zodiacpilot Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Amazing the difference 'tween the different industries; AUTOMOTIVE: Manufacturer identifies a fault, works out a fix then does a recall. Fixed free. AIRCRAFT: Manufacturer identifies a fault, works out a 'fix'? then publishes a service bulletin/AD which requires the owner to purchase the parts & fit/have fitted at their own expense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Interesting point; both industries are controlled by the same government department, which has been commonising policies, e.g. certification, which has confused a few here. It might've because the automotive Statutory Warranty hasn't been applied to aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Amazing the difference 'tween the different industries;AUTOMOTIVE: Manufacturer identifies a fault, works out a fix then does a recall. Fixed free. AIRCRAFT: Manufacturer identifies a fault, works out a 'fix'? then publishes a service bulletin/AD which requires the owner to purchase the parts & fit/have fitted at their own expense. Be carful what you wish for, JP. Most car makers sell more units in a day than an aircraft builder does in a year. Applying the same recall standards could put plane builders out of business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 It's still the same proportion though; if an aircraft manufacturer sells only 60 of one type he'll only have to do a recall on 60. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunder Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Even if the Aircraft/engine manufacturer publishes a service bulletin, quite often it is upto the owner to find it. There seems to be a lack of willingness or obligation to contact affected owners as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Even if the Aircraft/engine manufacturer publishes a service bulletin, quite often it is upto the owner to find it.There seems to be a lack of willingness or obligation to contact affected owners as well. Maybe take a look at the definition of Statutory Warranty in the Competition and Consumer Act 2010, there may be some clauses applicable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 This is what came straight to mind when I learned that my brand new still in the box Rotax engine must have it's carb floats replaced with ones that float in petrol before it is put into service. There is general fit for purpose legislation in Australian consumers law and there is no way that floats that absorb fuel are fit for purpose in a float bowl. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 This is what came straight to mind when I learned that my brand new still in the box Rotax engine must have it's carb floats replaced with ones that float in petrol before it is put into service. There is general fit for purpose legislation in Australian consumers law and there is no way that floats that absorb fuel are fit for purpose in a float bowl. Agreed, but they must have originally thought they were OK and have subsequently become aware the floats are faulty. hence the Ad notice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunder Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Despite registering a warranty on a new engine with "Floods"(in a new aircraft), I've never received any emails or information from them. Contact with them was always from me initally. I've had to pay for a subscription to rotax owner to receive service bulletin alerts via email. Does anyone receive alerts straight from Rotax? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 You aren't being overwhelmed by people wanting to produce Aero engines. They are not like ordinary cars. More like a rally car or a low volume replica of something nice . If you wish for all encompassing warrantee that will have to be added to the cost. I don't want to pay for the poor maintenance that some people do . Warrantee on workmanship, materials or defects. I also want to do my own work on a motor. Rod Stiff was pretty good with helping in the early days. Nev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Agreed, but they must have originally thought they were OK and have subsequently become aware the floats are faulty. hence the Ad notice. When Toyota became aware that the passenger airbag in our 2003 corolla was faulty they recalled it. Parts are yet to become available for them to repair it free for the third owner but that is what they plan to do. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red750 Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 What would be the effect on a manufacturer if they became aware of a fault, issued a service bulletin alert without ensuring it was sent to all affected owners, and a person/persons died as a result? If the families sued for lack of duty of care, would that not be likely to cost way more than ensuring advice was properly communicated to all affected owners? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tucano Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 Having a equivalent to the automotive industry would be problematic there is no economy of scale in aviation but in saying that is is a sore point when a defects due to a metallurgical error or tolerance in manufacture is heaped on the owner. The real issue is owner installation and maintenance - try and get a warranty on any commercial product after you do the installation and the maintenance. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDQDI Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 What would be the effect on a manufacturer if they became aware of a fault, issued a service bulletin alert without ensuring it was sent to all affected owners, and a person/persons died as a result? If the families sued for lack of duty of care, would that not be likely to cost way more than ensuring advice was properly communicated to all affected owners? It comes back to the pilot, it is his/her responsibility to ensure that all relevant ad's/sb's are complied with. If it came back to the manufacturer and they had to cover for that all small manufactures would fold up immediately and you would cripple aviation even further than it already is. As far as getting rotax notices go I am fairly slack but Ole and the aak crowd have always let me know of any new sb's that affect me so if you want to add an extra layer get in touch with a reliable rotax service agent and get on their mail list so that they can help keep you up to date. Even if you are perfectly reliable in your checking it never hurts to have a reminder from a second reliable source. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldo Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 I only use a LAME to do my work he ensures all AD's SB's are current and signs off on each one, might cost me a little more but at least I know they are done, how do I know because every time I get a service done he goes and checks for the latest updates with me present. Aldo 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storchy neil Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 yes I do get ads and up dates from rotax ford ranger had problem with tow bar letter from vic roads cancelling rego soon had me in ford dealer to change it neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 The Rotax float problem has absolutely nothing to do with owner installation or owner maintenance. they simply supplied parts that were not fit for purpose, pure and simple. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaba-who Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 While I sympathise with the issue of a carb float that doesn't work the broader issue of warranty on our engines is probably one of " be careful what you ask for". You can bet that should the usual rules of warranty and recall and replacement be demanded and enforced there would instantly be a LAME only rule for maintenance of any sort. And probably include even stuff that is normally allowable under casa allowable pilot maintenance. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 ...and Jab-friendly engineers are getting thin on the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now