jetjr Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Yes and CASA actions limiting certificated engines as well as experimental backs these thoughts up. The fact that no one else around the world implemented their actions shows the level of regard CASA are held. Theres several levels of "certification" Proper Certification is only on one version of 2200 and some versions of other makes, not all of them As Oscar indicated this could be a real issue for owners as the supplier or design of parts cannot be simply swapped. For CTA I think its a "recognised" not certificated engine. Experimental and LSA 3300 Jabs can do CTA I believe - needs exemption from casa but can be done. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabiru7252 Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Soon to be known as "The Unlucky Country" the way things are going with manufacturing. Yes. That's what we get for allowing bullies to drive wages out of all proportion. But, I won't enter into any debate because too many people can't control themselves. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Not for long. The Lawyers are running CASA. You all just criminals who haven't been caught yet. And as far as the bullies driving wages out of all proportion they haven't been very good at it because wages growth is pretty non existent for the last 7 years or so. Some have gone backwards. Everyone want's people to work for them for nothing. (Just like in the USA) and plenty of unpaid overtime reduces the jobs available. Don't like what I pay you,Boy? DCM and forget the reference. NEXT!!..Nev 1 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 wages growth is pretty non existent for the last 7 years or so. You mean from the point 7 years ago where they got absurdly high. Young knuckledraggers doing sweet FA for $2000+ a week was an absurd situation that drove all costs, especially housing, and inflation up, and drove other countries to buy minerals elsewhere, along with driving manufacturing O/S, where did you seriously expect it to go from there? I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but damn it's hard to understand the reasoning behind Gov policies for the last 20+ years, it's like they are doing it on purpose. 3 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Tuncks Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 I have a theory that the generation which knows what it is like to be hungry have all departed the scene in Australia. Now everybody here takes unlimited cheap food so much for granted that all the agricultural campuses are closing. And the elderly farmers often can't afford to pay the minimum wage, so they are struggling alone while the younger people are learning to stay in bed all morning. China is different. Real hunger is not so far distant as to be forgotten. Maybe this explains why the bureaucrats are better there. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Tuncks Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 Jetjr, could you ask the liquidators if they have considered asking for a buyout? How much do they expect to raise by selling things piecemeal? I would really like to know some numbers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabiru7252 Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 I'm only in my early 60's but I sure as hell remember being hungry as a kid, dressed in Salvation Army clothes and being called a pauper by other kids. I guess that's why I studied hard, and took any job I could at any wage. Here I am now with my own plane and hangar, no debts and could quit work tomorrow and still not struggle. (Oh, and to be fair, staying single helps). 3 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 I got hungry too as a kid. I'd keep my lunch money and add it to the money I got selling newspapers and put it towards my model aeroplane fund. Someone would usually give me a banana or soggy tomato sambo that had been stewing in a leather schoolbag in pity. When you are young only what you make at home tastes OK. Anyone else's tastes "funny". Nev 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 How often does the kid who has everything, who never had to do without, who always got the love and care he needed...grow up with fire in his belly, the drive to achieve? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yenn Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Turnbull did! 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coljones Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Turnbull did! Turnbull didn't. Kerry Packer and his father did. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Turnbull did! I believe he grew up motherless. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I believe he grew up motherless. I'm serious. He was abandoned by his mother (enough to scar most of us) but grew up with a strong bond with his father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 That's an uncharacteristicly low blow from you Nev. We should attack his policies, not the man's childhood. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I have no idea what the circumstances were with that matter OK and apart from inferring it's unusual for a mother to abandon or whatever occurred I don't wish to make anything of it. Fathers often walk away or in some countries get killed easily, so it's more "normal" to be without a father. Custody tends to favour the mother also. I would like all our kids to get a fair go as it's a formative time and important for their development. They are usually innocents in the circumstances and the ones who suffer the most when things go wrong. You are correct I have deleted it as it was meant tongue in cheek but a bit pointed. Thanks OK. Nev 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 How often does the kid who has everything, who never had to do without, who always got the love and care he needed...grow up with fire in his belly, the drive to achieve? There's a very large concern in China now about the "4 2 1 generation" coming through, 4 grandparents, 2 parents, 1 child. Many are spoilt rotten, do nothing for themselves and even the useful good natured ones suffer from being in a schoolroom studying from 8 am til 12 pm 7 days a week from 3 years old until their early 20's. They are soon expected to run businesses and Governments with complete naivety about life and how the real world works (the stories i could tell). Many of you have seen these situations where a the kid takes over Dad's business not appreciating the heart and soul, not to mention the hours that have gone into it, and ruins it, well this is about to happen on a massive scale here over the next 10 - 20 years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Attitude is everything (almost). You don't help a kid by giving them everything. The "values " you hold to a great degree dictate how you will approach most things. Just appreciate the things others take for granted and you will gain great peace with no downside. like a warm shower, a beer after a hot dusty day and a campfire with people you enjoy, a tin shed in a storm. Every trip can be a new experience, and you might get a powerful insight from a very young person. Don't lose the curiosity you had as a child. See who you can agree with. Don't seek stuff you don't need. It's only a burden if it's an acquisition you don't really relate to. Hell I don't know where that came from. Nev 5 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaba-who Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 There's a very large concern in China now about the "4 2 1 generation" coming through, 4 grandparents, 2 parents, 1 child. Many are spoilt rotten, do nothing for themselves and even the useful good natured ones suffer from being in a schoolroom studying from 8 am til 12 pm 7 days a week from 3 years old until their early 20's.They are soon expected to run businesses and Governments with complete naivety about life and how the real world works (the stories i could tell). Many of you have seen these situations where a the kid takes over Dad's business not appreciating the heart and soul, not to mention the hours that have gone into it, and ruins it, well this is about to happen on a massive scale here over the next 10 - 20 years. There is well described phenomenon of three generations for family empires/fortunes to be made and lost. First geration makes it with sacrifice and toil. The second generation see the work/effort and heart & soul put into it by their parents. They learn and look after it but don't need to put as much in to maintain it. Third generation comes along and doesn't see any of the sacrifice only the benefits and squanders it. 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 So true Jabs. It seems to be a Law of Human Nature, applying to empires and the common man in similar measure. Clever people insist their kids get some experience of the real world, start at the bottom... I'd love to start a "Bring your Kids to Work for a Day" movement, but the rules would prevent it. Too many kids in our rich country have little idea where the money comes from. Many never actually earn their own income until well out of their teens. I wonder why fewer kids in poor countries are doing drugs- they're probably too damned busy working to eat. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Folks: with all due respect for the importance of ethical and sociological aspects of where this thread has gone: what relevance does it have to the fact of CAMit shutting down? CAMit was Ian Bent, and it had very, very good support from everyone who had dealings with it. I happen to know that Ian's family was 100% supportive and trying to keep it in business; can we just look beyond the 'three degrees of family separation' stuff for the moment? I have already had indications from Jabiru owners that with CAMit gone, they will bail out (financially speaking) from their Jabs. They love the airframe but don't have faith in the new Jab. engine as a future powerplant. I don't have a better rationale for this than they have seen CAMit as the ultimate security for their flying; and I am inclined to share that perspective. I personally won't be looking to Jabiru's Chinese engine as a replacement - I'll rebuild my own Jab/CAMit hybrid as long as I can find reliable parts. 2 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Tuncks Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Oscar, have you looked at a customer buyout as a possibility? My guess is that this is a pipedream, but I would like to be proven wrong. Personally, I would invest a few grand to be part of any action. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjr Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Bruce for all the goodwill in these intentions, it is unlikely to be successful The business size and equipment was simply too big for the small volume of engines being sold Without Jabiru support, seeing as they are going elsewhere, the business model simply has to be different. I'm just living in hope someone revives the design and gets going on a smaller volume basis. Just for the record I proposed the outside funding idea to Ian a couple of years ago and he refused. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Can someone explain to me what it is with this 'caution' tag that appears ocassionally on posts? What exactly is it supposed to mean or imply? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Can someone explain to me what it is with this 'caution' tag that appears ocassionally on posts? What exactly is it supposed to mean or imply? Whilst educating David in the 'caution' tag, can someone also advise if the 'more' designation is a request for additional info on the relative subject, or....?? Tks in anticipation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bexrbetter Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 I personally won't be looking to Jabiru's Chinese engine as a replacement It is entirely the sole responsibility of Jabiru to ensure that a part is sound, and to spec when it gets to a customer's hands, nothing to do with where it came from, as they have well proven. I have already had indications from Jabiru owners that with CAMit gone, they will bail out (financially speaking) from their Jabs. They love the airframe but don't have faith in the new Jab. engine as a future powerplant. Romantic nonsense, I doubt Jab's engine business will even feel a speed bump (once past the current CASA situation), unless a genuine engine competitor shows up on equal footing. While traditionalists hang on for dear life to those "simple, air cooled, direct drive" engines, Jabiru will have a market. Folks: with all due respect for the importance of ethical and sociological aspects of where this thread has gone: what relevance does it have to the fact of CAMit shutting down? What line would you like us to follow, initiate something ..... I thought it had all been covered. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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