or need aeroshell oil. Why is this so? And why does it just use normal oil and not need special air-cooled engine oil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now